"Losing the team"

[3407Dewey]

A lot of criticism (and I mean a LOT) has been directed at Arnett this year. I agree with a lot of it. While I think some of the individual bone-headed decisions can be attributed to the steep learning curve any first time head coach would face, there are other trends that seem more concerning. Specifically, recruiting does not seem to be headed in a good decision. However, one thing that I have noticed is that the team culture still appears to be pretty good. You don't see the kind of "lost the locker room" nonsense that you often see with a struggling coach. You can argue with a lot of coaching calls and some player execution, but you can't fault the effort of the players. And that's not often what you see when a coach is in way over their heads. In the later Sherrill years, Croom years, even Moorehead years, locker room vibe was BAD.
Is this due to:
a) The players believe in Arnett which bodes well for the future of the program?
b) We have good senior leadership, which would be the case no matter who the coach was/is?
c) The legacy and culture built by Leach?

 

[ETK99]

I'd guess because it's loaded with older players and many have played for Arnett. Plus, it's not like they're on a 6 game losing streak like Arkansas. We're trying to win our 3rd straight this week. A win this week changes some perspective.

 

[CoastDawg18]

I'd guess because it's loaded with older players and many have played for Arnett. Plus, it's not like they're on a 6 game losing streak like Arkansas. We're trying to win our 3rd straight this week. A win this week changes some perspective.

Agree with this. Fact of the matter is as a player you know which ones you should win and lose. We are right where the players thought we would be so they aren’t off the bandwagon at all. They aren’t irrational like fans.

 

[GloryDawg]

The schedule going forward is so average. Anyone of those teams can be beaten by State. They see that. Auburn is in the same boat. The meat of their season has been played except for Bama but they have lost four in a row. Who knows where they are mentally. I am glad it's a day game.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

A lot of criticism (and I mean a LOT) has been directed at Arnett this year. I agree with a lot of it. While I think some of the individual bone-headed decisions can be attributed to the steep learning curve any first time head coach would face, there are other trends that seem more concerning. Specifically, recruiting does not seem to be headed in a good decision. However, one thing that I have noticed is that the team culture still appears to be pretty good. You don't see the kind of "lost the locker room" nonsense that you often see with a struggling coach. You can argue with a lot of coaching calls and some player execution, but you can't fault the effort of the players. And that's not often what you see when a coach is in way over their heads. In the later Sherrill years, Croom years, even Moorehead years, locker room vibe was BAD.
Is this due to:
a) The players believe in Arnett which bodes well for the future of the program?
b) We have good senior leadership, which would be the case no matter who the coach was/is?
c) The legacy and culture built by Leach?

I'll agree, and even go further......I don't think the culture under Croom was incredibly bad. His problem was just bumbling coaching decisions, which we seem to have now. It's hardheadedness and pride.......Croom thought he was God's gift to coaching. I've sensed a little of that from Arnett - my way or the highway type of thing. You can pull it off, but you better be making the right hires, decisions, etc. So far, he hasn't. Another attribute of bumbling coaching is that players don't play fast, or appear to not be in shape, or have a lot of injuries. We have some of that now. The problem is.....if the players lose faith in the coaching, bad culture can creep in there too. Lot of different ways it can manifest itself.

True bad culture was the end of Jackie, and Moorhead, just no accountability at all. That can creep in on anyone from time to time if the coach checks out, we had a little bit of it in early 2016 with Mullen. But we've had some issues this year with a few of our guys (Tulu), similar to Croom's Level 3 incident and then the Dale Earnhardt car incident.

Croom and Arnett (so far) are VERY similar to me. Croom wanted distance from Jackie, and Arnett wants distance from Leach (neither have considered the possibility that their predecessors did some good things). Both think they know everything, and both don't seem to want to operate within their strengths.

 

[ChinaDogSunflower]

I'd guess because it's loaded with older players and many have played for Arnett. Plus, it's not like they're on a 6 game losing streak like Arkansas. We're trying to win our 3rd straight this week. A win this week changes some perspective.

A win this week would go a LONG way

 

[OG Goat Holder]

A win this week would go a LONG way

Hey man, if he figures out a way to beat Auburn and then takes down Kentucky at home, hope will come back, even if the offense isn't great. He will at least be able to sell the future. Will he correct his issues? We will just have to see.

Croom didn't. His 2007 is similar to this one, and 2008 became a disaster.

 

[ZombieKissinger]

I think there’s still some hope for this season to result in 6-7 wins, though that’s still a disappointment from preseason (not for Vegas but for us). Bigger issue to me is that next season seems totally hopeless. Our schedule isn’t that bad next year, but I see no hope when I look at the depth chart. We will need some serious portal action to be remotely competitive

edit: While I’m pretty negative about next year, I still think Arnett should have a chance. Either he makes something out of nothing next year and gives us hope, or he doesn’t, and we hire a new coach

 

[The Peeper]

A lot of criticism (and I mean a LOT) has been directed at Arnett this year. I agree with a lot of it. While I think some of the individual bone-headed decisions can be attributed to the steep learning curve any first time head coach would face, there are other trends that seem more concerning. Specifically, recruiting does not seem to be headed in a good decision. However, one thing that I have noticed is that the team culture still appears to be pretty good. You don't see the kind of "lost the locker room" nonsense that you often see with a struggling coach. You can argue with a lot of coaching calls and some player execution, but you can't fault the effort of the players. And that's not often what you see when a coach is in way over their heads. In the later Sherrill years, Croom years, even Moorehead years, locker room vibe was BAD.
Is this due to:
a) The players believe in Arnett which bodes well for the future of the program?
b) We have good senior leadership, which would be the case no matter who the coach was/is?
c) The legacy and culture built by Leach?

or:

d) In this day and age, if you want to hit the portal, grab some NIL $$ and successfully transfer out, you better be giving maximum effort and not openly criticizing the staff and other players otherwise you could be seen as locker room cancer. Just a devils advocate thought........

 

[Rupert Jenkins]

I would say b and c. I'm afraid 2024 will be a serious disaster. At that point players will become disillusioned. But hopefully we can win 2 more SEC games and USM and recruits will get excited and jump in the boat and away we go. None of us can see the future and the facts are 3 years from now we might be competing for the SEC .....I almost typed west. Or we may be watching a new coach try to put out the dumpster fire that we let smolder too long

 

[OG Goat Holder]

edit: While I’m pretty negative about next year, I still think Arnett should have a chance. Either he makes something out of nothing next year and gives us hope, or he doesn’t, and we hire a new coach

Very easy spot to cut bait. Just like 2020 would have been with Moorhead, had the fight not occurred.

 

[ChinaDogSunflower]

Hey man, if he figures out a way to beat Auburn and then takes down Kentucky at home, hope will come back, even if the offense isn't great. He will at least be able to sell the future. Will he correct his issues? We will just have to see.

Croom didn't. His 2007 is similar to this one, and 2008 became a disaster.

If he can take down UK he will win back some of the fans, myself included.

He's definitely way in over his head so far. Hopefully the bye week gave him time to step back, breath and assess his own performance as HC and that's why defense showed up for the first time. Regardless if it was against one of the worst offenses in the country statistically. We made 2-5 USCe look like a serious team so we could have easily given up 16 straight completions to KJJ.

We've got some momentum. But so did Croom after 2007.

 

[Rupert Jenkins]

Very easy spot to cut bait. Just like 2020 would have been with Moorhead, had the fight not occurred.

Perfect spot actually. We will be a young inexperienced team with new players trying to learn how to win all over the field. Probly a pretty down year regardless. Great time to makes coaching changes also. It would be optimum if the ones we have could get their **** together tho. Start looking like winners and convince a few more recruits to get on the board for the win.

 

[dog12]

Croom and Arnett (so far) are VERY similar to me. Croom wanted distance from Jackie, and Arnett wants distance from Leach (neither have considered the possibility that their predecessors did some good things). Both think they know everything, and both don't seem to want to operate within their strengths.

Arnett thinks he knows everything??? I've never noticed that.

Have I missed something?

 

[thatsbaseball]

I would say b and c. I'm afraid 2024 will be a serious disaster. At that point players will become disillusioned. But hopefully we can win 2 more SEC games and USM and recruits will get excited and jump in the boat and away we go. None of us can see the future and the facts are 3 years from now we might be competing for the SEC .....I almost typed west. Or we may be watching a new coach try to put out the dumpster fire that we let smolder too long

Honest question. Do bona fide good recruits still get "excited and jump on the boat" because a program appears to be headed in the right direction or do they get excited about jumping on the money of the program that offers them the most ? I just hope that a good player choosing a school because he likes the school and the coaches hasn't been totally lost in all this insanity.

 

[Mr. Cook]

A lot of criticism (and I mean a LOT) has been directed at Arnett this year. I agree with a lot of it. While I think some of the individual bone-headed decisions can be attributed to the steep learning curve any first time head coach would face, there are other trends that seem more concerning. Specifically, recruiting does not seem to be headed in a good decision. However, one thing that I have noticed is that the team culture still appears to be pretty good. You don't see the kind of "lost the locker room" nonsense that you often see with a struggling coach. You can argue with a lot of coaching calls and some player execution, but you can't fault the effort of the players. And that's not often what you see when a coach is in way over their heads. In the later Sherrill years, Croom years, even Moorehead years, locker room vibe was BAD.
Is this due to:
a) The players believe in Arnett which bodes well for the future of the program?
b) We have good senior leadership, which would be the case no matter who the coach was/is?
c) The legacy and culture built by Leach?

First, I don't think there is a "single bullet." I believe there are more systemic issues.

Also, how quickly some of us have forgotten that merely 10 months ago, this football program lost its leader unexpectedly and tragically. MSU football landing on its feet in less than one season was a low probability. I personally hoped for the best and prepared for the worst.

 

[Rupert Jenkins]

Honest question. Do bona fide good recruits still get "excited and jump on the boat" because a program appears to be headed in the right direction or do they get excited about jumping on the money of the program that offers them the most ? I just hope that a good player choosing a school because he likes the school and the coaches hasn't been totally lost in all this insanity.

Idk which one carries more weight. The money I'm sure but a kid isn't going to a terrible program. The number one purpose is win games and be noticed by scouts and get to the NFL. A dumpster fire is not gonna help you achieve your goals.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Honest question. Do bona fide good recruits still get "excited and jump on the boat" because a program appears to be headed in the right direction or do they get excited about jumping on the money of the program that offers them the most ? I just hope that a good player choosing a school because he likes the school and the coaches hasn't been totally lost in all this insanity.

I think you’re too cynical. Probably happens with the top guys much more than our footprint.