This has been tossed around, but I'm giving it a huge buy. We need this current coaching staff to leave an extremely bad taste in the mouth of Byrne and the fans. Since I can't keep up with them and pull against them, it's apathy for me. And I'm not alone judging by that capacity Sunday crowd yesterday.
Buy/Sell....It is in our baseball program's best interest to continue to tank.
- Thread starter DowntownDawg
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This has been tossed around, but I'm giving it a huge buy. We need this current coaching staff to leave an extremely bad taste in the mouth of Byrne and the fans. Since I can't keep up with them and pull against them, it's apathy for me. And I'm not alone judging by that capacity Sunday crowd yesterday.
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Goat Holder
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If they keep losing you'll see more crowds like yesterdays. There is a large contingent that just doesn't believe in Polk or his staff, which should be enough in itself to warrant a house cleaning if this thing keeps going along its current path. Continuing to have a crappy season would definantly work against Raffo. Unfortunately it would also mark a major downspot in MSU baseball and be a source of embarassment for our program. Like I said, I cannot pull against this team, I love State. But I also can't get optimistic about their future nor can I get behind Raffo as a replacement for Polk.
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and it still wasn't terrible. I bet there was close to 6-7K there Saturday. LFL is usually not rocking on Sunday's anyway.
Most of us on this board have never experienced a losing season of MSU baseball. How freaking stupid is Polk to step announce his retirement in the middle of our worst baseball season in probably over 40 years and then give his endorsement of his top assistant to take over the train wreck? If it was LT in charge I would definitely say we need to lose out or Raffo would be the next head coach. However, I think Byrne is smarter than that unless we were to drastically turn it around which ain't happening.</p>
staying on to coach through the end of the season is the best thing. If he announced the day after our last game, I can give you a 100% guarentee that Raffo would have been named interim coach about 5 minutes after Polk's announcement and as I posted Friday: interim = temporary, interim + MSU = it's yours as long as you want it. At least this way, the Byrne or whoever will have at least a couple of months to get a list together.
As far as Polk naming Raffo, I'm hoping thats just a courtesy thing but I doubt it. Polk said he felt that he deserves to name the next coach after all he has done here. I agree with that BUT he's already used that chance when he named Patty Mac. He doesn't deserve the right to do it again.
As far as Polk naming Raffo, I'm hoping thats just a courtesy thing but I doubt it. Polk said he felt that he deserves to name the next coach after all he has done here. I agree with that BUT he's already used that chance when he named Patty Mac. He doesn't deserve the right to do it again.
First, I agree that Sunday is never our biggest crowd of the weekend. But, my point was you'll see more and more crowds like that on Friday and Saturday if things keep going as they are, and that will definantly be noted by the brass.
Secondly, the attendance Saturday is a clear testament to how bad this season is. Even in 2002 we had over 10K for the Saturday SBW game. When was the last time we had under 10K for that game before this year?
Finally, it's not that Byrne needs convincing. I think he's a bright guy that understands our baseball tradition, what we should expect from a head coach or head coaching candidate, and realizes that Raffo shouldn't be his #1 guy. However, there are those out there that do not realize these things. Whike KB21 won't ever admit Polk could be wrong about something, there are those that would be in favor of house cleaning, some potentially of the more powerful persuasion, if they have an overall losing season. It's been a long time since that happened and it would definantly raise eyebrows, particularly one year removed from Omaha and us setting the SR attendance record. Continuing in the same path hurts Raffo.
Secondly, the attendance Saturday is a clear testament to how bad this season is. Even in 2002 we had over 10K for the Saturday SBW game. When was the last time we had under 10K for that game before this year?
Finally, it's not that Byrne needs convincing. I think he's a bright guy that understands our baseball tradition, what we should expect from a head coach or head coaching candidate, and realizes that Raffo shouldn't be his #1 guy. However, there are those out there that do not realize these things. Whike KB21 won't ever admit Polk could be wrong about something, there are those that would be in favor of house cleaning, some potentially of the more powerful persuasion, if they have an overall losing season. It's been a long time since that happened and it would definantly raise eyebrows, particularly one year removed from Omaha and us setting the SR attendance record. Continuing in the same path hurts Raffo.
...if we experienced a miracle turnaround, there would be more fans in Raffo's corner and the administration would be more inclined to as well. If we turn it around enough to make the SEC tournament and a regional somewhere, the sheep would point to injuries and talk about how much better we'd have been if everybody had not gotten hurt.
The reality is, if you want Raffo hired, you pull for this team to turn it around and start winning. If you want somebody else, you don't want there to be any reasons backing up Polk's endorsements.
The reality is, if you want Raffo hired, you pull for this team to turn it around and start winning. If you want somebody else, you don't want there to be any reasons backing up Polk's endorsements.
...it wouldn't necessarily be attributed to Raffo (unless Polk gave him credit for it, which he no doubt would in that situation since he seems to be pulling out all the stops in favor of Tommy), but it would be attributed to the current regime. It's basically a question of continuing on the present path vs. starting over with somebody new. You have alot more incentive to continue along the present path if that path is deemed to be successful. And you have alot more incentive to start over with somebody new if that path is deemed unsuccessful. It's a very simple concept. I'm not surprised you can't grasp it.
....and I believe that the consensus of this board (except for cowbell9) is that Polk's most recent tenure has been an overall failure, and that last year's trip to the CWS was a fluke. If Mississippi State baseball success to you is finishing in the bottom half of the conference and not hosting regionals, then Raffo is your man. If you expect more, then it's unreasonable to think that the top asst. from the previous regime is going to really shake things up and do anything but largely continue along the same path.
The subjectivity of success is the danger here. If everybody agreed that Polk had largely failed in his 2nd go round, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
The subjectivity of success is the danger here. If everybody agreed that Polk had largely failed in his 2nd go round, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
....1) Polk's timing was calculated to help Tommy. If he would've been concerned about what was best for M State, Polk would've announced a couple of weeks before the season to allow Byrne to get his names together. As is, he did technically still on LT's watch (which greatly favors Raffo), and doing it this early puts only one candidate that can actually interview for the job in front of the AD: Raffo. Cohen or any other coach, head or asst., that is with any program but Mississippi State will refuse to discuss this until after the season is over. In Polk's mind, the athletic department should just go ahead and announce it's going to be Raffo so the baseball camps go on without a hitch, etc.
....2) It's more than a courtesy to Polk, otherwise, he wouldn't have done it publicly. And he DEFINITELY does not deserve to do it again. He already named his replacement last time, got the stadium named after him, etc. What an egomaniac to think he deserves to name a replacement twice.
....2) It's more than a courtesy to Polk, otherwise, he wouldn't have done it publicly. And he DEFINITELY does not deserve to do it again. He already named his replacement last time, got the stadium named after him, etc. What an egomaniac to think he deserves to name a replacement twice.
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Goat Holder
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to lose your way to a new and better coach? If we go on a run and get to Omaha, ****, then I WANT Raffo as our coach.
Don't bother with the damage that is done while you're losing. All you can think about is that new coach, who will have to take just as much time to rebuild what was torn down while the losing was going on. And that's only if you hire a good coach.
You're flat out wrong on this one, pal. And anyone who thinks like you is a damned idiot. I went through this during football season in '06. I wanted to lose so Croom would be fired. I was an idiot, and learned my lesson.
Don't bother with the damage that is done while you're losing. All you can think about is that new coach, who will have to take just as much time to rebuild what was torn down while the losing was going on. And that's only if you hire a good coach.
You're flat out wrong on this one, pal. And anyone who thinks like you is a damned idiot. I went through this during football season in '06. I wanted to lose so Croom would be fired. I was an idiot, and learned my lesson.
...and getting to Omaha again would be the exception. Or hell, even hosting a regional. What I am saying is that turning it around enough to get the 3 seed at Cal State Fullerton is not going to help our baseball program, because there are plenty out there who think that making a regional is good enough, that that equals "success." And so if we can't host/get to Omaha, I'd rather miss the tournament entirely, to make it clear that we need new direction.
And since there is virtually no damn way either one of those is going to happen, we need to not make the tournament this year. And that's not idiotic. There would be plenty on GP, and I daresay some in the Bryan building that would say that IF we had been healthy, and IF Easley and Moreland hadn't left, we'd have been back in Omaha again, and they would use that to justify a promotion from within.
And any coach worth his salt knows we are a top 25 job, regardless of what happens in this crazy *** season. We are, after all, only 1 year removed from breaking the super regional attendance record.
And since there is virtually no damn way either one of those is going to happen, we need to not make the tournament this year. And that's not idiotic. There would be plenty on GP, and I daresay some in the Bryan building that would say that IF we had been healthy, and IF Easley and Moreland hadn't left, we'd have been back in Omaha again, and they would use that to justify a promotion from within.
And any coach worth his salt knows we are a top 25 job, regardless of what happens in this crazy *** season. We are, after all, only 1 year removed from breaking the super regional attendance record.
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Goat Holder
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I understand what you're saying and why.
One, in my experience every time you get to that point of wanting to lose to justify change, then change in bound to happen one way or the other. Jackie in '03. I wanted him to lose. We couldn't get rid of him fast enough. Little did I know that was already in the works. Then the Croom example. Turns out he knew what he was doing.
Two, getting into the Fullerton wherever regional as a 3 seed is EXACTLY THE FAILURE that we've all been getting so frustrated with these past few years. It's not like we haven't been getting to regionals, so it doesn't matter anyway. KB21 is in the extreme minority. Most of our fans want Polk gone, I guarantee. Problem was we couldn't fire him. So to lose made no sense. And it makes no sense now, because the best we can do is sneak into a regional. </p>
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One, in my experience every time you get to that point of wanting to lose to justify change, then change in bound to happen one way or the other. Jackie in '03. I wanted him to lose. We couldn't get rid of him fast enough. Little did I know that was already in the works. Then the Croom example. Turns out he knew what he was doing.
Two, getting into the Fullerton wherever regional as a 3 seed is EXACTLY THE FAILURE that we've all been getting so frustrated with these past few years. It's not like we haven't been getting to regionals, so it doesn't matter anyway. KB21 is in the extreme minority. Most of our fans want Polk gone, I guarantee. Problem was we couldn't fire him. So to lose made no sense. And it makes no sense now, because the best we can do is sneak into a regional. </p>
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a good thing. In NO way will continued losing have a hand in who the new HC will be. In NO way will a turn around have a hand in who the new HC will be. You are an absolute friggin dumbass if you think differently. (unless you are Drebin, then losing is good in the long road). It is absolutley reeeetarded to think that losing will help one coach be/not be the next HC. Subjectively, objectively or idiojectively....dont MATTER Dr. Hawkin.
Since we started winning last year I've been extremely optimistic, even going so far as to defend Croom a lot on here. But that optimism is being literally sucked out of me now. If the rumor about 3 more being gone is true, I cannot see how we will have a bowl season this year, and with all we will lose after this season the next year isn't looking great either. I really don't want to be negative here, as I'm still basking in the glory of finally getting back to and winning a bowl game, but it is extremely hard given the way things are going.
...because you've got Polk publicly screwing this up. When Jackie was fired/resigned, you didn't see him publicly endorsing Sparky Woods or whoever to be head coach. If he had, we would've been in the same boat. We'd all want whatever on the field results guaranteed that Sparky wouldn't be our next HC, and there would've been a few drones out there that would've been ready to do what Jackie said.
And I have no idea about what percentage of MSU fans are adamantly opposed to Raffo like we are. But all it takes is a few in key positions and you're screwed.
I do know this, to be the "People's University," the people don't get much input. I haven't talked to anyone who doesn't want Mark Keenum, and I haven't talked to anyone who wants Tommy Raffo, and it looks like that may very well be the reality that we face on both counts.
And I have no idea about what percentage of MSU fans are adamantly opposed to Raffo like we are. But all it takes is a few in key positions and you're screwed.
I do know this, to be the "People's University," the people don't get much input. I haven't talked to anyone who doesn't want Mark Keenum, and I haven't talked to anyone who wants Tommy Raffo, and it looks like that may very well be the reality that we face on both counts.
on raffo by any means, but if polks hands him the reins for the rest of the year to try to prove that he (raffo) can coach, and raffo turns it around and we have a pretty successful year (with all the injuries and what not, say make a super regional) would that not make some think that maybe he (raffo) CAN coach? in my mind it would at least raise the question.
After reading what happened during the first of the UGA games with the standing o from the away team, I think Polk is looking forward to all the attention and praise he will get from his rivals of the past. I think this played into the timing of his resignation. Basically a season long victory lap. Big ego booster. Problem is, it will be a looser lap w/ us dropping 2 of 3 SEC games every weekend at best. This could very well ruin the other half of his self inflicted ego stroking by putting a bad taste in everyone's mouth concering his named heir apparent Tommy.
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Goat Holder
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and unwillingness to admit that he cannot control things like he used to. Polk is going down the same losing path Sherrill did, although not to the extent. If he'd stayed for next year or the year after? We might see REALLY embarrassing results on the baseball field.
Yes, Polk built MSU baseball. Whether or not he should get a say so is anyone's opinion. Just so happens that most people think Polk's opinion is wrong on this one. No one would care if Polk wanted to name Cohen or Smith his successor. Everyone would be rolling out the red carpet for that.
I just don't see how someone who used to be as great as he was can be so clueless. LT too.
Yes, Polk built MSU baseball. Whether or not he should get a say so is anyone's opinion. Just so happens that most people think Polk's opinion is wrong on this one. No one would care if Polk wanted to name Cohen or Smith his successor. Everyone would be rolling out the red carpet for that.
I just don't see how someone who used to be as great as he was can be so clueless. LT too.
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