Tubby Smith talks time at UK
- Thread starter rick64
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Tubby is a class act. I always hate that he doesn't get credit for his 1st title.
Whether or not he recruited the players don't matter to me. You still have to coach them and execute every single game.
Whether or not he recruited the players don't matter to me. You still have to coach them and execute every single game.
Tubby was my favorite UK coach. Those yers were awesome until the end.
He does get credit for that from every one except flat earthers and no mooners.
The guy did a good job He did have Joe Hall disease. Screwed up by following an exceptional coach or era.
I think it’s that nobody seems to just let it be what it is. Tubby was not going to be a national champion without Pitino. There’s no way on earth that near 3 peat happens without the work of Rick Pitino. It’s just what it is. I credit Rick with 3 titles in his career and I credit tubby for 1 title in his career. That’s just my opinion and it’s my historical view of it. In ways Rick is a 3 time champ and would have been a 5/6 time champ had he stayed. He’s on level with coach K in my eyes, he just made bad career choices that cost him that title to the world. His contribution to college basketball is coach K level.
Tubby was very solid and we don’t recognize it enough that’s for sure. I wanted him ran out of here after his 3rd season and looking back it was due to missing Pitino the entire time. Tubby gave UK some of the best basketball we’ve ever had with some of the best players we’ve ever had. Nearly an elite 8 half the time, 5 SEC titles, final four, title. All in 10 years.
Tubby’s stubbornness and inability to adapt stopped him from being extremely dominant and a 2/3 time champ. But he was waaay more solid than many give him credit for. It’s mainly due to following Pitino. Looking back, do I love those guys from 98-04.
You also have the Billy Donovan situation that’s an issue. Once people began to take notice that one of our own, an understudy of Pitino, was turning out to be amazing it made the situation worse. Really like Tubby and hope he’s remembered well but Donovan should have been the choice in hindsight.
Kentucky has made 2 really bad mistakes that have cost us countless titles. Not taking Donovan and not working pitino back in. But it could have turned out worse than it did and it did thanks to Tubby making a stopgap. I just let it be what it is and stay out of the way of the rest of it.
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Tubby was not a good coach. He was gifted his only FF of his career.
He is not anywhere close to a “class act”.
He put playing his son over the good of the program.
He even lied about Cliff Hawkins’ illness in order to keep playing his son.
As for coaching, Tubby never won anything before he was hired here and never won anything after he left here.
He had one winning season in a conference after UK. And that was his last season in Memphis. They were so impressed they fired him.
Then the “class act” quits mid season at High Point just so his son could take over.
The facts of Tubby’s coaching career speak for themselves.
However one feels about those facts is completely up to them.
To me Tubby Smith stole UK basketball from a generation.
He is not anywhere close to a “class act”.
He put playing his son over the good of the program.
He even lied about Cliff Hawkins’ illness in order to keep playing his son.
As for coaching, Tubby never won anything before he was hired here and never won anything after he left here.
He had one winning season in a conference after UK. And that was his last season in Memphis. They were so impressed they fired him.
Then the “class act” quits mid season at High Point just so his son could take over.
The facts of Tubby’s coaching career speak for themselves.
However one feels about those facts is completely up to them.
To me Tubby Smith stole UK basketball from a generation.
This. Also Tubby walked out on us to go to Minnesota. It worked out ok as we replaced him with the legend but still, he quit on us
That would fly better if had ever taken another team to the final 4 in his entire career.
LOL ! Most everyone rejoiced when he finally left . Hardly anyone holds that against him . Is the best thing he had done in years. He was turning us into another Indiana .
True. I was overjoyed when he left. I didn't care how. But that flies in the face of people that say he is a class act. He didn't even tell the players. And he continued to recruit PP to Minn.
The Myron Anthony fiasco in his second year was just the beginning of Tubby showing who he really was. And he did recruit. He had the number 1 class the Randolph year. How did that work for the coaching legend?
Humble guy, always gives credit to his players.
There’s a different opinion I haven’t heard before but interesting. He was the first coach I remember. I can’t say much about it other than I was told he was a good coach that didn’t want to recruit.
I do remember those Rondo Ramel Bradley teams with Sparks and Kelenna Azabuike(probably spelled that wrong).. those teams were some of the funnest times for me as a young Kentucky fan so I’ll always love Tubby. I became a die hard while he was the coach. I understood what Kentucky basketball was while he was the coach so he’s forever got a special place to me when it comes to my view on him and Uk bball.
Those 2003 to 2005 teams were fun but underachieved in ncaa tournaments. Tubby makes one more final four and I think his tenure is strengthened a ton.
He always talked a good game. Even Gerald Fitch said, "there's two Tubbys. The one the public sees and the one the players see"
And Fitch is a Tubby guy.
Tubby was a great guy and a great coach. The animosity of some in our fan base is hard to understand. Some of it is certainly racism but some of it is the other thing they say about UK fans; we expect to win titles every year. Either way, there’s no good reason to still after 20 years harbor any ill will toward Tubby.
Then why hasn't this great coach won anything other than the gifted FF and title? Head coach at 7 D1 schools. Fired by 2. Got at 2 others before they could fire him.
Where's the racism there? Are you saying he couldn't win because of his skin color? That seems ridiculous.
"Great guy" is subjective. Coaching is not. If you think he's a great guy then he is to you. The coaching is out there. Every school he has gone to he did better with the guys already there. The longer he was at each school the greater the decline. He never built a program in his career.
That’s False, he won at Minnesota and Georgia at higher levels than those programs did previously. There is no doubt though that college basketball becoming all about recruiting, handlers and shoe companies greatly reduced Tubbys ability to be effective. He was a great coach in his time but his time ended. And again, if your standard is Final four or bust, your standard is the problem. Tubby won huge at UK. Until the last two years. He put teams on the floor almost every year that were capable of winning titles.
It is still what it is. Difficult to review. I can celebrate the '98 team Tubby coached, and that incredible season ended by Bogans' injury and Mr Wade, and yet still be glad he made the decision to move on, and welcome him back without qualification.
I think the class act stuff is overblown to begin with. This is college basketball, every one of these guys have little values and would sell their mother for wins and cash. Nobody is in college coaching to be a class act. You can’t be a class act and be a college basketball coach. “Class acts” are all doing high school basketball. That’s where they remain.
The closest thing to a classy guy would be a dude like Pope who you can clearly see has more about himself than the rest. But Mark is still a college basketball coach so people are fooling themselves if they think he’s a choir boy.
I know a lot that goes on behind the scenes and have for years. I’ve seen these guys when no one is watching, the cameras are off, and it’s closed to the public. I’ve seen Calipari in Memphis absolutely trash to players to the core and treat them like you’d think he wanted them dead. I watched him berate Antonio Anderson and make him break down and want his mother. Calipari was a maniac who would be the meanest SOB I’ve ever seen. You don’t make 100 million dollars in college basketball if you’re a nice man. Sorry. Doesn’t happen. That’s not including the corrupt things that take place and they’re rarely caught. Calipari knows all about that. Harbortown is a clear example.
Then Cal was Mr. Players guy to the cameras. I do think he’s mellowed a bit now. I had a conversation with WCS about 6 months ago and we talked about who Calipari really is. He got to see the end of the real Calipari. A Larry Brown understudy cannot be and is not what I’d call a “good man”.
So the class act stuff in this sport is hilarious. This is the dirtiest sport in all of sports college or pro. And that’s not close. You don’t get into this is you’re a true class act because you can’t be one and win.
Tubby is no different and he couldn’t have won at all without being in that camp. However, Tubby is more classy than many others. He refused to coddle AAU handlers. That in and of itself separated him from the pack. So it’s little things like that you look for. He refused to let anyone use and abuse his players and he wouldn’t recruit you if you weren’t willing to do this in a traditional fashion.
Guys like Calipari, Pearl, or Tom Izzo, or coach K would absolutely sell their mother for a price. And most of the others would too.
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Yup he was a pretty great in game coach. If he just recruited harder or had a better staff he would have been so good. Sadly 2003 choked and 2005 got robbed IMO or else he would be held a tad higher, regardless he won us a ship.
I still think he gets to another final four if Bogans doesn't get injured. Yeah D Wade was good but I don't think he takes a healthy senior Bogans.
He absolutely did not win at Minnesota and Ga at a higher level than his first year.
Nor did he win at UK.
Yes, the UK standard is FF’s. He set the record for time between FF’s at UK.
Tubby is simply not a good coach.
CM did not hire him on his coaching abilities nor vet him.
CM was going to hire a black coach.
He even said he admired how Tubby was calm on the TV interview after losing to a 14 seed at UGA.
Tubby was to be CM’s Jackie Robinson.
It was a bonus that Tubby was gifted a title in his first season.
Even CM didn’t expect that.
And forget FF’s. Tubby had one winning conference record after leaving UK.
Tubby is a world class grifter though.
And to expand on Ga and Minn, Tubby took over for a great coach in Hugh Durham at UGA. A program already built. Durham had taken 2 schools to a FF. Had he stayed on more year they wouldn’t have made the tournament.
At Minnesota Tubby took over for Monson
He had built Gonzaga from nothing then Minnesota. Tubby did less well than Monson each year until he was finally fired.
Put all the lipstick you want on the pig. It’s still a pig.
Tubby never built even one program in his career.
Even the TV talking heads that slobber over every coach were saying “this is not Ky basketball” on national TV.
CM’s son was announcing and trying to put lipstick on the pig and said “Tubby is a master at drawing up plays that just don’t work”
I don’t know how that’s a compliment. But it’s all they had.
I can’t say 2003 was a choke. Bogans was hurt and that’s the night Dwayne Wade became Dwayne Wade. It definitely hurt though. That was my favorite UK team ever and they seemed destined for the title.
Yeah I meant 2003-2004 the UAB loss my bad.
From 1993-2013 Tubby coached Tulsa, Georgia, UK and Minnesota. His teams won 20+ games 19 out of 20 seasons. Made the NCAA tournament 17 out of 20 seasons. It’s silly to say the man can’t coach. He took Tulsa to back to back Sweet 16s. Won 20 games in back to back seasons at Georgia for the first time ever. Took Minnesota to the Big Ten Tournament Championship for the first time ever. Minnesota had made the tournament three times since 1990 prior to him taking over. He took them 3 times in six seasons.
In 10 years at Kentucky his teams:
- Won 5 SEC Regular Season Titles
- Won 5 SEC Tournament Titles
- Won at least a regular season or tournament title 7 out of 10 years
- Made the Round of 32 all 10 years
- 3 Elite Eights
- 6 Sweet 16 appearances
Only Kentucky fans talk about championships being what matters and then talk badly about a coach that won 1 of the 8.
In 10 years at Kentucky his teams:
- Won 5 SEC Regular Season Titles
- Won 5 SEC Tournament Titles
- Won at least a regular season or tournament title 7 out of 10 years
- Made the Round of 32 all 10 years
- 3 Elite Eights
- 6 Sweet 16 appearances
Only Kentucky fans talk about championships being what matters and then talk badly about a coach that won 1 of the 8.
Tubby wasn't the best coach in UK history, but when folks talk about him not being a good coach it's hard to take their basketball opinion seriously. 98 was less talented than 97 top to bottom. He wasn't gifted anything, he coached that team to a championship and did a damn fine job doing so.
He wasn't a good recruiter, and his one superclass disappointed. That keeps him from being an elite coach, it certainly doesn't keep him from being a good coach.
He wasn't a good recruiter, and his one superclass disappointed. That keeps him from being an elite coach, it certainly doesn't keep him from being a good coach.
Eh, this is what I’m talking about. People on both sides won’t let it be what it is, with all due respect. The wheels were falling off on Tubby, and he took Kentucky at the height of our programs modern history And left it far worse than he found it. That’s true. 20+ wins is meaningless. It’s always been a pretty useless stat for the most part. Tubby was ran out of every program he was at after Georgia. Memphis wanted him gone immediately. The guy is no ace in the hole, he’s not a great coach. He was a good coach but wasn’t top shelf.
Tubby was just in the middle. Had he won that title with his own recruits it would be different but he didn’t. And to act like that doesn’t matter is absurd. Tubby never took him his own team to the final four. Tubby is on a tier below Barnes, or right at it. That’s not bad but it gets a lot better especially if you’re Kentucky.
Love those players and Tubby got out at the right time. Put his banner up and pay respects. But I’m not going to produce write ups that completely neglect the ins and outs of the reality in replace of skewed hindsight.
Coaches who can draw up plays are a dime a dozen. Guys who win get inside their players and motivate. Vince Lombardi.
not saying this post isn’t accurate much of it is. But too many people undersell that 98 team. It was a great team by the end of the year. The team had pros all over it and excellent role guys that all fit nicely. It was easily a top 5 team that year. Was it the best? Probably not, Duke was clearly a step above. But were they talented, were they a special group? Absolutely. When looking at the roster is doesn’t get that much better.
My freshman year at UK was 99 and was when I became a UK fan. Was a student in 03 and 04 and can’t tell you how disappointed I was to never go to a FF as a student. IMO Tubbys main issues were :
-Mediocre recruiter (by far his biggest issue)
-Weak offensive coach
-Did not run a tight ship - his players were very undisciplined off the court
He was a good coach, but not great by any means
-Mediocre recruiter (by far his biggest issue)
-Weak offensive coach
-Did not run a tight ship - his players were very undisciplined off the court
He was a good coach, but not great by any means
Georgia has made exactly 2 Sweet 16s in their history. Tubby took them to back to back tournaments. Since he left, they've been to 6 NCAA Tournaments total.
Dan Monson lead Minnesota to one NCAA Tournament, Tubby had them there 3 times, and won their first NCAA Tournament game since 1997. Since they fired him, they've been back to the tournament twice.
People also forget how low Pat Knight and Billy G. had Texas Tech. Tubby built them back up into an NCAA Tournament team and laid the foundation for the success they have now.
Tubby needs a statue outside of Rupp Arena for all he did for the program and state, for that matter.
Dan Monson lead Minnesota to one NCAA Tournament, Tubby had them there 3 times, and won their first NCAA Tournament game since 1997. Since they fired him, they've been back to the tournament twice.
People also forget how low Pat Knight and Billy G. had Texas Tech. Tubby built them back up into an NCAA Tournament team and laid the foundation for the success they have now.
Tubby needs a statue outside of Rupp Arena for all he did for the program and state, for that matter.
Right. And when you’re someone who lived Pitino and the 90’s, the reality of Tubby is hard to take. It just makes it worse, he followed the best years for UK fans in modern history.
You almost had me reeled in. The finish was too strong. Started like a typical weak Tubby defense but believable. The Texas Tech stuff it started to fall off. The end gave it away.
I’ll add Memphis should build his statue too.
I think what you said is the key. He was a good coach not a great coach. That’s how I view him. Solid for a lot of programs. Maybe not a blue blood program, but I did enjoy a majority of his run at Kentucky. I also agree it was getting rocky at the end of his Kentucky run. He knew that too or he wouldn’t have bolted for Minnesota.
If bogans doesn’t injure his ankle we probably win the title, and we should’ve went to the ff in 05 because sparks was fouled on that 3.
One great recruiting class won't, usually, win you a title. The '01 and '02 recruiting classes had 1 great player each and no one else who was UK caliber. '03 and '05 had no one who was UK caliber. In '06, when the best player of the '04 class was gone, we added one guy who would end up a great player and one who maybe pans out if he doesn't get injured and ruined by Billy G (Jasper). We lacked depth and we had NO UK caliber power forwards between Hayes and Patterson - 5 straight recruiting classes without a DECENT power forward killed Tubby.
Tubby was a good coach. Tubby wasn't a great coach. He absolutely rode the wave that Rick created to that title. But he DID have to coach that team, and he also did a lot of good - but not great - things over the subsequent 7 years. It was time for him to go when he went and I was happy to see him leave.