Head-to-head vs overall body of work

[18IsTheMan]

When it comes to CFP selection, I’m not sure I understand why the head-to-head is the be-all end-all. Yes. Bama beat us fair and square. At home. By 2 points when they were favored by 25.

Outside of that, they lost to two teams we absolutely hammered, and hammered them both on the road. They have 3 wins over ranked teams, same as us. We have no losses to teams that were unranked, while they have 2 very ugly losses to unranked teams in games where they were overwhelming favorites.

I know we aren’t getting in, and I’m ok with that, but it seems far too simplistic to say they should get in over us just because they beat us.

I also think you just have to look at the intangibles, like who’s playing better down the stretch, who is the more exciting team, and which team just feels like a playoff team. This is the problem with expansion to 12 teams: it gets much harder to differentiate. It’s been pretty clear for the most part who the top four teams have been in the previous playoffs. When you get down to trying to differentiate between three loss teams the water is much muddier.

 

[Fried Chicken]

If the situation was flipped we’d be all about the head to head. That has to matter. I’ll never understand not considering the head to head when picking teams. Sometimes it’s impossible, at least more complicated in basketball wil so many games. But the reality is what absolutely kills us in the conversation right now is the 2 teams we need to jump…we lost to them both. One by multiple scores at home. That absolutely should matter…even though I hate it.

 

[Lurker123]

This. They did a quick comparison during another game.

Bama beat us in head to head, SOS, and had their best win vs UGA, where our best win in Clemson. (By ranking)

 

[18IsTheMan]

If the situation was flipped we’d be all about the head to head. That has to matter. I’ll never understand not considering the head to head when picking teams. Sometimes it’s impossible, at least more complicated in basketball wil so many games. But the reality is what absolutely kills us in the conversation right now is the 2 teams we need to jump…we lost to them both. One by multiple scores at home. That absolutely should matter…even though I hate it.

It just seems overly simplistic to look at that to the exclusion of everything else. Of course it should be a factor, but I can’t see any reason why it should be the ultimate factor.

 

[I4CtheFuture]

When it comes to CFP selection, I’m not sure I understand why the head-to-head is the be-all end-all. Yes. Bama beat us fair and square. At home. By 2 points when they were favored by 25.

Outside of that, they lost to two teams we absolutely hammered, and hammered them both on the road. They have 3 wins over ranked teams, same as us. We have no losses to teams that were unranked, while they have 2 very ugly losses to unranked teams in games where they were overwhelming favorites.

I know we aren’t getting in, and I’m ok with that, but it seems far too simplistic to say they should get in over us just because they beat us.

Since this is the 1st season of the 12 team playoff - I'm already seeing problems. Whether it's head to head stuff or lack of strength of schedule for some teams or this or that...... it seems to me the whole thing was designed to make sure the big names get in no matter what.... leaving some deserving teams out in favor of said big names.

How do you fix it? Expand to 16 teams but then that creates a math problem because AS IT STANDS - if you make it to the Final game, you will have played 16 games which should be the max, IMHO.....(probably already too many for college kids anyway)

How do you fix the math problem? Simple really. Cut the conference games from 9 to 7, and eliminate ONE of the OOC games. Make it a 9 game schedule across the whole land.... (but wait, hear me out) .... + 1 for Conference Championship, (10 games), +1 for bowl game (11 games) and THEN whoever makes the playoffs.....+ however many games that would be extra.

This would make the regular season more meaningful, IMHO, and also reduce the # of "6 win" teams that go to meaningless bowls because 1/2 those players sit out anyway...... something has to give somewhere, this math, maths. Shrugs.

 

[18IsTheMan]

This. They did a quick comparison during another game.

Bama beat us in head to head, SOS, and had their best win vs UGA, where our best win in Clemson. (By ranking)

But then I throw to you Alabama losing to two unranked teams who we absolutely destroyed.

 

[Fried Chicken]

It just seems overly simplistic to look at that to the exclusion of everything else. Of course it should be a factor, but I can’t see any reason why it should be the ultimate factor.

Ok, I agree it shouldn’t be the ultimate factor. But it has to carry some weight. And in this particular case, if it were ONE team, I could see it. But two teams? That’s going to be hard to pull off, especially when one is the most dominant program over the past 15 years. If this were any other team, we’d probably know for certain Alabama was getting that final spot.

 

[Fried Chicken]

Since this is the 1st season of the 12 team playoff - I'm already seeing problems. Whether it's head to head stuff or lack of strength of schedule for some teams or this or that...... it seems to me the whole thing was designed to make sure the big names get in no matter what.... leaving some deserving teams out in favor of said big names.

How do you fix it? Expand to 16 teams but then that creates a math problem because AS IT STANDS - if you make it to the Final game, you will have played 16 games which should be the max, IMHO.....(probably already too many for college kids anyway)

How do you fix the math problem? Simple really. Cut the conference games from 9 to 7, and eliminate ONE of the OOC games. Make it a 9 game schedule across the whole land.... (but wait, hear me out) .... + 1 for Conference Championship, (10 games), +1 for bowl game (11 games) and THEN whoever makes the playoffs.....+ however many games that would be extra.

This would make the regular season more meaningful, IMHO, and also reduce the # of "6 win" teams that go to meaningless bowls because 1/2 those players sit out anyway...... something has to give somewhere, this math, maths. Shrugs.

We can argue about fixing it all we want. Here is the bottom line…DONT LOSE 3 GAMES! When you do that, you subject yourself to the committee’s preferences. We were given 2 screwups. 3 losses, it’s hard to complain. And yes, I know we got screwed against LSU. But the Ole Miss game was inexcusable and we choked during the Bama game. Can’t overlook all of that.

If you want to make the playoff, don’t put it in the committee’s hands. We did. We have a good argument. But there are good arguments against us as well.

 

[Lurker123]

But then I throw to you Alabama losing to two unranked teams who we absolutely destroyed.

Don't disagree. Do you think that outweighs the other factors?

 

[I4CtheFuture]

We can argue about fixing it all we want. Here is the bottom line…DONT LOSE 3 GAMES! When you do that, you subject yourself to the committee’s preferences. We were given 2 screwups. 3 losses, it’s hard to complain. And yes, I know we got screwed against LSU. But the Ole Miss game was inexcusable and we choked during the Bama game. Can’t overlook all of that.

If you want to make the playoff, don’t put it in the committee’s hands. We did. We have a good argument. But there are good arguments against us as well.

Oh I totally agree with you. - But I think you're looking at it as if I am talking solely about the Gamecocks....... I am not.

I love college football and want to see all deserving teams make it - regardless of the year. If that's not us, cool, but my main gripe right now is that it once again seems to be all the "big name" schools in + a handful of other teams - and out of that handful of other teams, 1/2 of them don't have the strength of schedule deserving to be in....... ie: that got win after win against literally nobodies.

My post didn't really have anything to do with us, per se'.

 

[I4CtheFuture]

Don't disagree. Do you think that outweighs the other factors?

I don't know but here's my problem if I'm on the committee AND CLEMSON WINS the ACC......

How do you put Clem in, and leave us out when we just beat them? The whole "automatic bid" thing sucks and is flawed, IMHO. And yes, this post I am talking about us in particular.

 

[Uscg1984]

One thing working in our favor: We are trending heavily with national commentators. I've watched a lot of halftime shows today on CBS, Fox, and ABC/ESPN and _all_ of the shows have had commentators remark that if the playoff committee is interested in picking the 12 best teams, we are probably playing better than just about anyone right now. That's a positive development considering the committee is made up of humans.

 

[Fried Chicken]

w

Oh I totally agree with you. - But I think you're looking at it as if I am talking solely about the Gamecocks....... I am not.

I love college football and want to see all deserving teams make it - regardless of the year. If that's not us, cool, but my main gripe right now is that it once again seems to be all the "big name" schools in + a handful of other teams - and out of that handful of other teams, 1/2 of them don't have the strength of schedule deserving to be in....... ie: that got win after win against literally nobodies.

My post didn't really have anything to do with us, per se'.

Fair enough. Perhaps the most glaring flaw would be a 9-3 Clemson team receiving an automatic bid (plus 1st round bye) after defeating no ranked teams and losing their last regular season game. Of course they’d have a top 10 win for that to happen by beating SMU…but to even be in that position??? Clemson should’ve been eliminated today and everyone knows it.

 

[I4CtheFuture]

w

Fair enough. Perhaps the most glaring flaw would be a 9-3 Clemson team receiving an automatic bid (plus 1st round bye) after defeating no ranked teams and losing their last regular season game. Of course they’d have a top 10 win for that to happen by beating SMU…but to even be in that position??? Clemson should’ve been eliminated today and everyone knows it.

Maybe they could make a "back your way in" rule: - If ANY TEAM, in ANY CONFERENCE has to count on other teams losing just to make it to the Conference Championship game and they WIN that conference champion game - they lose the automatic bid and the 1st round bye.....but they'd still be in, more times than not, probably..... hey, I'm trying here..... I want it better for everyone.

Because in your example of Clemmons - if they win, they get the auto bid and 1st round bye - while leaving out the hottest team in the country that just beat them the week before. That's complete BS. The "back your way in" rule would nullify that, somewhat.....and give the committee more options.

 

[SouthernBelly]

On field results simply have to matter the most. Otherwise the season loses purpose and it’s a method for removing subjectivity.

Bama has a better resume with the biggest factor being they beat the Gamecocks. If you go with a body of work argument in favor of the Gamecocks you say that game doesn’t matter.

There’s a better argument to jump Ole Miss based on a body of work as all of their losses were bad. But they still flattened the Gamecocks in Columbia while SC was coming off a bye. So I just don’t see the argument. They should not have lost to UK or Florida…by the same token you can say SC should have beat Bama or been more competitive against OM. But that gets into speculation which is just not as reliable as a real outcome.

 

[Evilchicken]

SOS should hold so much more extra weight! It’s one of the few things that demonstrates the real differences between a cupcake 11-1 team, and a gritty 9-3 team. A team’s record is no measure when factoring in the SOS. Teams should be rewarded for playing a tough schedule.

 

[SouthernBelly]

I don't know but here's my problem if I'm on the committee AND CLEMSON WINS the ACC......

How do you put Clem in, and leave us out when we just beat them? The whole "automatic bid" thing sucks and is flawed, IMHO. And yes, this post I am talking about us in particular.

Because you’re interjecting logic and auto bids are illogical.

 

[Fried Chicken]

Because you’re interjecting logic and auto bids are illogical.

Yes, I think the automatic bids will disappear soon. Definitely screwing up the system.