I don't doubt that you don't have malice when you say it. Like I said, give it some thought.
Another EV thread
- Thread starter T-TownDawgg
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I don't doubt that you don't have malice when you say it. Like I said, give it some thought.
"made a huge dent". But a huge dent in what (other than our bank account) ? Until the major polluters (India, China, Russia et al) get on board with this, what exactly is our spending these trillions of dollars going to accomplish other than appeasing our climate whacks ?
There's no doubt an EV has several major advantages over a gasoline car, performance being a big one. But 2 stops totaling 40 minutes at very limited possible stopping points (plus potentially a longer side trip in NO depending on if your hotel provides a charging station) vs 1 stop for 5 minutes at any exit is still a deal breaker for me. Plus, the payback period for the excess cost over a comparable gasoline vehicle is really long.
...and there is really no way to calculate the "payback period" until the states and feds finish figuring out how to rape EV owners for all of the road usage taxes they can .
I'd be willing to bet some of you Luddites had ancestors that made fun of the guy who invented the wheel.
This isn't inventing the 17ing wheel. It's still the same 4 seats and a steering wheel riding on asphalt they want to force you into paying 100k for, and carbon shame you for pumping fuel.
The irony of your attempted insult insists that my reply is:
If EV's are considered the new wheel, keeping them attached to the vehicle should be Job 1.
The irony of your attempted insult insists that my reply is:
If EV's are considered the new wheel, keeping them attached to the vehicle should be Job 1.
I'll bet you that high-tech electric robot will have oil fill tube for lubricating internals. And should require frequent oil change intervals.
He is my problem with EVs and Hybrids. 1. The batteries and battery production is toxic on the level of nuclear waste disposal toxic. What's going to become of all these batteries in a few years? It's not like they can crunch a Tesla and melt it to make sheet metal or rebar. 2. The pace of innovation in the EV world is making a 3-4 year old car obsolete. Manufacturers aren't going to support fourth generation technology when they are already building eighth generation cars. This is going to make EVs and Hybrids disposable cars with no long term value. You can now finance a car for 72 months in some cases, what's going to happen when you can't even buy parts to repair a car you're still making payments on?
Don't do it. Sounds like you live a long way from a dealership and it will be there a lot. I'm 100 miles from a dealership and it was a real mother17er. You'll never get a loaner, because they are always loaded up with warranty work. Also, a real kick in the nuts. Your only remote start option (Volvo on call app) will cost you $200 a year after the first 4 years.
If you live in the city, Volvo is fine. But you need to be close to the dealership. Highest cost of ownership vehicle we have ever owned.
I guaran17ingtee you I end with the one one that becomes sentient and wants to turn the tables and "try new things" with me. Why can't we have dumb robots, oh no, we gotta give these 17ers the ability to think for themselves.
None of us really know if EV’s will work. But, I am at least willing to listen while having a backup plan.
plug in hybrid route seems the best option to me, Volvo just seemed to have that option now. I owned one Volvo in the past and swore off them as well. For now, gas burners are what I use but I will keep an ear to the ground.
plug in hybrid route seems the best option to me, Volvo just seemed to have that option now. I owned one Volvo in the past and swore off them as well. For now, gas burners are what I use but I will keep an ear to the ground.
I did not call anyone retarded. I don't do "letter" words. I don't give any word that much power over me. Words don't matter, the intended meanings of those words is what matters. If I called golfr a "good guy" that would quickly become the gg words. "Severe Intellectual Disablilties" means the same exact thing. But I was talking about an idea or process being retarded. You probably don't like the word niggardly.
The western governments are outlawing gas powered vehicle by 2035. That is 12.5 years away. Sounds pretty extreme to me. All negative aspects of electric vehicles are not part of the discussion. The push is to ignore all those things. It takes natural resources to create EVs and those are just as limited as petroleum maybe more. We are not building nuclear power plants to power all those EVs. Many very dedicated environmentalist think that is the solution and most of them were against nuclear energy for most of their lives. The geniuses think solar and wind can cover it all. That is a retarded idea. They NEVER will be able supply the electric needs of the future.
Actually I found articles in the NYTimes and NPR and NBC and earthworks.org that does express the mining issues. The earthworks article is particulary scary in that it's final paragraph reads:
In order to ensure that our clean energy economy is truly clean—as well as just and sustainable—we must develop a shared commitment to responsible mineral sourcing, recycling and reuse, coupled with a reduction in overall energy and mineral demand.
With world populations growing and technology advancing not sure how there is a possibilty of overall energy reduction. Unless you stop growing food, like in the Netherlands, to reduce the surplus population. Soylent Green. State of Fear. Inferno. And a TED talk with Yuval Harari. He said in this talk:
Yuval Noah Harari, historian, futurist, and World Economic Forum (WEF) adviser, said, “We just don’t need the vast majority of the population” in the early 21st century given modern technologies’ rendering human labor economically and militarily “redundant.”
The geniuses basically want you dead.
And finally The tech would have not come sooner and it won't be ready in 12.5 years.
The western governments are outlawing gas powered vehicle by 2035. That is 12.5 years away. Sounds pretty extreme to me. All negative aspects of electric vehicles are not part of the discussion. The push is to ignore all those things. It takes natural resources to create EVs and those are just as limited as petroleum maybe more. We are not building nuclear power plants to power all those EVs. Many very dedicated environmentalist think that is the solution and most of them were against nuclear energy for most of their lives. The geniuses think solar and wind can cover it all. That is a retarded idea. They NEVER will be able supply the electric needs of the future.
Actually I found articles in the NYTimes and NPR and NBC and earthworks.org that does express the mining issues. The earthworks article is particulary scary in that it's final paragraph reads:
In order to ensure that our clean energy economy is truly clean—as well as just and sustainable—we must develop a shared commitment to responsible mineral sourcing, recycling and reuse, coupled with a reduction in overall energy and mineral demand.
With world populations growing and technology advancing not sure how there is a possibilty of overall energy reduction. Unless you stop growing food, like in the Netherlands, to reduce the surplus population. Soylent Green. State of Fear. Inferno. And a TED talk with Yuval Harari. He said in this talk:
Yuval Noah Harari, historian, futurist, and World Economic Forum (WEF) adviser, said, “We just don’t need the vast majority of the population” in the early 21st century given modern technologies’ rendering human labor economically and militarily “redundant.”
The geniuses basically want you dead.
And finally The tech would have not come sooner and it won't be ready in 12.5 years.
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Yes, it is clear you like to use that word.
I wasn't absent that day, I just recognize that many people do hold onto what is said to them or about them, in spite of a children's rhyme.
It just goes back to whether someone wants to try to be decent towards others or if they want to stand on a principle that really doesnt further caring or politeness.
Of course you don't have to change your language. You are obviously free to use whatever hurtful language you want while claiming it isnt hurtful. It just isn't necessary.
It is the total number per sale of 100,000 vehicles of that specific type. I.e. there are 25 fires per 100,000 EVs sold, 3,400 fires per 100,000 hybrids sold, and 1,400 fires per 100,000 ICE vehicles sold.
The numbers make sense to me in a way. A fire can start from an electrical system or by the very flammable combustible fluid that you put in it. A hybrid has both systems. Gas fires generally start more easily than electrical fires. However, as I said before, a fire department won't put out an EV fire. It will just have to burn itself out because the battery will continue to burn, even if it was dropped in the ocean. But in terms of raw numbers, EVs catch fire far less often than the other types.
The numbers make sense to me in a way. A fire can start from an electrical system or by the very flammable combustible fluid that you put in it. A hybrid has both systems. Gas fires generally start more easily than electrical fires. However, as I said before, a fire department won't put out an EV fire. It will just have to burn itself out because the battery will continue to burn, even if it was dropped in the ocean. But in terms of raw numbers, EVs catch fire far less often than the other types.
Payback period depends on several factors. My out of pocket each month vs what I was paying just for operating costs is slightly more than $300 now. When I got it and gas was at $4.50 a gallon, I looked like a genius because I was out about $200 a month. So once I get it paid for, my operating costs are much less and the payback will start to look reasonable.
For most people though - payback is a lot longer. I drive more than most people do, so my payback will be a lot shorter than most people.
The 30 minute stop got him enough range that he didn't need to stop in NO. Plus, it was just convenient for him to stop for that time. He said he didn't have to, just wanted to. He could have stopped twice for about 10 minutes each and had enough charge to get to NO. He could have then charged overnight at the hotel, but he didn't have to do that.
Tesla estimates annual fuel savings of $1,100/year for a Model 3. The Model 3 costs $63,000. A BMW 330e, which is a comparable, but better car, costs $45,000. And you'd have to cut Tesla's estimated fuel savings in about half because the 330e is a plug in hybrid. The math just doesn't support buying the Tesla.
Some folks will have to change out the whole rear end. I bet that'll be costly. And where is the battery and robotics landfill? That place will be something else! Will there be all electric junk yards? You can get parts for your car and lover in one place!
We can stop including China in this list of polluters. China is fully committed to being carbon neutral by 2060, and China has a way of making its citizens meet its goals. Yeah, it would be nice if they could reach that goal earlier, but they are in a pretty deep hole since they currently rely on so much coal.
China is the World leader in alternative energy research and use. They lead the world in EV production and consumption. They recently pledged to stop building or financing coal power plants in foreign countries, and will stop building coal plants domestically by at least 2030.
India just wants to get paid to comply. They probably will eventually get it.
Russia seems to be solving their pollution problem the hard way.
I hope you forgot the *******.
https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-by-country/
https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-by-country/
Toyota is behind the other manufacturers because it was going another direction. Toyota believed its hybrid technology was the perfect combination of low emissions and reliability. I agree.
Toyota was trying to develop hydrogen fuel technology for the future, but then realized EVs were going to be needed.
AFAIK, Toyota still has not announced a date for when it will no longer manufacture ICE vehicles.
Not sure what the point of this is. Of course China leads the world in overall pollution / emissions. They have 1.5 billion people. The thing that should be of concern to US citizens is that we are #2 overall, and per capita emissions in the US are twice what they are in China….even with all the coal reliance over there.
The US having 50% of the C02 emissions of China while only having 20% of the population is something that is alarming, and something I honestly didn’t realize until clicking that link.
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Hope China doesnt report its CO2 number like its reported covid. March 2020 - March 2022 was effectively 0 cases and only 5,000 deaths in total since the start.
That country wont report actual numbers for CO2. It will report what it feels like reporting when it feels like reporting.
I’m not super expert level on this, but I think air quality is something that can be much more easily verified and audited by a 3rd party than the case rate of COVID infections. Not exactly hard to capture samples of air and measure C02 ppm.
ETA: Even if you forget China and just look at the rest of the G6, the US is lagging way behind. Below are the per capita numbers for each of the G6 countries:
US - 15.52
Japan - 9.70
Germany - 9.44
Italy - 5.9
UK - 5.55
France - 5.13
Also of note, India who is #3 in overall C02 emissions and now has just 100 million fewer citizens than China, has a minute 1.91 per capita emissions ratio.
It’s hard to look at all that data and conclude anything other than the US having by far and away the biggest responsibility of any developed nation to improve its CO2 emissions to more closely align with global benchmarks.
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The Wright Bros first flight went only 100 yards or so. The first automobile (ICE) had 3 wheels and went about 10 MPH. Give it time and technology will improve how they work. Ain't nobody forcing you to buy one of these so you can quit your BS hyperventilating about it.
Fully agree with everything here. The US is atrociously high and for years now some in our country have said 'we need to change' without having a realistic plan, and some in our country have outright denied this is even a problem. Tough to make any real and measurable progress.
You are correct. Further research confirms it’s an estimated parameter from economic and infrastructure data. That’s still way easier to fact check than the COVID numbers. We all know China was lying about that, but not to what extent because they essentially stonewalled the WHO and other similar entities. For emissions data, I’m not sure they care enough to lie about it….considering that they seem to be acknowledging the problem and are taking mitigation steps. If they were going to lie about it, they’d probably lie big….like they did with COVID.
Regardless….the buck doesn’t stop with China. Other developed nations who are our allies and have trusted data are still doing way better than the US in regards to greenhouse gas emissions. We’re bringing up the rear in terms of the developed world, and there’s no sugarcoating it.
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Buy an EV if you wish, but we aren't anywhere near everybody in this country going 100% electric. I just got home from an Engineering conference and one slide in particular caught my eye. I've been of the the opinion that the infrastructure isn't there, but never saw it in black and white. Last year the US consumed 135 billion gallons of gasoline. If you do the math, this would be the equivalent of 4.8 trillion kWh of electricity. So if everyone could magically be converted to an EV, we would need 4.8 trillion kWh to do that. Now last year, 4.2 trillion kWh of electricity was generated to power EVERYTHING else.
Full out EV for everyone is a pie in the sky political talking point. And it won't be completely "green" until errbody can embrace nuclear as the main source of generation.
Full out EV for everyone is a pie in the sky political talking point. And it won't be completely "green" until errbody can embrace nuclear as the main source of generation.
US CO2 emissions have been on a downward trend for several years now. Yes it’s still high but it’s going down.
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1st - Ford and GM both placed their upper trucks at over 100k.
2nd - Wheels- Seems like they got some ****** rims. Just replace them with american racing aluminum rims and off you go.
I just bought a fully loaded Yukon, but I am waiting my place in line to buy the new Silverado.
2nd - Wheels- Seems like they got some ****** rims. Just replace them with american racing aluminum rims and off you go.
I just bought a fully loaded Yukon, but I am waiting my place in line to buy the new Silverado.
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