10-2

[Nitt1300]

is a .833 winning percentage
which is better than our historical average
and better than any past coach's winning percentage

just saying

 

[LionsAndBears]

is a .833 winning percentage
which is better than our historical average
and better than any past coach's winning percentage

just saying

10-2 isn't a problem. 10-2 is a Top 10 program which is what we are historically. The problem is that historically we would have a championship contender in between a few of those 10-2 teams and right now, under the current philosophy of this program we don't have the ability to rise above 10-2.

Either the philosophy needs to change or the leadership of the program needs to change if we want to get back to being a championship contender.

 

[Nitt1300]

10-2 isn't a problem. 10-2 is a Top 10 program which is what we are historically. The problem is that historically we would have a championship contender in between a few of those 10-2 teams and right now, under the current philosophy of this program we don't have the ability to rise above 10-2.

Either the philosophy needs to change or the leadership of the program needs to change if we want to get back to being a championship contender.

Old guy here, but the only history we have that is remotely relatable to today is what we've done since we started playing a Big Ten schedule.

That history began in 1993, and since 1993 we have had exactly one team that was a serious part of the national championship conversation and that was 1994. It's long past time to stop remembering a history that we never had.

I too wish it were better, but pretending that we once were on Alabama's or even tOSU's level is deluding ourselves.

 

[canuckhal]

10-2 > 7-5 and certainly better than 4-5, but let's revisit at end of season. 6-6 still possible, but unlikely.

 

[LionsAndBears]

Old guy here, but the only history we have that is remotely relatable to today is what we've done since we started playing a Big Ten schedule.

That history began in 1993, and since 1993 we have had exactly one team that was a serious part of the national championship conversation and that was 1994. It's long past time to stop remembering a history that we never had.

I too wish it were better, but pretending that we once were on Alabama's or even tOSU's level is deluding ourselves.

Late 40s guy here and in the late 70s and 80s we were championship contenders. It isn't a delusion. We haven't been that program for a long time but to act like we weren't that kind of program is the real delusion.

 

[Midnighter]

is a .833 winning percentage
which is better than our historical average
and better than any past coach's winning percentage

just saying

Georgia thinks better of itself than we do I guess. They had two NCs (1942, 1980) before last year. They fired a guy who did better in the SEC than Franklin has done in the B1G. We’re historically a better program than Georgia too. Want to get better? Do something about it. Saying ‘well, we’ve never been that good so be happy with what we have’ is insane - what kind of fans think like that?

I predicted 9-3; sticking with it.

 

[BobPSU92]

is a .833 winning percentage
which is better than our historical average
and better than any past coach's winning percentage

just saying

The issue people have is losing the two big games and how they lost. They got blown out by um and they had a good chance to beat Tosu and blew it. On top of that, neither result against um and Tosu is a first under Franklin.

If they finish 10-2, it’s an empty 10-2 given those two losses. Had the losses been closer, they would be a bit easier to take.

Winning percentage is just a number. It doesn’t tell the whole story.

 

[PSUJam]

Either the philosophy needs to change or the leadership of the program needs to change if we want to get back to being a championship contender.

Well, they just hired a new AD that is all in on football so I guess maybe give him more than 8 months?

 

[leinbacker]

I remember when 10-2 was beating the #1 team I the country 48-14. Then following that feat with a takedown of the #8 team in the Fiesta Bowl lead by Heisman winner Marcus Allen.

Today it means getting a beat down by the two teams with a pulse on the schedule and beating, sometimes struggling, with the little sisters on the schedule.

 

[BW Lion]

is a .833 winning percentage
which is better than our historical average
and better than any past coach's winning percentage

just saying

Even you have admit the idiocy of your post.

How has PSU fared so far this year against its true peers? 0-2

 

[NoSoup4U]

Old guy here, but the only history we have that is remotely relatable to today is what we've done since we started playing a Big Ten schedule.

That history began in 1993, and since 1993 we have had exactly one team that was a serious part of the national championship conversation and that was 1994. It's long past time to stop remembering a history that we never had.

I too wish it were better, but pretending that we once were on Alabama's or even tOSU's level is deluding ourselves.

well 2005 was darn close like a couple of gift seconds to scUM close

 

[PSU87]

well 2005 was darn close like a couple of gift seconds to scUM close

I would argue in 2005, 2008 and 2016 we were in the conversation until the final weekend.

 

[PSU12046]

Old guy here, but the only history we have that is remotely relatable to today is what we've done since we started playing a Big Ten schedule.

That history began in 1993, and since 1993 we have had exactly one team that was a serious part of the national championship conversation and that was 1994. It's long past time to stop remembering a history that we never had.

I too wish it were better, but pretending that we once were on Alabama's or even tOSU's level is deluding ourselves.

Robinson played college football at Penn State. He played quarterback and wide receiver, leading the team to a Big Ten Conference title in 2005 and being recognized as the Big Ten Offensive Player of the Year in 2005. He won the Chicago Tribune Silver Football as the Big Ten's MVP.
Derrick Williams became the first player under the coaching of Joe Paterno to score a touchdown on a catch, run, and kick return in the same game, when he accomplished the feat against the Illinois Fighting Illini on September 27, 2008. The Nittany Lions won the game 38-24.

 

[blion72]

10-2 isn't a problem. 10-2 is a Top 10 program which is what we are historically. The problem is that historically we would have a championship contender in between a few of those 10-2 teams and right now, under the current philosophy of this program we don't have the ability to rise above 10-2.

Either the philosophy needs to change or the leadership of the program needs to change if we want to get back to being a championship contender.

I think if we get 10-2 this year you have to be more than happy. with 4 games to go and only 1 starting OL playing, everyone of the 4 games could go south.

• Indiana will be off bye week and likely play surprises. bet they use the running QB so all the film will mean nothing. Allen D vs Clifford will have some angle. weather looks like wind and rain.
• Maryland will likely have their QB back magically. we need to understand that Maryland considers Penn State the target - they know the others hammer them.
• Rutgers - should feel safe here but depends on where we are at.
• Sparty - given their situation we should have massive advantage but this game has been some kind of fluke every year.

10-2 would be massive success and NY6 game with new QB1. to me this is great story. still it would not surprise me to have at least one of these games go south. Staff probably thinks that the team has better chance getting 10-2 with Clifford than Allar at QB. If Clifford is going to use his running as a weapon maybe so, but for whatever reason Clifford has largely stopped running and the opponents know it.

 

[BostonNit]

is a .833 winning percentage
which is better than our historical average
and better than any past coach's winning percentage

just say

Cherry picking. How about cherry picking 11-11 over two seasons and noting that that's worse than our historical average and worse than any coach's winning percentage?

 

[LaJollaCreek]

Cherry picking. How about cherry picking 11-11 over two seasons and noting that that's worse than our historical average and worse than any coach's winning percentage?

So you cherry pick to call out cherry picking....good angle?

 

[Nitt1300]

Even you have admit the idiocy of your post.

How has PSU fared so far this year against its true peers? 0-2

We're peers now? That's great news! I assume the process included a court expunging our abysmal head-to head records against those two institutions?

Clearly this changes everything, and coaches and players must be held accountable to this new standard- and fired immediately.

Any chance we could get the same kind of ruling against Alabama and become truly "elite"?

 

[LaJollaCreek]

We're peers now? That's great news! I assume the process included a court expunging our abysmal head-to head records against those two institutions?

Clearly this changes everything, and coaches and players must be held accountable to this new standard- and fired immediately.

Any chance we could get the same kind of ruling against Alabama and become truly "elite"?

The fact he thinks PSU is on par with tOSU tells me he's still in denial.....neither is UM BTW.

 

[marshall23]

Even you have admit the idiocy of your post.

How has PSU fared so far this year against its true peers? 0-2

How has every team in college football done against our "true peers?" LOL

 

[marshall23]

Cherry picking. How about cherry picking 11-11 over two seasons and noting that that's worse than our historical average and worse than any coach's winning percentage?

What about 4 top twenty, 3 top ten, 3 NY6 bowls in the past 7 years. With a chance to make it 4 in 8?
"Our" LOL.
Your post is in the cherry picking hall of fame.

 

[marshall23]

I think if we get 10-2 this year you have to be more than happy. with 4 games to go and only 1 starting OL playing, everyone of the 4 games could go south.

• Indiana will be off bye week and likely play surprises. bet they use the running QB so all the film will mean nothing. Allen D vs Clifford will have some angle. weather looks like wind and rain.
• Maryland will likely have their QB back magically. we need to understand that Maryland considers Penn State the target - they know the others hammer them.
• Rutgers - should feel safe here but depends on where we are at.
• Sparty - given their situation we should have massive advantage but this game has been some kind of fluke every year.

10-2 would be massive success and NY6 game with new QB1. to me this is great story. still it would not surprise me to have at least one of these games go south. Staff probably thinks that the team has better chance getting 10-2 with Clifford than Allar at QB. If Clifford is going to use his running as a weapon maybe so, but for whatever reason Clifford has largely stopped running and the opponents know it.

I'm on "cloud nine" at 10-2 and another NY6. I can be happy with 9-3 as 8-4 was where most of the betters and services placed this team preseason. Those who continually scream "WE DESERVE BETTER," never matured from their youthful outbursts of holding their breath and stomping their feet. It wasn't cute or endearing even then. It's pathetic when exhibited by adults.

 

[FrontierLion]

Old guy here, but the only history we have that is remotely relatable to today is what we've done since we started playing a Big Ten schedule.

That history began in 1993, and since 1993 we have had exactly one team that was a serious part of the national championship conversation and that was 1994. It's long past time to stop remembering a history that we never had.

I too wish it were better, but pretending that we once were on Alabama's or even tOSU's level is deluding ourselves.

Young guy here, but still old enough to remember the 1994 team. Wasn't yet born by '86, so obviously don't remember the 80's teams.

But, Nitt, you're spot on. I don't think there was ever a time where I thought Penn State was a national champion contender (after '94). I went to Penn State during the Daryll Clark years, and even during the B1G championship season, I think my friends and I all knew we were a notch under Texas / USC / Florida and the like. There were no delusions of truly competing for a national championship. Could we hope and dream? Of course. Could we win the B1G and a New Year's six bowl? Absolutely.

We're just not on the same level as the elite teams - and haven't been since 1994. And to remind everyone of how old you are ... that's coming up on 30(!) years ago! And that's ok with me. Penn State football is about the fun for me - watching/attending games with my wife, kids and parents. Tailgating. Flying our PSU flag outside our house. Watching our players compete and following their careers into the NFL.

I like to complain about our team every season like the rest of us, but if we go 10-2 every year, with a trip to the Rose, Orange, Cotton or other high profile bowl game, that's good enough for me.

And my parting words ... please for the love of God start Drew Allar this week.

 

[nittanyfan333]

Even you have admit the idiocy of your post.

How has PSU fared so far this year against its true peers? 0-2

Speaking of idiocy.....

the only thing "peer" about tOSU is that we're in the same division. UM is closer, but we're still not their "peer". right now, our "peers" are MSU and WI. however it's a constantly changing group. last 2 years, our "peers" were Purdue, MD, Iowa.

I swear, some of you are as bad as ND and PITT fans. The hubris, to think we're peers with tOSU and scUM. come on.....

 

[nittanyfan333]

And my parting words ... please for the love of God start Drew Allar this week.

 

[Moogy]

Georgia thinks better of itself than we do I guess. They had two NCs (1942, 1980) before last year. They fired a guy who did better in the SEC than Franklin has done in the B1G. We’re historically a better program than Georgia too. Want to get better? Do something about it. Saying ‘well, we’ve never been that good so be happy with what we have’ is insane - what kind of fans think like that?

I predicted 9-3; sticking with it.

Well, then, the first move will be for the Pennsylvania militia to invade the state of Georgia and claim it for its own. When that happens, we'll have easy access to all the top recruits down there, and in neighboring states. You're in charge, General Midnighter. Assemble the troops.

In the class of 2023, the state of Georgia has 23 recruits in the top 250 on 247. PA has 3. PA's 2nd best recruit is ranked 151. Georgia has 13 prospective recruits ranked better than that. In 2022, it was 26 to 7, again very top heavy for Georgia, with only 2 PA recruits in the top 150, but Georgia having 8 in the top 51 alone (15 in the top 150). Not to mention the talent available just across the border.

 

[Midnighter]

Well, then, the first move will be for the Pennsylvania militia to invade the state of Georgia and claim it for its own. When that happens, we'll have easy access to all the top recruits down there, and in neighboring states. You're in charge, General Midnighter. Assemble the troops.

In the class of 2023, the state of Georgia has 23 recruits in the top 250 on 247. PA has 3. PA's 2nd best recruit is ranked 151. Georgia has 13 prospective recruits ranked better than that. In 2022, it was 26 to 7, again very top heavy for Georgia, with only 2 PA recruits in the top 150, but Georgia having 8 in the top 51 alone (15 in the top 150). Not to mention the talent available just across the border.

So, did Georgia suddenly get better high school football prospects, or did they just start keeping them in-state? My guess is Georgia under Richt recruited pretty well. PSU's natural recruiting territory includes all of the NE, west to Illinois, the Mid-Atlantic, and now some of Florida. The recruits are there - just have to stop them from going to Clemson, Oklahoma, and Notre Dame. Are we back to blaming recruiting? I mean, CJF has had two top ten classes.....

 

[leinbacker]

How has every team in college football done against our "true peers?" LOL

So we are like every team in college football now, the Rutgers, East Carolinas of the football world are now our peers.

 

[marshall23]

So we are like every team in college football now, the Rutgers, East Carolinas of the football world are now our peers.

It would appear from this sort of statement that you have issues with your computation skills in addition to your need for emotional control. Rutgers is something like 29-66, East Carolina approximately 36-58 during Franklin's tenure at PSU. Franklin coached PSU going into this season was 67-34. I suggest to avoid embarrassing posts, you read them before you hit "post replay."

 

[Nits1989]

Not that it matters, but I’ll be happy with 10-2. Hope they improve through the rest of the season.

 

[BobPSU92]

Not that it matters, but I’ll be happy with 10-2. Hope they improve through the rest of the season.

Judging improvement will be difficult given the level of competition. Compare PSU versus um and then MINNY. . PSU OBVIOUSLY. looked better against MINNY. , but did they improve?

 

[PSUSignore]

Late 40s guy here and in the late 70s and 80s we were championship contenders. It isn't a delusion. We haven't been that program for a long time but to act like we weren't that kind of program is the real delusion.

Did that era of CFB have 3-4 teams recruiting better talent than everyone else in the country and dominating on the field every single season? And did PSU have to play against one of those 3 every single year? This is a completely different era, the program records and the stuff that worked in for programs in the 70s and 80s is irrelevant.

 

[BiochemPSU]

I don't think anyone is saying 10-2 is bad. I think the problem is what the 2 losses represent: a clear bronze medal position to OSU and now Michigan. That's not going to help recruiting, and PSU needs better recruits to beat those two schools.

And the second glaring issue with the two losses is that we gambled on a 6th year, non-returning QB taking us over the top against those two teams. It didn't happen. And the consequence is that our 5 star QB recruit from Ohio sat the bench. Maybe he benefited from sitting a year. Maybe the coaches thought he would get killed behind this line and two freshman RBs. Maybe he is the second coming of Tim Tebow and none of this matters. But if he has a horrible year next season, it's going to be real easy to second guess the choices that were made this season that impacted it. That's not going to help recruiting.

 

[Moogy]

So, did Georgia suddenly get better high school football prospects, or did they just start keeping them in-state? My guess is Georgia under Richt recruited pretty well. PSU's natural recruiting territory includes all of the NE, west to Illinois, the Mid-Atlantic, and now some of Florida. The recruits are there - just have to stop them from going to Clemson, Oklahoma, and Notre Dame. Are we back to blaming recruiting? I mean, CJF has had two top ten classes.....

One of the main criticisms of Richt was that he wasn't pulling in enough talent despite being able to stand outside his office and hit a ton of 5 stars by taking out the pitching wedge and laying up.

Yeah, Richt's recruiting classes were in the range of 6-12 nationally ... under Smart they're 1-3 each year. Smart came aboard in 2016, so let's take the 2017 recruiting class up through the 2022 class ... Georgia had 27 5-stars in that period. PSU had 7 (Micah, Slade, Shorter, B.Smith, Dennis-Sutton, Singleton, Allar - so 3 of them are frosh this year, whereas Georgia has been pulling in multiples each year).

LOL at the "natural territory." No. Having to try to go out around to that huge a portion of the country, scouring for prospects isn't the same as having a nearly unlimited supply of studs in your backyard. This ain't the 80's. Up here in NE, many people (especially the sports folks) still refer to PSU with the P not standing for something complimentary. We don't have a ton of 5 stars running around up here, but we have some decent talent, and Notre Dame and Michigan are pulling most of them, because of their academic status (and the Irish Catholic presence up here ... which is why BC still gets an occasional good one, and the leftovers that national programs don't want). We were able to steal Rappleyea away from UM, but that's likely to do with the fact that he's really a New Yawkah who just came up this way for boarding school. Pitt actually has a pretty good presence up here ... if not for football, than other sports, at least. But PSU recruiting is basically nonexistent up this way, for any sport, even if there's a decent fanbase still.

"Blaming recruiting"? No, just presenting facts rather than furthering some agenda of nonsense.

 

[LionInNC]

There was a time when Joe was well into his career that he was on a 4 year cycle of being a top team. He used to tell recruits that every player that played 4 years for him either played on an undefeated team, played for a national championship, or won a national championship. This is where I’d like to see Penn state get back to. 10-2 and a NY6 bowl is great, but at some point if you want to be considered a successful football program, you have to compete for championships.

 

[Nits74]

So you cherry pick to call out cherry picking....good angle?

Perfectly acceptable angle. His point is, the OP takes one year and compares it to Penn State's all time winning percentage as though it exonerates Franklin's overall record and history of losing most big games. OP is grasping at straws in my opinion. By the way, did the season end? Must have missed the remaining four games.

 

[Blair10]

10-2 without a BIG championship or CFP appearance = irrelevant.

 

[BW Lion]

The fact he thinks PSU is on par with tOSU tells me he's still in denial.....neither is UM BTW.

Stay tuned.

Next week this board, including you, is going to have the opportunity to select appropriate “peers” against which PSU Football Inc should be annually evaluated.

 

[Moogy]

There was a time when Joe was well into his career that he was on a 4 year cycle of being a top team. He used to tell recruits that every player that played 4 years for him either played on an undefeated team, played for a national championship, or won a national championship. This is where I’d like to see Penn state get back to. 10-2 and a NY6 bowl is great, but at some point if you want to be considered a successful football program, you have to compete for championships.

That "time" was a very short period of PSU football's existence, and even a fairly short portion of JoePa's coaching career, from 1978-1986 ... well, I guess you could extend it to 1975-1986, since the 75 frosh would have played in 78. And it ended 36 years ago.

 

[Nitt1300]

Perfectly acceptable angle. His point is, the OP takes one year and compares it to Penn State's all time winning percentage as though it exonerates Franklin's overall record and history of losing most big games. OP is grasping at straws in my opinion. By the way, did the season end? Must have missed the remaining four games.

What makes you think that I was talking about this year- or any particular year? I was actually going after something a little broader.

There is another current thread on the board that bemoans our ceiling as being 10-2, as if anyone knows that and as if that is somehow below where we "belong". I'm merely trying to provide some historical perspective- that we've never been who many of us seem to think we were. And I say that as one of the very lucky fans who was a student on campus for maybe our best run of all time, 1968-71.

 

[Indian rocks rich]

10-2 > 7-5 and certainly better than 4-5, but let's revisit at end of season. 6-6 still possible, but unlikely.

Yes let’s see how PSU plays today will most likely determine how the rest of season will go.