I'm hearing Showalter is the frontrunner............

[AceLeroy]

Tried to post this last night , but it never showed on the board.

Anyway , the rumor is that Showalter has contacted Byrne and wants the job and that money is not a big issue.

It makes sense to me. It would be the MSU way to hire Buck if he were the easiest to pay. He doesn't come with the buyout that Cohen does.

 

[AceLeroy]

Tried to post this last night , but it never showed on the board.

Anyway , the rumor is that Showalter has contacted Byrne and wants the job and that money is not a big issue.

It makes sense to me. It would be the MSU way to hire Buck if he were the easiest to pay. He doesn't come with the buyout that Cohen does.

 

[AceLeroy]

Tried to post this last night , but it never showed on the board.

Anyway , the rumor is that Showalter has contacted Byrne and wants the job and that money is not a big issue.

It makes sense to me. It would be the MSU way to hire Buck if he were the easiest to pay. He doesn't come with the buyout that Cohen does.

 

[Todd4State]

We really don't need to go cheap on this hire, whoever it is. We're probably going to get what we pay for.

I would prefer Cohen over Showalter because he would be the safer pick of the two.

 

[AceLeroy]

We really don't need to go cheap on this hire, whoever it is. We're probably going to get what we pay for.

I would prefer Cohen over Showalter because he would be the safer pick of the two.

When I said it made sense to me , I meant it wouldn't surprise me if it happened.
</p>
Like you , I prefer Cohen over Showalter.

 

[State82]

mistake. He has no experience in running a college program. Even Raffo has more insight in the daily workings of a major D1 program than Buck. That being said, I would rather have Showalter than Raffo, but either would be a mistake, I believe.

 

[HammerOfTheDogs]

Positives: Prestige, can develop young players, MSU connection for the 90+ Y. O. crowd too afraid of Dan McDonnell;

Negatives: May bolt for the Majors at a minute's notice, has never recruited.

 

[State82]

[No message]

 

[coursesuper]

he said that he has been contacted though, and he would love to have the job. But the espn gig is a road block.

 

[TR.sixpack]

Has appeared on Seinfeld.

 

[Paper Dog]

Second, if it does......it would be an aboslutely horrible mistake

 

[Vandelaydawg]

we have a handful of candidates that have put their name in the hat that would all be outstanding hires. If you heard Buck is the front runner your source is mistaken. He may very well get the job, but he is not the front runner at this point.</p>

 

[dawgatUSM]

Just to play devils advocate... Buck Showalter has one of the better eyes for baseball talent out there, and because of that, it could have the potential to be a good hire. On top of that, the daily activities and recruiting tactics of coaches are usually covered in interviews. So, if he is called for an interview, I'm sure if he lacks in this area, Byrne will not make the hire. So, I have to trust we'll make ther ight decision...

Note: Showalter would be be about 4th on my list behind Casey (longshot), Cohen, and Steve Smith.

 

[jwbigcreek]

you mention?

 

[lawdawg02]

i think he would make an interesting hire. while there would surely be a recruiting learning curve, i don't think it would take him that long to get on track, especially given his name recognition in the world of baseball. i think he would be a bit more credible from the get-go when he says "i know what it takes to get to the big leagues" than, say for instance, a running backs coach from green bay.

don't get me wrong, i think i'd rather have cohen and maybe one or two others (not raffo), but we CERTAINLY could do much worse than showalter. especially if it's something he WANTS to do. it could be interesting. (i also know that for every pete carroll there's a jerry glanville, or whoever.)

 

[Todd4State]

College baseball/MLB is apples and oranges.

There have been several MLB players and coaches that have returned to college and almost all have been failures. The most successful one that I can recall is Don Kessinger at Ole Miss. That should tell you something. Southern Cal has Chad Krueter- best known for fighting Cubs fans in the front row of Wrigley Field in the visiting bullpen while with the Dodgers- and he has not been successful there. Tony Gwynn, who everyone thought would turn San Diego State into a powerhouse, has also had mixed success.

If Showalter comes in, he better hire a pitching coach and a hitting coach that can recruit. I don't doubt his eye for talent, but can he get the talent to come to MSU?
</p>
The problem with the name recognition thing is that most ex-Big Leaguers think that their credentials will recruit for them, but you have to kiss their *** to get them to come, because Bianco (the chief guy we will be recruiting against) has shown that he can get players to the Big Leagues even though he never played in the Big Leagues. I think Polk fell into the trap of his "legendary credentials" being able to recruit for him, and you see where that has us.

 

[state20006]

if we can get a two time AL manager of the year i'm all for it. the guy can flat out coach. and with a big name like his, recruiting is not going to be as hard for him as it would cohen. i'm not saying we wouldn't get recruits with cohen, i think we definetly would, but i feel with a name like showalter big name kids would be interested in playing for him because he such huge mlb ties regardless of what they know about the school. my personal preference is showalter but picking between the two is like asking me whether i want my bj given by jessica simpson or marisa miller.

 

[patdog]

Neither of them ever managed a game in the big leagues. The only one that really fits a little is Kessinger. And I think he was an underrated college baseball coach. He took over the worst program in the conference at the time. That program had been dead for a decade. He's the one who showed that you could still win at Mississippi even after MSU baseball had taken off and buried them in the 80s. But really even he was never a full-time MLB manager. He was a player-manger for the White Sox for less than a season (and really at that time you could hardly consider the White Sox to be a major league team). The truth is, there's never been a successful MLB manager who's then gone on to coach college baseball. I'm not sold on Showalter, but I don't see any precedents out there that show he couldn't get the job done. I do know he can evaluate talent and can teach the game (two things that have been very much missing from MSU baseball lately).

Interesting fact I picked up from watching I Love the 70s and reading Kessinger's Wikipedia page on the same night. Kessinger was the White Sox manager when the Disco Demolition promotion got out of hand between games of a doubleheader and caused the second game to be cancelled.

 

[Notch Johnson dawg]

you honestly think high school kids 17 and under know or care who Buck is? I highly doubt it. Here we go again trying to recruit with a "name" (POLK lately) and not someone who will work his butt off getting in with these kids and knowing what is going on from the getgo.

I know the blue-hairs think he'll be a draw, but there's no way high schoolers do.

the fact that he is being considered so heavily is depressing but not all-unexpected if he's the cheapest.

 

[Todd4State]

And found a few more guys who coached in the Pros and in college.

First, Dick Howser left the Yankees in 1978 and coached at Florida State for one year and went 41-17-1. After that year he left and went back to the Yankees. That's for the Buck won't be here long crowd. And yes, same guy who won the World Series in 1985 for the Kansas City Royals.

Then we have Dave Anderson, who managed in the minors, and Memphis hired him after he was named minor league manager of the year at AAA with the Toledo Mudhens. He went 104-116 in four years, and is now back in the minors. His replacement was Daron Schoenrock, who was chosen over Dan McDonnell, in what I consider one of the biggest head coaching selection blunders of all time.

Those are two more examples to go along with Kessinger.</p>

 

[patdog]

Howser was an active MLB manager who coached only 1 year at FSU (a successful year but it's hard to really judge based on only 1 year because he didn't have his own players). The other never even made it to the big leagues as a manager and coached at a graveyard of a program in Memphis.

I do think you make a good point that if we hire Showalter and a MLB team comes calling, he may be a short-timer at MSU. Just like in his college days. He only went to MSU for one year.

 

[bulldogcountry1]

put raffo above showalter on my list. they both would be waaaaay down anyway. i feel that hiring either would be stupid, whether or not they actually have the ability. there's just no excuse for us not to hire a proven college head coach.

this is our one chance as lowly old msu to actually shoot straight for the top instead of getting off cheap by gambling on a has-been, an assistant, or a really good public speaker.

 

[Stormrider81]

"there's just no excuse for us not to hire a proven college head coach"

That should be the number one qualification for this job. We don't need to take a chance on anyone at this point, and there is no reason why we should. Hiring a college assistant or a former pro manager would be taking a huge gamble. It could pay off or it could set us back even worse. We need to hire someone proven right now and get back to winning like we should ASAP.

 

[MaxwellSmart]

Hold on with that one. Buck isn't my first choice but there is no way in hell I'd take Raffo over him. Buck may have a plan that includes pitching an hitting coaches that know what they are doing, including how to recruit. He may not be the absolute best we can do but he isn't the worst either and deserves an interview.

 

[8dog]

on a guy that's never had to recruit, deal with scholarship limitations or deal with raw talent (at least not recently) when you can hire a guy that has done this and been successful on the college level. It makes absolutely no sense. And the thought of attracting recruits on name alone just makes me nausious.

 

[maroonmania]

running a college baseball program and working in professional baseball are 2 entirely different animals. Its probably even more risky hiring Showalter than it would be hiring Raffo. Neither is a good choice in my book cause I'm not very confident that I've got a winner at the college level with either.</p>

 

[patdog]

Hiring Showalter would definitely be a risk. But you'd really put a career college assistant with a long-term mediocre track record above a 2-time American League manager of the year. Hiring either Showalter or Raffo would be a risk, but at least a Showalter hire would have a huge (and I mean really huge) upside. Let's put it this way, there's only one of those two that I could possibly see winning a national title at MSU. And before any of you accuse me of being sheepish, let me say that I could see either of them going 35-55 in the SEC over the next 3 years and "resigning."

 

[The Lord Humongous]

Then we have Dave Anderson.. . His replacement was Daron Schoenrock, who was chosen over Dan McDonnell, in what I consider one of the biggest head coaching selection blunders of all time. </p>

I remember wondering at the time what in the blue hell Memphis was thinking with that move...not that Rock was a bad hire. He was a HUGE step up from Dave Anderson...but McDonnell had clearly shown to be the more impressive recruiter and was coming from a "hot" (and now cooling) program.

Of course, this is one of those "if a tree falls in the forest and no one is there to hear it, does it make a sound?" kind of deals. I personally know all 3 Memphis Tiger hard core baseball fans and not one of the three had any clue who either Rock or McDonnell were before the hiring....or had a clue why HS baseball players leave Metro Memphis and the U of Memphis when it has "so much to offer".

 

[SoxFan343]

He did okay in the pros.

 

[windcrysmary]

I'm not buying that... sure maybe they don't know his name now, but they will once he calls... go play in the biggest crowds for a guy who managed the Yankees.... Yea... I think I would

 

[Bulldog Bruce]

If MSU were lucky enough to get Buck, it would be a GREAT hire. His style of micro-management fits the college game much better than it fit in the pros. The effort he will put into the job will be extraordinary. His resume does not only include the managing positions, but the guy has been and is on Baseball Tonight and Sportscenter where these kids have seen him. Peter Gammons and the others consider him an "expert". Young players will respond to him and he will give them a great education in Baseball.

Most players that a compete in SEC level Baseball have a dream to play professionally. Buck can sell kids on the fact that he knows everyone at the next level. He can teach kids what it takes to make it at the next level. It will be easy for him to recruit kids to come to MSU. There is almost nothing to stop a kid from making that decision since the facilities and history are already established.

Do not make it out the College Baseball is more difficult than the pros. It might have a few different tasks, but Buck's makeup is to do those tasks. He had to fight them in the Pro game.

Buck would be the best possible hire for MSU!

 

[Stormrider81]

You see how far that goes. Showalter has never had to recruit, manage the 11.7 scholarships, etc. Hiring him is a risk. Yes, he has been successful in the pros, but he hasn't been a head coach in college. We need a proven collegiate head coach to come in right away and right this ship. We don't need someone that will have to endure a learning curve. Showalter might turn into a good college coach, then again he might end up busting big time. There's no reason for MSU to take this risk in baseball when we have interest from people who are perfoming the same job right now and thus would be ready to go from day one.

 

[Todd4State]

Do not make it out the College Baseball is more difficult than the pros. It might have a few different tasks, but Buck's makeup is to do those tasks. He had to fight them in the Pro game.

</p>than college or vice versa, but they are different.

All I know is, of all the guys that I looked up that have played/coached in the pros and college, they have had mixed success, and almost all (except for one season by Dick Howser and one Regional appearance by Kessinger) have had seasons that were remotely up to what MSU should expect.

If he is hired, and I do kind of question why someone that is in the pros wants to coach college, he better hire some damn good recruiters.

 

[bulldogcountry1]

did i go way too far in saying they are both down on the list? would hiring either be risky? would hiring showalter have a huge upside? could showalter win a NC? can you see either of them laying an egg?

i'm not sure what stance you are taking.

 

[patdog]

He hasn't recruited or dealt with scholarship limitations, but there's no question that he would be the best baseball coach in the country. And it wouldn't even be close. Even the best college coaches are at best the equivalent of a AA minor league manager. Showalter is a 2-time American League manager of the year. And he has a reputation of being excellent at working with and developing young players. Of course, there's some risk in hiring him. He could be a complete bust. But he could also take our program to greater heights than it's ever been before. Is the risk one worth taking? I don't know. But there's going to be some risk no matter who we hire.

 

[bulldogcountry1]

is the main reason why i am concerned. if he is so capable, why hasn't he taken a college position in all this time?

 

[patdog]

You came up with exactly ONE name of a proven major league manager who has ever taken the step from the majors to college baseball. And he went 41-17 in his only season before returning to the majors. Comparing Showalter to the USC coach, the Memphis coach or Tony Gwynn is a joke. That's about as valid as comparing Paul Manieri to Justin Pigott, Cody Satterwhite, or Mike Kinnison. One has coached at the highest level of college baseball with great success. The others have either played college baseball or coached it at a lower level.</p>

 

[DowntownDawg]

...if Showalter were to bring in a "Dan McDonnell" type assistant to run the recruiting process and we were able to recruit well, we'd have the best "manager" in the country. Recruiting is the wild card with Buck.

 

[ScoobaDawg]

Why should he have? he has been COACHING in the Majors. He had 2 years between stints of the Yankees and the Rangers in 01-02. and since being fired by the rangers at the end of the 06 season he has been living the life on ESPN and being an "advisor" for teams.
The MSU job wasn't ever open, and he has no ties to any other school. the way I see it this is the ONLY college job he would ever consider or want.

I'm not endorsing Buck, just saying.I truthfully worry about first off, his age..I dont want a coach that we will retire in 5 years. (Buck is turning 52 on May 23rd..some GP should write him a letter). Second, his vast wealth of experience is in pro ball, college baseball is a different animal. not just on the field and the way the game is executed, but also the makeup of the team, the recruiting, and the schedule cut into 1/3 of the pro length.

He would still be in my top 5 though...

 

[windcrysmary]

croom has to deal with a program that has a history of losing and crowds that are 1/2 the size of the programs he competes with in recruiting.... facilities and all the other stuff we all know too well...

Buck would be recruiting for a program rich in winning history and the largest crowds in the game today...BIG DIFFERENCE... no facility disadvantages.... in fact, give Buck a few years and nobody will be able to touch our baseball facilities

the media splash would be HUGE... high school kids don't know his name?..you better believe they would upon his hire... local and national media will jump on it....

he'll be able to attract top assistants for help in the other areas of concern that have been mentioned...

Ex New York Yankee skipper comes back home.... I can't help but think good of it....