I’m trending from “disappointed” to “apathetic”
- Thread starter PhredPhantom
- Start date
You either want to be a championship program or you don't. We invest more into this sport than anyone in the country. Did any other 18-14 team have nearly 15k there to watch? Half our problem is you get accused of trolling when you speak your frustrations. Are some over the top? Of course. But at the same time we have people who will give every coach on this staff a lifetime contract based on last year. The place to be has to be somewhere in the middle. I'm sure some will say I'm over the top with being sick of Gautreau. And that's ok. The results of developing veteran hitters not counting Tanner Allen and Jake Mangum keep speaking for themselves. Those 2 were built different from birth.
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No, we don’t invest more than anyone else. The program that actually invests more than anyone else and has more built in advantages than anyone else is the one we are playing this weekend. And they haven’t even been to Omaha since 2017, or won it all since 2009. Nobody is immune from down years or down stretches in college baseball. LSU’s history over recent years and the fact that Coastal Carolina and Fresno State have titles ought to prove that you cannot simply buy success.
And regarding Gautreau, the list of hitters that has gotten substantially better over their career has already been provided to you, and its a 17ing mile long. And even guys like TA and Mangum actually weren’t “different at birth”, they were only 3rd / 4th round draft picks even as 22-23 year olds, which means MLB certainly thought quite a few guys had higher ceilings than both of them. You’re being pretty obtuse in stating that no one has improved under him.
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I’m talking the current roster. Who’s made significant strides since last year? You say Kam James, Tanner, Hancock. All were good last year and are about the same this year when you look at league only play. Averages are up some and I’ll give them that. Though in early April, most averages should be up when you factor in the cupcakes in non conference. Cumbest still has no clue in league games unless he’s thrown a fastball. And if you don’t think leaders are born and not made, I’m not sure what to tell you. Those two were built different and would have succeeded in anything they wanted no matter who the coach was. Hell they did it under 3 different head coaches. 4 for Mangum actually.
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Yes, all those guys have made strides in OPS. And you don’t get to only look at the current roster when evaluating a coach….that’s not at all how it works. That’s like saying “how many national championships has Lemonis won in 2022?” Gautreau has been here 6 seasons now, and his track record of literally every hitter he coached improving from the first season to the last speaks for itself. Our main problem this year is timely hitting. We have not been good all year with runners in scoring position. You look at all our main guy’s numbers and they are mostly fine. Issues with clutch hitting have to be solved by the players. They have to stop pressing. Example - with a guy on 3rd, two outs, and us down a run late on Saturday, Hancock whiffed on a pitch that would have hit him in the hands if he didn’t swing at it. That **** ain’t on the coaches. Friday night - 2 runs on 10 hits. That **** ain’t on the coaches either.
And spare me the leadership BS about Mangum and TA. Yes, both were great leaders. But just because you’re a great leader doesn’t mean you can just mash the ball at will. Logan Tanner took a ball off the twig and berries last Sunday against Arkansas to save the game for us. That’s a great leader, and Tanner’s a great player. But he’s never going to hit like those two guys. The two things are not at all connected.
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Let me preface this by saying that I don’t want anyone fired, I’m not going to call out individual players, and I am not one that thinks a program like MSU baseball should be immune to a down year. I actually think that I was a little more skeptical than some heading into the year because while we clearly had plenty of talent returning, we were also going to be making some major changes on our chessboard. Starting rotation, closer, lead off man… it was substantial even before getting into the injuries
With that said, I really do struggle with the thought of feasibly missing the entire postseason just one season removed from a title. I’m sure we wouldn’t be the first, but man… that really is a tough pill to swallow, and it’s tough to not feel like this should have been avoidable. I don’t know, the seasons not over and I won’t be calling for any heads a year after a championship, but Lemonis has his work cut out for him and it needs to get fixed beginning in ‘23
With that said, I really do struggle with the thought of feasibly missing the entire postseason just one season removed from a title. I’m sure we wouldn’t be the first, but man… that really is a tough pill to swallow, and it’s tough to not feel like this should have been avoidable. I don’t know, the seasons not over and I won’t be calling for any heads a year after a championship, but Lemonis has his work cut out for him and it needs to get fixed beginning in ‘23
Lemonis is safe and for the foreseable future. Would be crazy to think otherwise. He knows he has it made here and will make the hard decisions if it comes to it. We're 13th in the league in hitting. 13th in the league in pitching. That's unacceptable. To date, we've got an rpi of 91 and a sos of 60, which leaped considerably after LSU. So it's not like we're in situation where our schedule has dictated these results. I don't know what the problem is but to suck this bad in all areas besides fielding should be alarming even to the most enthusiastic of sunshine pumpers. And it goes past "they're trying too hard". That stuff made sense after losing the first series to Long Beach. It doesn't anymore. Losing Sims and Stone Simmons hurt no doubt. I'll give Foxhall a big time pass for that. I don't understand however guys like Fristoe still being a head case and guys like Tullar and Sninnett making no progress in the last year. Despite getting chance after chance. I certainly don't understand bringing Walling in and someone smarter than me can feel free to jump in with the scoop if there is any. My biggest fear is next year could easily end up on a similar path if we don't hit the portal like nobody's business. Personally I hope we turn this thing around and make a run because Mississippi State baseball belongs in regionals but a trip to A&M then Tennessee to finish the year will pretty much seal our fate.
Operationally, that may be true, but (at least to my knowledge) no other university in the country built a $70 Million cathedral devoted solely to college baseball.
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You touched on the one thing that has me most concerned right now. A down year in ‘22? Fine… but who exactly are we counting on to turn this ship around in ‘23? Most of the guys that we’d normally be counting on to take big strides next year are struggling to put it mildly.
It’s starting to feel like this roster is going to need a rebuild like none of us could have ever imagined, and hopefully the portal will make that process easier than it would’ve been in years past
It’s starting to feel like this roster is going to need a rebuild like none of us could have ever imagined, and hopefully the portal will make that process easier than it would’ve been in years past
Depends on what you mean by "the foreseeable future." One thing Cohen has shown is that he's not afraid to fire a coach. We're 4-8 right now. I don't think this is going to happen, but let's just say we go 10-20 and then follow that up with single digit SEC wins next year. I bet that would be enough for Cohen to pull the trigger. No coach these days is more than about 2 years from the hook. Even Nick Saban wouldn't survive back-to-back 5-7 seasons.
Winning the school's first national title carries alot of weight. Doesn't mean he's immune though if things continue south the next 2 years and he refuses to make staff changes ala Croom. I don't think Lemonis is that crazy though.
I went back and looked at champions since 2000 and found the following teams that didn't make the tournament after winning the championship in the previous year:
2008 Oregon State didn't make the tournament after winning back to back in 2006 & 2007
2013 Arizona
2014 UCLA
2017 Coastal Carolina
I did that manually, so I may have overlooked somebody. Anyway, it's rare (4 out of 21) but it can happen.
2008 Oregon State didn't make the tournament after winning back to back in 2006 & 2007
2013 Arizona
2014 UCLA
2017 Coastal Carolina
I did that manually, so I may have overlooked somebody. Anyway, it's rare (4 out of 21) but it can happen.
I'm not concerned with Lemonis at this point. But I want to see what kind of talent and changes are made going forward. We badly need to bring in talent and stop chasing ****** transfers.
You folks need to keep calm. We went to the CWS three years in a row and won it all with The Covid shutdown in the middle of this all including our recruitment and evaluation. The players were shut down as well so we probably had to do some guess work with players evaluations and disruption development of the players we already had.
We have a large group of mentally diminished people not entering this wildcard into their computations. No one knows what effect the stops and start had or time away from the usual daily workouts.
Why are you guys ignoring the possible effects on recruitment and the players you already have?
We have a large group of mentally diminished people not entering this wildcard into their computations. No one knows what effect the stops and start had or time away from the usual daily workouts.
Why are you guys ignoring the possible effects on recruitment and the players you already have?
I don't think its being ignored but everyone has had to deal with the same issues.
Our streak of success is also being ignored by many attention seeking chuds.
"If we're a blue-blood program, we should reload, not rebuild!" Well, yeah, we did. We reloaded and reloaded and reloaded. This year we finally rebuild. Unless you're Alabama football, that's how it works.
"If we're a blue-blood program, we should reload, not rebuild!" Well, yeah, we did. We reloaded and reloaded and reloaded. This year we finally rebuild. Unless you're Alabama football, that's how it works.
Yeah but we're acting like we're not like everybody else. That we can't have a bad year that we can't have been affected differently than everybody else by the same circumstances it's ridiculous
I could tell as early as July or August that some people were setting themselves up for disappointment this year. The reaction to us winning it all was such that some people acted like we were now the equivalent of Alabama football. Which is not something that even exists in college baseball.
Covid had nothing to do with failing to bring in talent. It didn't hurt TN. Didn't hurt AR. This idea that it's "our" problem is wrong. Failing to recruit a legitimate SS, CF, and starting pitching the last few years is a bigger issue. Trying to fill holes in recruiting with bad transfers is an issue. Failing to develop arms is an issue. And I blame a little on the coaching turnover we had. We should be a regional team at worst. I doubt many expected a CWS run. This team never came together and injuries are showing our recruiting shortcomings.
Did Tennessee go through Covid shutdowns or just us? Tennessee seems to be doing okay.
So coaches should only be judged on the year after a national championship?
Y’all are some dumb son of a b*tchez
Y’all are some dumb son of a b*tchez
Ok so let's move ahead to next year. Who plays short? Forsythe? Who plays 2nd?
Meche? Who plays center? Who's the catcher? More importantly, who in the world is going to pitch? Preston Johnson has worked himself into a decently high draft stock. You've still got Cade Smith, Auger, and Pico who have been reliable but that's it. Simmons back next year helps but starting pitching will be a head scratcher. Hunt's got a big time arm and will factor in but then again, he's also draft eligible. Fristoe just needs a shrink but after Cerantola and Walling, I'm not getting my hopes up. We're redshirting 2 pitchers plus Walker is a freshman but seeing as how they haven't gotten playing time on a staff like this doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies. I'm not saying dial 911 but you've got to admit this roster is going to be pretty skimpy barring mass portal transfers. I think there's concern among many about the evaluations of a few positions and whether or not it's playing a factor in the team's success this year. I will say Yeager has shown that this staff is capable of finding contributors. Sucks we only have him for a year. Just need more just like him.
Meche? Who plays center? Who's the catcher? More importantly, who in the world is going to pitch? Preston Johnson has worked himself into a decently high draft stock. You've still got Cade Smith, Auger, and Pico who have been reliable but that's it. Simmons back next year helps but starting pitching will be a head scratcher. Hunt's got a big time arm and will factor in but then again, he's also draft eligible. Fristoe just needs a shrink but after Cerantola and Walling, I'm not getting my hopes up. We're redshirting 2 pitchers plus Walker is a freshman but seeing as how they haven't gotten playing time on a staff like this doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies. I'm not saying dial 911 but you've got to admit this roster is going to be pretty skimpy barring mass portal transfers. I think there's concern among many about the evaluations of a few positions and whether or not it's playing a factor in the team's success this year. I will say Yeager has shown that this staff is capable of finding contributors. Sucks we only have him for a year. Just need more just like him.
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All good questions. This season has had its share of losses from last season, losses due to inuries, and players who need to develop. That's quite a bit to overcome for any team. My point is that just the program is not in danger of losing its naitional prominence and relevance -- despite having a bad season.
Historically, we have had down seasons the year after deep post-season runs and we have recovered. I don't see this changing.
Historically, we have had down seasons the year after deep post-season runs and we have recovered. I don't see this changing.
I agree with this, but I'll be very interested to see if the administration has constitution to do this. This is where we have a dubious track record.
From 2019...
https://www.diycollegerankings.com/...the list with,lowest average of just $176,668.
- LSU-$5,796,848
- Vanderbilt University-$5,360,448
- Texas Christian University-$5,107,221
- University of Mississippi-$5,022,676
- The University of Texas at Austin -$4,673,763
- Florida State University-$4,648,873
- University of South Carolina-$4,513,115
- Texas A & M University-$4,100,980
- University of Arkansas-$4,036,687
- University of Florida-$4,035,535
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Right... one team's success just completely invalidates my opinion got it. Please feel free to continue to *****.
Lot's of teams across the country playing way better than us and they went through Covid too, not just TN, quit making excuses
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