Are we supposed to just forget the Saturday night debacle?

Thebulldogcountry1

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So the SEC walked back most of the suspensions and tried to mitigate the disaster they created on Saturday night. This give a whole new meaning to the phrase "That's a the least I could do." It is truly the absolute least they could do to make things right. They admitted they screwed up by reinstating some of the players. They did nothing else beyond that. No public apology. No names were given. No promise to do better next time.

They still upheld suspensions for players (Kohler) who did absolutely nothing wrong, and they expect everyone to just forget about it and move on. It's unacceptable to expect everyone to just forget about what some nameless, faceless cowards in another state created Saturday night.
 

patdog

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Doesn't matter if we forget or not, that's all we're going to get from the SEC office. Which is a lot more than I expected. They still cost us a chance to win the Saturday night game. Don't know that we would have won it, but they took any chance away with the ejections.
 

HuntDawg

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Not sure what you want done?

The go back and replay the game isnt going to happen. The no contest isnt going to happen... and it shouldnt happen. The game was finished, we lost. Its not different than a player getting ejected targeting then the SEC office or whatever say it was a bad call.... The game doesnt go back and start over, or its a ruled a tie/no contest anything like that.

I feel like there are now steps in place to keep that from happening in the future... but i dont think it will be announced by the SEC or should it be.

Was obviously a mistaken. They reversed a lot of the ejection penailities the next day. Case closed.

Keep in mind...had Long not started this entire mess nothing would have happened. Long acts right, nothing happens, game continues as is.
 

HuntDawg

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Nobody would have cared if Long had been suspended.
agree. But long started the fire that the umpires/SEC had to put out. The didnt put it out the correct way in my opinion, or anyones opinion. However they had to put the fire out. I doubt they put a fire out like that in the future...

However, again... Long doesnt start the fire. There is no fire to put out.
 
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patdog

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Not sure what you want done?

The go back and replay the game isnt going to happen. The no contest isnt going to happen... and it shouldnt happen. The game was finished, we lost. Its not different than a player getting ejected targeting then the SEC office or whatever say it was a bad call.... The game doesnt go back and start over, or its a ruled a tie/no contest anything like that.

I feel like there are now steps in place to keep that from happening in the future... but i dont think it will be announced by the SEC or should it be.

Was obviously a mistaken. They reversed a lot of the ejection penailities the next day. Case closed.

Keep in mind...had Long not started this entire mess nothing would have happened. Long acts right, nothing happens, game continues as is.
I think everything after the ejections is a reversable error. The review officials weren't even supposed to be looking at anything other than whether or not Long blocked the plate. Should go down as a tie game. Everything else I agree with.
 

GloryDawg

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I was wondering who made the decision on Saturday to eject all those guys? Was it the replay guy or the officials on the field?
 

patdog

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I was wondering who made the decision on Saturday to eject all those guys? Was it the replay guy or the officials on the field?
Replay guys. Officials on the field were basically apologizing to the coaches for it. They were just going to warn everyone, send them back to the dugouts and play ball with only 1 ejection.
 

HuntDawg

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I think everything after the ejections is a reversable error. The review officials weren't even supposed to be looking at anything other than whether or not Long blocked the plate. Should go down as a tie game. Everything else I agree with.
Couldnt disagree with that more. This board is complaining because we lost.

Again countless examples of botched calls in sports everywhere.. then after time we realize wasnt the right call, right decision, etc. Doesnt mean after the fact we get to look at that and go back and fix it.... The game plays on.

My understanding is ones there is an altercation.. video can be used to determine ejections. So based on what I understand, the league office could step in and review things.
 
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Son_of_34

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Unless all schools get together and file some sort of grievance regarding officials nothing is going to happen
 

HuntDawg

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Replay guys. Officials on the field were basically apologizing to the coaches for it. They were just going to warn everyone, send them back to the dugouts and play ball with only 1 ejection.
This is where i think they messed up. Had the umpires on the field, known what to do and how to handle the situation. It never gets to the SEC office... I dont think they knew how to handle it, or how they were going to handle it.. and it got sent to Bham.

Had they come out and did what you said. Immediatley eject Long, issue warnings to both sides, a call to Bham isnt even made.. and we likely play on and restart within 10 minutes.
 

karlchilders.sixpack

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I think they could not reach a quick conclusion, threw up their hands.
Decided they would just throw everybody out, (to send a message).
With plans to sort it out later.
 

patdog

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This is where i think they messed up. Had the umpires on the field, known what to do and how to handle the situation. It never gets to the SEC office... I dont think they knew how to handle it, or how they were going to handle it.. and it got sent to Bham.

Had they come out and did what you said. Immediatley eject Long, issue warnings to both sides, a call to Bham isnt even made.. and we likely play on and restart within 10 minutes.
The umpires on the field knew how to handle it and they did handle it. Then the Georgia manager challenged the call of whether or not Long blocked the plate before he had the ball, so it went to review, and then all hell broke loose. But the blocking the plate call is ALL that went to review.
 

thatsbaseball

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This is where i think they messed up. Had the umpires on the field, known what to do and how to handle the situation. It never gets to the SEC office... I dont think they knew how to handle it, or how they were going to handle it.. and it got sent to Bham.

Had they come out and did what you said. Immediatley eject Long, issue warnings to both sides, a call to Bham isnt even made.. and we likely play on and restart within 10 minutes.
This is exactly what needed happen. Every crew that calls an SEC game should have at least one member trained and capable of making this call on the field. The conference has all the money in the world and could make this happen.
 

HuntDawg

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The umpires on the field knew how to handle it and they did handle it. Then the Georgia manager challenged the call of whether or not Long blocked the plate before he had the ball, so it went to review, and then all hell broke loose. But the blocking the plate call is ALL that went to review.
I disagree. Had they had the intention of throwing Long out, they would have done it immediatley on the spot without review. They looked confused by the situation, when that happened Johnson (rightfully so) asked the umpires to get help... and leaned on review to handle it. Then as we know.. review crapped the bed with all that.

I dont even think Johnson says a word about blocking the plate or the contact had Long been ejected,,, only after nothing was done.
 

Seinfeld

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This is where i think they messed up. Had the umpires on the field, known what to do and how to handle the situation. It never gets to the SEC office... I dont think they knew how to handle it, or how they were going to handle it.. and it got sent to Bham.

Had they come out and did what you said. Immediatley eject Long, issue warnings to both sides, a call to Bham isnt even made.. and we likely play on and restart within 10 minutes.
The part that I'm struggling with here is... even without a black and white rulebook in place, my 8 year old could've figured out how to handle this. Eject long, confirm whether any other additional players threw punches, got overly physical, etc, and then eject them too. If no, then they get back to the dugouts and resume play.

So how is it that between the on field umpires and the self-proclaimed gurus that sit in the Birmingham ivory tower, no one had the mental aptitude to make an even remotely reasonable decision based on the facts at hand? At the very least, and maybe I missed this, but what "rule" did the ejected players break to lead the office to the decision to eject them? I'm not expecting anything to change as far as the results of the game, but this wasn't a questionable foul ball or strike being called. It was one of the biggest clusters that I've seen in the history of the game, and I think that the the team, administration, and fans deserve a short walk through the thought process that led to this abomination
 

TXDawg.sixpack

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agree. But long started the fire that the umpires/SEC had to put out. The didnt put it out the correct way in my opinion, or anyones opinion. However they had to put the fire out. I doubt they put a fire out like that in the future...

However, again... Long doesnt start the fire. There is no fire to put out.
As discussed before, Long’s reaction was in response to a dirty slide by the UGA base runner.

Also, the on-field umpires resolved the issue as they saw fit (no ejections). THEN the Birmingham office stepped in and ejected 11 players for no reason (while in the process giving a pass to multiple UGA players that should’ve been ejected).

Only a fan base as dumb as ours would schitt on our own player and blame him for the debacle that occurred.
 

TXDawg.sixpack

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This is where i think they messed up. Had the umpires on the field, known what to do and how to handle the situation. It never gets to the SEC office... I dont think they knew how to handle it, or how they were going to handle it.. and it got sent to Bham.

Had they come out and did what you said. Immediatley eject Long, issue warnings to both sides, a call to Bham isnt even made.. and we likely play on and restart within 10 minutes.
Wrong again…it got to Birmingham because UGA’s coach initiated a review to determine if Long was blocking the plate (he wasn’t).
 

HuntDawg

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Wrong again…it got to Birmingham because UGA’s coach initiated a review to determine if Long was blocking the plate (he wasn’t).
Wrong wasnt sent to bham because of blocking the plate... it was sent to see if there was malicious contact at home plate.... there is not a rule in place to review "blocking"
 

Bulldog Bruce

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Why is there a protest rule still in the rule book? This game should have obviously been protested. And by the change of suspensions, this protest should have been upheld and play resumed from that point with the players who now were not suspended. They should have done that before the final game. However due to logistics they don't ever follow their own rule. MLB got rid of it.

protest rule.png

Kinda like a 5 inning rainout which doesn't seem to exist any longer.
 

HuntDawg

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The part that I'm struggling with here is... even without a black and white rulebook in place, my 8 year old could've figured out how to handle this. Eject long, confirm whether any other additional players threw punches, got overly physical, etc, and then eject them too. If no, then they get back to the dugouts and resume play.

So how is it that between the on field umpires and the self-proclaimed gurus that sit in the Birmingham ivory tower, no one had the mental aptitude to make an even remotely reasonable decision based on the facts at hand? At the very least, and maybe I missed this, but what "rule" did the ejected players break to lead the office to the decision to eject them? I'm not expecting anything to change as far as the results of the game, but this wasn't a questionable foul ball or strike being called. It was one of the biggest clusters that I've seen in the history of the game, and I think that the the team, administration, and fans deserve a short walk through the thought process that led to this abomination

I agree. Eject long immediately and this plays on without any issues. When nothing was done to long, Johnson questioned that (which I and most everyone thinks he went overboard)... this allowed the SEC office into the decision making process that was botched

I think Long was totally in the wrong. I think the umpires shouldve handled it better on the field... the result of those two things leds to the fiasco....

but back to the main topic... its over and done with. Nothing is going to change the results, but moving forward i suspect you wont see the sec office handling those type situations
 
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I think Long starting a bunch of crap on a National televised game pissed them off and they wanted to punish us so the best they could do was make sure we lost by ejecting almost our entire team.

They couldn't give UGA the run since everything happened essentially between innings but they made up for it
 

Seinfeld

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Why is there a protest rule still in the rule book? This game should have obviously been protested. And by the change of suspensions, this protest should have been upheld and play resumed from that point with the players who now were not suspended. They should have done that before the final game. However due to logistics they don't ever follow their own rule. MLB got rid of it.

View attachment 555989

Kinda like a 5 inning rainout which doesn't seem to exist any longer.

I obviously don't know this for a fact, but I just have to think that Lemonis at least considered not resuming the game. As a passionate head coach, I just don't see how in the world he could've received that ruling and then played on because the on-field umps apologized. If he did consider not playing, then someone also must have convinced Lemonis to proceed with a promise of things being made right afterwards, and I'd think that person would either be Selmon or someone within the SEC clownshow. I'd love to know how all of this went down
 

rynodawg

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Why is there a protest rule still in the rule book? This game should have obviously been protested. And by the change of suspensions, this protest should have been upheld and play resumed from that point with the players who now were not suspended. They should have done that before the final game. However due to logistics they don't ever follow their own rule. MLB got rid of it.

View attachment 555989

Kinda like a 5 inning rainout which doesn't seem to exist any longer.
It does seem like there’s grounds to have it cancelled or ‘no contest’ since they can’t replay. Apparently Lemonis would have had to announce it was being played under protest,, no idea if he did.

The SEC replay official clearly did not interpret or enforce the NCAA altercation rule properly,, and the ejection reversals are proof they could not justify the ejections. Even the Kohler suspension still violates “Note 2” of that rule.
 

Called3rdstrikedawg

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As discussed before, Long’s reaction was in response to a dirty slide by the UGA base runner.

Also, the on-field umpires resolved the issue as they saw fit (no ejections). THEN the Birmingham office stepped in and ejected 11 players for no reason (while in the process giving a pass to multiple UGA players that should’ve been ejected).

Only a fan base as dumb as ours would schitt on our own player and blame him for the debacle that occurred.
How was a head first slide a dirty slide? Come on man!
 
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HuntDawg

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It does seem like there’s grounds to have it cancelled or ‘no contest’ since they can’t replay. Apparently Lemonis would have had to announce it was being played under protest,, no idea if he did.

The SEC replay official clearly did not interpret or enforce the NCAA altercation rule properly,, and the ejection reversals are proof they could not justify the ejections. Even the Kohler suspension still violates “Note 2” of that rule.
not sure one can protest a ruling from the league office. The entire protest rule reads about the umpire in chief. This obviously wasnt an umpire in chief decision.

IT also states each conference should have a way to handle protests... they handled it by playing on and eliminating the suspensions for the next game. Not sure you are going to get the conference to over rule something theyve already ruled on.
 

Bulldog Bruce

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not sure one can protest a ruling from the league office. The entire protest rule reads about the umpire in chief. This obviously wasnt an umpire in chief decision.

IT also states each conference should have a way to handle protests... they handled it by playing on and eliminating the suspensions for the next game. Not sure you are going to get the conference to over rule something theyve already ruled on.
The League office replay guys are the umpire in chief if they have taken that role, which they did. Also they later agreed that the umpire in chief/ replay guys were wrong and there was a higher authority. So like I said the rule should not be in the book since they never use it. Also it looks like the conference decided the protest rule is not valid because their solution does not follow the written protest rule which says the game will be replayed from the point of the protest if the decision was wrong. There is nothing in the book about reversing suspensions and tough luck we screwed up.

If they are going to keep it I agree that wording needs to be clarified.
 

Chesusdog

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It would be nice to know that someone got fired.

And typically I wouldn't say that over a missed call or something. But this was just kinda stupid and unnecessary, there was no reason for anybody in an office, somewhere else, to make this call.

A 40 minute delay over a 60 second kerfuffle in which no hands were thrown. Somebody needs crucifying.
 

retire the banner

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So the SEC walked back most of the suspensions and tried to mitigate the disaster they created on Saturday night. This give a whole new meaning to the phrase "That's a the least I could do." It is truly the absolute least they could do to make things right. They admitted they screwed up by reinstating some of the players. They did nothing else beyond that. No public apology. No names were given. No promise to do better next time.

They still upheld suspensions for players (Kohler) who did absolutely nothing wrong, and they expect everyone to just forget about it and move on. It's unacceptable to expect everyone to just forget about what some nameless, faceless cowards in another state created Saturday night.
The tough reality is, it’s college baseball. No one knows or cares about what happened except for the teams involved.
 

TXDawg.sixpack

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How was a head first slide a dirty slide? Come on man!
Usually, when runners are conducting a head first slide, their arms are extended trying to get to the plate faster and score. The UGA base runner cocked his left elbow (the one closest to the plate) and led with it at Long's ankle. No reason to do that unless you're trying to injure Long.
 

HammerOfTheDogs

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So the SEC walked back most of the suspensions and tried to mitigate the disaster they created on Saturday night. This give a whole new meaning to the phrase "That's a the least I could do." It is truly the absolute least they could do to make things right. They admitted they screwed up by reinstating some of the players. They did nothing else beyond that. No public apology. No names were given. No promise to do better next time.

They still upheld suspensions for players (Kohler) who did absolutely nothing wrong, and they expect everyone to just forget about it and move on. It's unacceptable to expect everyone to just forget about what some nameless, faceless cowards in another state created Saturday night.
Yes. Baseball is a marathon, not a sprint. The umpire crew should've threw Johnny Long out of the game, and played on.
 
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HuntDawg

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How was a head first slide a dirty slide? Come on man!
its not. Was very clean. No one from either side or any media guy watching thought anything of the slide. Plenty of people havea spoken of it.. minus one person on this board.. ive heard no one say anything about the slide and there have been ample opporutnies for everyone to state their opinion. Most say Long was out of line, and most agree Long should have been tossed, and most agree had Long been tossed the issue would have for the most part been handled. Lemonis said after the game.. "if you want to throw out my catcher, OK I get it"...

You have a guy sliding head first into a guy with equipment on. Very clean. Didnt go for the head. Didnt try to barrell him over. Didnt lead high with cleats. Didnt lower a shoulder. About as soft of a play you can have at the plate considering there was no avenue really to the plate but thru Long.
 

HuntDawg

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The League office replay guys are the umpire in chief if they have taken that role, which they did. Also they later agreed that the umpire in chief/ replay guys were wrong and there was a higher authority. So like I said the rule should not be in the book since they never use it. Also it looks like the conference decided the protest rule is not valid because their solution does not follow the written protest rule which says the game will be replayed from the point of the protest if the decision was wrong. There is nothing in the book about reversing suspensions and tough luck we screwed up.

If they are going to keep it I agree that wording needs to be clarified.
Ive never heard the replays guys can take over the umpire in chef role. Umpire in chief is still umpire in chief even when going to replay.... Think ive read but I'll have to double check that all replay decisions are final.

Hence why the wording should be changed I agree to catch up/clarify with the new age of reviewing plays.
 

patdog

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Ive never heard the replays guys can take over the umpire in chef role. Umpire in chief is still umpire in chief even when going to replay.... Think ive read but I'll have to double check that all replay decisions are final.

Hence why the wording should be changed I agree to catch up/clarify with the new age of reviewing plays.
He's probably still umpire in chief. But it's very clear the replay booth officials were in charge Saturday night. If we're going to have replay at all (I think we should just can it because every time it's instituted it morphs into a much bigger thing than it was ever intended), it needs to be to assist the head official in making the call. The final call has to come from the official on the field, not the booth. If that was the case Saturday night, the umpire in chief could have headed this all off within 5 minutes (still about 5 times too long for an official review).
 

Tall Dawg

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Speaking of the conference has all the $ in the world, there should be a cap placed on what the SEC office gets every year.
The pie is fixing to be split 17 ways (w/OK and TX) and the SEC office gets the 17th slice is my understanding. With the amount of $ to be split each yr continuing to grow, how about we place a cap on what the SEC office gets at $20MM annually?
If the present commissioner and their staff can’t make the SEC office work on $20MM annually, folks need to be hired who can.
I’d also like to know what they have in savings presently.
 
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BrunswickDawg

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Usually, when runners are conducting a head first slide, their arms are extended trying to get to the plate faster and score. The UGA base runner cocked his left elbow (the one closest to the plate) and led with it at Long's ankle. No reason to do that unless you're trying to injure Long.
This brings up an interesting point - the ump said half way thru this fiasco that "the out call on the field was confirmed, and that there was no malicious intent." He went on to add that actions after the play were under review.

Read through the Collision Rules for College Baseball (Starts on page 86 - chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://macumpires.org/pdf/2023-24-ncaa-baseball-rules.pdf )

Within that rule: "3) The runner must attempt to avoid a collision if they can reach the base without colliding". The runner did not do this.
The Malicious Intent comment by the Ump was not about Long - it was about the runner. They also did not rule that it was unavoidable contact. So, the call on the field that likely never got fully explained was that the runner was out by rule by because he initiated contact and broke the collision rule.

The rules go on further to note:
"Note: The failure by the runner to make an effort to touch the plate, the runner’s lowering of the shoulder, or the runner’s pushing through with their hands, elbows or arms, would support a determination that the runner deviated from the pathway in order to initiate contact with the catcher in violation of the Collision Rule 8-7, or otherwise initiated a collision that could have been avoided. A slide shall be deemed appropriate, in the case of a feet first slide, if the runner’s buttocks and legs should hit the ground before contact with the catcher. In the case of a headfirst slide, a runner shall be deemed to have slid appropriately if their body should hit the ground before contact with the catcher. If a catcher blocks the pathway of the runner, the umpire shall not find that the runner initiated an avoidable collision in violation of the Collision Rule."

I'm not so sure they were going to toss Long - and there is no indication that they had prior to the review by Birmingham. They were considering Malicious Intent against the runner - which by rule is an ejection - hence the comment by the Umpire mid-review. I think that this is what was explained to Johnson and he asked for the review of Malicious Intent and the tossing of his player - and it was not a review of Long blocking the plate.
 

HuntDawg

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Disagree in full. Why would Johnson review something that got his player tossed?

the Malious contact that was being reviewed was that of long.

Also the runner is allowed to slide. Which he was doing. The only way the runner was going to avoid contact in that case was to simply give himself up.

in no way at all was the runner out on that place because he broke the collision rule.
 
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