I'm telling you guys...

[DowntownDawg]

...it hit me like a ton of bricks the other day that at Mississippi State, if we ever taste success on a national level, the same coach that gets us there will inevitably let the program fall to at least where it was when he got there, but more likely, below. Think about it. Jackie. And now Ron. Hell, the only coach in the modern era that didn't completely let this happen was Richard Williams, but don't doubt that he would've. We were just fortunate enough to have an unwitting cheerleader come in and keep the basketball program from getting totally shipwrecked.

In fact, Byrne needs to start an under the table program that gives big scholarships to a couple cheerleader/pom squad girls every year. In the event that we reach the SEC championship game or a 10 win season in football, the Elite 8 or Final 4 in basketball, or the CWS in baseball, we need to send one of these girls in wearing a wire and a hidden camera. It's apparently the only way to keep the Mississippi State Even Steven principle from kicking in.

Of course, we'd have to find a batboy for Coach Polk.

 

[Coach34]

"Of course, we'd have to find a batboy for Coach Polk."

hahaha...that was just wrong</p>

 

[Indndawg]

MSU players and coaches cannot do national positivie recog for an X period of time.
Only time will tell about Crooms, but he doesn't seem like that type of guy. Still these guys are what MSU fans make them, when JackieASS beat bama in Nov of 2000-he was hoisted in the air ( and onto his Kang's throne) and given a new contract. No oversight, no higher expeactations-just he would lead us to the Rose Bowl in '01. We know the results. Did not recruit, go lazy, started recruiting thug af-leetes that had good 40 times but were clueless on the field. Yet the MSU fan base (GP) kept saying..."he'll turn it around, he's won NT at Pitt-he knows football....have you ever coached...yada yada...."

MSU fans are so hungry for a little success we'll except anything thereafter. Places like bama, UARK, ND, and even OM does not put up w/this crap. We gotta stop looking at MSU coaches like they're our nice Uncle Frank and more like what they are an employee of the taxpayers of MS.

Sharon Fanning
JWS
Ron Polk
would have all been fired at any other school except MSU

MSU fans and media inflate these people when they have a modicum of success so they begin to feel like psuedo-gods and emperors of their tiny domain. We are MSU fans. We are to blame. We are MSU.

 

[patdog]

Hell, the only coach in the modern era that didn't completely let this happen was Richard Williams, but don't doubt that he would've.

Williams was 27-33 (10-22 SEC) in his last 2 years. The program didn't fall below where it was when he took over (it wouldn't be possible to fall much below where it was when Williams took over). But it wasn't exactly in great shape when he left it. </p>

 

[DowntownDawg]

...but it was at least salvageable. I think Rick won 20 games the next year. Is that right?

Anyway, the point remains. It's who we are. Even Steven. What comes up and stays up at other places must come down at Mississippi State. And it's only a matter of time before it happens. Hell it took Polk 30 years, but here we are.

 

[patdog]

is because under Templeton there was no pressure for our coaches to win. If you break .500 once every few years, that was plenty good enough for him. That's why he didn't fire Jackie Sherrill after back to back 3-8 seasons? Same with Polk. No regional titles and only 1 regional host in 5 years. No problem. We'll give you a contract extension. If Williams hadn't had his little problem, it would have taken 2 more 4-12 seasons before he would have been fired. I think one reason Templeton resents Stansbury is because by winning consistantly, he's shown that you can win at MSU and that's Templeton's excuses for putting up with mediocre performace in other sports is ********.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...that Templeton exacerbated. Most of us agree that Ole Miss fans fired Cutcliffe prematurely, and as a result they ended up with Orgeron. When you are State or Ole Miss, you have to show that you appreciate success by giving job stability, since you can't pay like the big boys can. I know this will draw the ire of C34 and Saddawg, but it's the truth. There is a little bit of a fine line there. For example, Peaches would love it if we canned Stansbury right now. But at MSU, you can't do that, nor should you. I mean, what the hell do you do with Polk? He goes to the CWS last year. No matter what he did this year, he would've gotten a pass, and probably rightfully so. Thank God he resigned, even though he's doing it as badly as it can be done.

However, I agree that Jackie should've been canned after year 2. Polk...in hindsight, should've never been brought home, because you create a situation where it's very difficult to get rid of him after all his history here.

 

[patdog]

Polk...in hindsight, should've never been brought home, because you create a situation where it's very difficult to get rid of him after all his history here.

For many of us, that isn't hindsight. Because that's exactly what we said the day he was rehired.</p>

 

[Stormrider81]

We always make out as if we owe a coach something. Right now fans are arguing that we owe Polk the right to pick his successor. That's complete crap. We owe coaches their salary, incentives when they are successful, and the opporunity to bounce back from an ocassional bad season. We didn't owe Jackie that last season because he took us to 6 bowls in the 90's. It's time MSU stopped lifting coaches up on a pedestal and feeling like we have to pay some debt because they were willing to take this job. We may not be a Florida or LSU in athletics, but my goodness we are still an SEC team that pays pretty darn good money, albeit less than the big boys.

 

[patdog]

You're right that the MSU way has always been that we owe coaches something for their past success. That's ********. Our football, basketball and baseball coaches are all rich men because of MSU. They owe us some wins dammit.

 

[DowntownDawg]

....while most of you would label me a Croom apologist, we're coming from a whole different place in football than baseball. And while RonnyAtmosphere could be extremely obnoxious, I saw his point. You're starting from Ground Zero on the football field. Probation, bad attitudes, talent gaps, the works. More patience is needed, and it all has to be evaluated differently. Baseball is different. We have the facilities, the money, the fan support, the tradition, and anything else we need to be successful. Anything less than consistent success (which I define as what Ole Miss is doing on a yearly basis, hosting regionals, i.e. being a top 16 program), is selling MSU baseball short. Basketball is sort of in between. We've been able to carve out a decent program, but it has to be watched very closely, because we could go either way from here.

 

[Todd4State]

Because the return trip is usually not nearly as successful as the first time around. We were at the point in 2001 where we needed someone who could take us to the CWS consistently. Instead, we go with the guy who while he helped MSU baseball get to that point, but had never been able to get there consistently enough to win it and his glory days were when State and LSU were the only schools that gave half a flip about baseball in the SEC.

I will say that his "fire" to succeed seemed to grow less and less each year, all the while people were out recruiting us and we were only going after guys who wanted to make good grades and go to Sunday School.

Plus, each year Polk lost more and more support, although there were some ebbs after the 2005 season and the 2007 season when we did some things in the postseason. Were those flukes? Maybe. But we did start out 2006 really well- well enough to be #1 and then our team tanked it. We had a great season last year and won in spite of Polk. A lot of those same players our on our team this year- Sneed, C. Powers, Pigott, Turner, Crosswhite, Weatherford, Butler, Bowen, and Lalor. We also have some Fr. that look promising like Forrest Moore, Freeman, Collins, and even A JUCO in Tyler Moore that is promising. There is some talent on our team, and to me it just seems like if we made the proper in game decisions, and a new attitude we would be a LOT more successful.

 

[DowntownDawg]

....is permeate a sense of acceptance of mediocrity to our whole team. He has done this with his words and actions. He has shown that his fight with the NCAA is his number one priority, and that winning games is second. It's no big deal to our team whether or not we win or lose until the postseason rolls around, and the we're traveling. His overused phrase of "That's Baseball" has acted like water on the fire of competition. We could've won, but "That's baseball," etc. While other teams have guys that stand up in the dugout and are in to the game, we lounge around like we'd rather be home watching TV.

He's taught every one of these darling little boys that it's ok, to lose, and that being mediocre is ok. That feeling is all around the baseball program, and manifests itself on the field and in the stands, and that is my biggest fear about Raffo. Even if he is a much better on the field tactician, and even if he will steal more bases, etc., he has been awash in that mindset far too long.

I want somebody who is desperate to win, and who will fight, scratch and claw to do so. I want somebody who is embarrassed by losing, and who works every day to keep from that. We don't have that right now. Our coach's passion is for something other than MSU baseball winning games and championships.

 

[Dawgbreeze]

Polk is no different than Templeton. Mediocrity is okay with him and the only time he has ever done anything was when the pressure was put on by alumni. He is and never has been proactive, only reactive. The renewing of Fannings and Polks contracts without even discussing them with them is typical. Hopefully Byrne understands accountability because LT never did and he wasn't held accountable by anybody either. Doc may have been a disaster in some folks minds, but his legacy will be he got rid of an incompetent AD. We will praise him in history one day.