Starkville traffic cameras

[mstateglfr]

So these things aren't even for ticketing drivers that blow red lights or are speeding?
Are they really all in place in case some footage is needed of a crime/person of interest?


I was surprised to see so many traffic cameras, but even more surprised to learn they aren't in place to reduce two of the most common traffic violations.

Are traffic cameras really not allowed to be used for speeding in MS?

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

There’s multiple states that don’t allow speed cameras.

Maine, Mississippi, New Hampshire, South Carolina, Texas and West Virginia prohibit both red-light and speed cameras. Montana and South Dakota prohibit red-light cameras, and New Jersey and Wisconsin do not allow speed cameras.

I know in Tennessee it’s not enforceable because it’s a civil violation and not a criminal violation. My dad got a ticket by a traffic cam saying he ran a red light in Memphis. They sent the picture with the ticketed amount but they can’t force you to pay it and it doesn’t go on your record.

 

[WrapItDog]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]3/24/2009
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Mississippi governor signs comprehensive ban on red light cameras and speed cameras into law.[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][FONT=times new roman, serif]With a stroke of his pen, Governor Haley Barbour (R) had quietly signed into law one of the most comprehensive bans on photo enforcement in the country after the state legislature put the proposal on his desk with overwhelming bipartisan support.[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]

 

[aerodawg.sixpack]

You sure about Texas or is that new? In 2016-2017 my wife definitely got a mail in ticket with a picture of the car for finishing a left hand turn that turned red when she was about 5 feet from complete. We were living and driving in Dallas or more specifically the Plano/Frisco area.

 

[Leeshouldveflanked]

You have a right to face your accuser in court. You cant face a camera in court.

 

[TaleofTwoDogs]

They removed the cameras in Texas a couple of years ago.

 

[Cooterpoot]

Cameras are for spying silly

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

It’s the same thing in Texas as it is in Tennessee. If you get a ticket in the mail from a traffic camera you’re not obligated to pay it because it’s a civil violation. They’re just preying on people who don’t know any better and just pay it.

 

[greenbean.sixpack]

Several years Jackson issued tickets based on traffic cameras, it didn't last long before ole Haley banned them.

 

[greenbean.sixpack]

There’s multiple states that don’t allow speed cameras.

Maine, Mississippi, New Hampshire, South Carolina, Texas and West Virginia prohibit both red-light and speed cameras. Montana and South Dakota prohibit red-light cameras, and New Jersey and Wisconsin do not allow speed cameras.

I know in Tennessee it’s not enforceable because it’s a civil violation and not a criminal violation. My dad got a ticket by a traffic cam saying he ran a red light in Memphis. They sent the picture with the ticketed amount but they can’t force you to pay it and it doesn’t go on your record.

He should have sent them a picture of his money.

 

[Shmuley]

Tag readers, bro.

 

[The Peeper]

https://www.speedingticketadvisor.org/speeding-red-light-camera-tennessee/

 

[dorndawg]

It’s the same thing in Texas as it is in Tennessee. If you get a ticket in the mail from a traffic camera you’re not obligated to pay it because it’s a civil violation. They’re just preying on people who don’t know any better and just pay it.

Can they put them on a person's credit report?

 

[Baddmann]

Several years Jackson issued tickets based on traffic cameras, it didn't last long before ole Haley banned them.

If I remember correctly, Representative Blackman got caught on camera with someone in the car with him (it was not Mrs. Blackmon) while rolling through a red light turn from Old Canton onto Lakeland. After that story hit the news that pretty much ended red light cameras in MS. None of those folks want that kind of exposure...

Edit: Sorry it was not him, but a relative of his... However, once it hit the news it received unbelievable bipartisan support! (117-3)

 

[The Peeper]

Strictly for surveillance in Starkville at major intersections or busy streets, can't be used for traffic citations. There's a program now where you pay as a business owner to install a camera at your business and they get to use the footage.

https://www.wtva.com/news/local/sta...cle_69348663-729c-5042-b3b6-8505425cf4cf.html

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

Speaking of "big brother", you guys would be shocked to learn just how many cameras there are across campus. Seriously.

 

[Bill Shankly]

Speaking of "big brother", you guys would be shocked to learn just how many cameras there are across campus. Seriously.

Go to the UK or Western Europe sometime. If you are in a public place in a large city, and many small ones, you are on camera.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

No. The law in Tennessee and Texas both read

“non-payment of this citation cannot adversely affect your credit report or credit score, your driver’s license points, or your automobile insurance rates.”

 

[dorndawg]

Speaking of "big brother", you guys would be shocked to learn just how many cameras there are across campus. Seriously.

Hell if you're in or near somebody's house, there's a decent chance you're on camera these days.

 

[GloryDawg]

It was ruled that writing tickets by using cameras are unconstitutional in the State of Miss. Jackson was doing it on county line road and got sued. I think Jackson was taking it a step further by setting the the light to turn to the cities advantage. The cameras are now for accidents to be investigated. They are all over Brandon and Pearl. You are not going to hit and run in that area.

 

[dorndawg]

I'm generally anti-camera as hell but kinda think they make sense for red lights. Also is it just me or are folks running the hell out of red lights more these days? I guess it's probably the general way society has gotten feral, but I can just laugh when folks act a fool at Lowe's or wherever. The red light running is YIKES.

 

[The Peeper]

You're on wifi cameras at my place in Starkville from the time you pull into the driveway until you enter the house, I don't have them inside but don't advertise that to anyone I know. They alert me (if I want them to) any time anyone pulls in or walks up to the house no matter where I am so I can see you and then talk to you on any of them if I want or need to. The postman and UPS guy wave all the time at the doorbell camera when they put boxes on the front porch. The ringer on the doorbell sounds like a rabid dog raising hell when you push it too. Freaks my dog out when she hears it because we have so few people ring it

 

[Smoked Toag]

I'm generally anti-camera as hell but kinda think they make sense for red lights. Also is it just me or are folks running the hell out of red lights more these days? I guess it's probably the general way society has gotten feral, but I can just laugh when folks act a fool at Lowe's or wherever. The red light running is YIKES.

Wait.....you're complaining about society going feral, and at the same time spend countless hours on here spreading liberal and anti-police nonsense?

I do think some of you libs have brain damage.

 

[dorndawg]

Wait.....you're complaining about society going feral, and at the same time spend countless hours on here spreading liberal and anti-police nonsense?

I do think some of you libs have brain damage.

Say, you shop at Lowe's much?

 

[johnson86-1]

I'm generally anti-camera as hell but kinda think they make sense for red lights. Also is it just me or are folks running the hell out of red lights more these days? I guess it's probably the general way society has gotten feral, but I can just laugh when folks act a fool at Lowe's or wherever. The red light running is YIKES.

The possibly could make sense, but too many places refused to follow best practices and follow recommended lengths for yellow lights because they wanted the revenue. They do supposedly cut down on fatal accidents while increasing the number of rear ends.

Which may sound like a good tradeoff, but non-fatal doesn't mean non-harmful. I have neck issues from getting rear ended and I never would have thought it would cause problems. To give you an idea of how minor, I was at a redlight and pulled forward some to see if I could turn right on red and guy behind me, who was already stopped, just inexplicably took off like it was a green light. Certainly jerked me pretty good but the bumper was 100% fine, so it wasn't anything like a normal rear end accident. Felt fine after the accident, then felt sore the next day and started having burning sensations and numbness on the third day. Nothing terrible but periodically have pain and takes less and less activity to cause it (or just sleeping on it wrong). But certainly makes me think treating rear end accidents at traffic lights where people slam on the breaks because of fear of redlight cameras as just economically harmful (which is the implicit position of people pushing redlight camers) is pretty wrong headed as I suspect back and neck issues from those accidents probably are pretty harmful to quality of life.

 

[dorndawg]

The possibly could make sense, but too many places refused to follow best practices and follow recommended lengths for yellow lights because they wanted the revenue. They do supposedly cut down on fatal accidents while increasing the number of rear ends.

Which may sound like a good tradeoff, but non-fatal doesn't mean non-harmful. I have neck issues from getting rear ended and I never would have thought it would cause problems. To give you an idea of how minor, I was at a redlight and pulled forward some to see if I could turn right on red and guy behind me, who was already stopped, just inexplicably took off like it was a green light. Certainly jerked me pretty good but the bumper was 100% fine, so it wasn't anything like a normal rear end accident. Felt fine after the accident, then felt sore the next day and started having burning sensations and numbness on the third day. Nothing terrible but periodically have pain and takes less and less activity to cause it (or just sleeping on it wrong). But certainly makes me think treating rear end accidents at traffic lights where people slam on the breaks because of fear of redlight cameras as just economically harmful (which is the implicit position of people pushing redlight camers) is pretty wrong headed as I suspect back and neck issues from those accidents probably are pretty harmful to quality of life.

This is good insight I had not considered, thanks

 

[johnson86-1]

Hell if you're in or near somebody's house, there's a decent chance you're on camera these days.

Yup. In theory, I am bothered by this, but in practice, I like that the few times we have had issues with people trying car breakins, they have gotten caught pretty quickly and I think now have basically decided it's not worth it, as there have been basically zero since quarantine. During quarantine, they lasted a little bit longer because they were masked up and took a while to get a good enough photo to identify the model car they were using, which was enough to narrow it down and find them. One of the neighbors has essentially set up a license plate reader now, so next time, unless they cover up their license plate or using a stolen car, they'll get caught pretty quickly. Which again, in theory I recognize as creepy and overly intrusive, but in practice, I'm not complaining.

ETA: Really looking forward to the first time somebody figures out to subpoena that neighbor in a divorce case to catch a mistress/lover driving to the house before the divorce is final.

 

[dorndawg]

You're on wifi cameras at my place in Starkville from the time you pull into the driveway until you enter the house, I don't have them inside but don't advertise that to anyone I know. They alert me (if I want them to) any time anyone pulls in or walks up to the house no matter where I am so I can see you and then talk to you on any of them if I want or need to. The postman and UPS guy wave all the time at the doorbell camera when they put boxes on the front porch. The ringer on the doorbell sounds like a rabid dog raising hell when you push it too. Freaks my dog out when she hears it because we have so few people ring it

I get why folks do this, it's just not for me. Besides, the cat's out of the bag. Sometimes I wonder how long it will be until lots of regular folks wear bodycams.

 

[PooPopsBaldHead]

Actually.... Having got one in Garland, TX in 2010 for being stuck in an intersection because of a wreck in front of me, this *was* a little incorrect. (Was because Texas passed an outright ban in 2019 and only a few are still operating throughout the state until their contract is up with the camera vendor.) But Texas has effectively banned the 17ers.

Before the ban, there was a provision allowing any municipality with the camera system in place prior to 2007 to turn your unpaid fine over to collections and report it on your credit. The DMV would also block you from being able to register the vehicle the following year. This is what got me...

My vehicle was a company truck leased through a fleet leasing company out of New Jersey. The citation was never sent to me and I guess the leasing company never addressed it. A year later I got in a world of **** when the company could not re register the vehicle. By the time it got back to corporate, word was I had been running down pedestrians all over town or something. I was damn near fired over the confusion that I was running relights and not paying fines. It took 2 months to clear my name, luckily the accident that caused me to stop in the intersection had a police report with a a timestamp very close to my red light photo.

So yeah, 17 those cameras. And pro tip, if you work for a public company, just quit if you get a ticket. It ain't worth it. I would have gone through less **** if I had been embezzling money.

 

[tbaydog]

Got them all over Tampa and they are very enforceable if you are a Hillsborough county resident. Ive had numerous and not cheap!!!

 

[Go Budaw]

For red light cameras, its just a blatant cash grab for cities who try to implement them. It’s not even the police or city that does the administrative work. These 3rd party companies run everything and make a pitch to these cities that they can improve their revenues by X amount, and they’ll only take a small percentage for their profit and overhead for essentially automating their police work. The whole business model is disgusting.

In Huntsville, they got in the pockets of one city council member recently, who subsequently started pushing hard for them. The other members overwhelmingly rejected it after the residents became aware of it.

https://www.waaytv.com/news/update-...8e76105c-7968-11ec-bfbc-c3ae70d1a1a8.amp.html

Another common trick that has happened in other cities….they implement the cameras, and then they actually shorten the timer on the yellow lights at the intersections that have them in order to induce even more violations.

And as others have said, states as a whole have basically rendered them not viable from a legal perspective. Any infraction for which you are guilty (traffic or otherwise) requires you to be formally served in person by an officer. Anything that shows up in the mail is invalid in that sense. Best advice is if you’re ever driving anywhere, and you get one of those red light tickets in the mail….immediately rip it up and throw it in the trash, and don’t ever think about it again.

 

[mstateglfr]

You have a right to face your accuser in court. You cant face a camera in court.

The accuser is the state/city/County. You face them, even when a traffic camera initiated the ticket. The accuser is able to then testify to the accuracy of the equipment used.

 

[patdog]

Like most things, discretion should be used. Speeding through a light that turned red a couple of seconds ago is very dangerous and I've got no problem with those people getting a ticket via camera. Not coming to a complete stop before turning right on red at a deserted intersection is completely different. In general, I've got no problems using technology to ticket people for dangerous driving. I've got real problems with using it as a revenue generator.

 

[Cooterpoot]

Like most things, discretion should be used. Speeding through a light that turned red a couple of seconds ago is very dangerous and I've got no problem with those people getting a ticket via camera. Not coming to a complete stop before turning right on red at a deserted intersection is completely different. In general, I've got no problems using technology to ticket people for dangerous driving. I've got real problems with using it as a revenue generator.

The government starts with that, next thing you know, you get arrested for getting a hummer while driving.

 

[horshack.sixpack]

People don't realize how many cameras police have in place just to do LPR and assist during crime, or after the fact for evidence. Madison, the City has over 90 in the city limits. If MS ever allows ticketing, the infrastructure will largely be in place.

 

[johnson86-1]

People don't realize how many cameras police have in place just to do LPR and assist during crime, or after the fact for evidence. Madison, the City has over 90 in the city limits. If MS ever allows ticketing, the infrastructure will largely be in place.

If cities are going to maintain license plate reading and other general surveillance not related to a crime, I wish they would at least have to get a warrant to access the video/records. That would make it slightly harder to use it politically to attack disfavored parties.

 

[horshack.sixpack]

Pretty sure that LPR data falls under CJIS security policy so I'm sure all these municipalities are exercising the strictest of control.***

 

[Dawg_4_lifes]

They sent the picture with the ticketed amount but they can’t force you to pay it and it doesn’t go on your record.

This!!!!! I have collected about a half dozen of these things and throw each of them in the trash.

 

[Beretta.sixpack]

I got one on a Florida toll bridge near Destin...

I got one on the Florida toll bridge near destin for not paying my toll.....the only problem was that I actually paid the toll....they sent me a picture of my suv, all loaded down with beach stuff and family....the receipt was lost with all the other trash from a drive with kids, so i didnt have it to prove it....I was pissed off enough that i folded the letter and just put it in my desk. Never called. Never did anything. This was 6-7 years ago. Its not on my record, and i have been able to renew my MS drivers license, and get my car tags annually. I have even been across that same toll bridge back and forth 20 times since then.

Lesson learned here is to keep your toll receipts....

 

[Leeshouldveflanked]

A guy used to work with started a company called SkyCop making those cameras that have the blue police lights on them. The city of Memphis uses his cameras. The dude knows how to make money. He started two other companies and sold those to bigger companies.