Big 12 Rumor

[615dawg]

Colorado, Utah and Arizona are very interested in moving to the Big 12. Arizona State is in a wait and see, but would likely follow. That would give them 16 and likely would survive as a Power 3.

Big 12 is also considering adding Connecticut and Gonzaga as basketball only members. That would be a very strong 18-team basketball conference.

Washington and Oregon will go to the Big Ten. Notre Dame and Miami (as well as Arizona State and South Florida) were added to the AAU yesterday. AAU membership is required for the Big Ten. Could the Big Ten sweep into Florida and pick up Miami?

Wazzu, Oregon State, Cal and Stanford will be left overs in the Pac 12 if the Big 12 makes this move. What happens to these four? Does the Big Ten take Cal and Stanford as well?

 

[catvet]

The leftover Pac 12 members would have to go independent or join the Mt West.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

My opinion is the ACC should have locked up UConn as a permanent member long ago, if nothing else, for basketball and the entire New England area geography in football.

 

[patdog]

I can’t imagine why ASU would be in the fence about this. They should jump at the chance to go to Big 12.

not sure what to think about Oregon & Washington. They’re big schools (especially Washington), but very isolated. I don’t know why the Big 10 didn’t take them with USC & UCLA if they thought they could add more value than dividing to pot with 2 more schools would take away. You’ve got to think they’ll wind up in a big 10 if they can, if not the Big 12 will probably take them.

 

[MStateDawg]

The leftover Pac 12 members would have to go independent or join the Mt West.

I'd suspect they'd recruit the top MWC teams to join the Pac12. That name brand "Pac" is worth more.

 

[Called3rdstrikedawg]

I'd suspect they'd recruit the top MWC teams to join the Pac12. That name brand "Pac" is worth more.

This makes me wonder if the SEC is not through.

 

[Called3rdstrikedawg]

I think the Big 12 should have worked on Colorado, Utah and the 2 Arizona schools before taking Cincinnati and Central Florida.

 

[Rupert Jenkins]

How is Miami leaving the ACC ?

 

[The Peeper]

Not being sarcastic, just truthful. The way I see it is, it won't have any effects on us until bowl match ups are studied

 

[Dawgg]

I think the Big 12 should have worked on Colorado, Utah and the 2 Arizona schools before taking Cincinnati and Central Florida.

Those moves took place before USC and UCLA announced their moves to the Big Ten. A year ago, it appeared that the Big 12 could collapse and that the Pac had the stronger footing.

Say what you will about the quality of Cincy and UCF, but they helped stabilize the Big 12, helped lock down their media deal, and put them in a spot to raid the Pac.

 

[patdog]

This makes me wonder if the SEC is not through.

Who could the SEC add that would add value? I think the SEC is done until the ACC grant of rights gets close to expiring.

 

[MSUDOG24]

I can’t imagine why ASU would be in the fence about this. They should jump at the chance to go to Big 12.

not sure what to think about Oregon & Washington. They’re big schools (especially Washington), but very isolated. I don’t know why the Big 10 didn’t take them with USC & UCLA if they thought they could add more value than dividing to pot with 2 more schools would take away. You’ve got to think they’ll wind up in a big 10 if they can, if not the Big 12 will probably take them.

Been seeing all of this a lot this week (particularly Colorado) but can't figure out where the money is coming from? Hard to believe their freshly minted TV contract includes equal pro rata shares for an endless number of schools as I don't know that any of these are exactly brand names that might demand such. Certainly might be missing something.

 

[Dawgg]

Who could the SEC add that would add value? I think the SEC is done until the ACC grant of rights gets close to expiring.

I agree. Nobody in the Big Ten is leaving, Notre Dame’s not coming, and nobody left in the Big 12 or Pac makes any sense or adds value.

 

[Dawgg]

Been seeing all of this a lot this week (particularly Colorado) but can't figure out where the money is coming from? Hard to believe their freshly minted TV contract includes equal pro rata shares for an endless number of schools as I don't know that any of these are exactly brand names that might demand such. Certainly might be missing something.

ESPN’s portion of the Big 12 contract includes pro rata for existing Power 5 schools. The Fox portion does not.

 

[Dawgg]

I'd suspect they'd recruit the top MWC teams to join the Pac12. That name brand "Pac" is worth more.

I could see this. The 2-4 leftover Pac schools ‘absorbing’ most or all of the MWC. If nothing else, it would probably preserve some of the existing bowl agreements (and their payouts) for a few years.

 

[Dawgg]

Not being sarcastic, just truthful. The way I see it is, it won't have any effects on us until bowl match ups are studied

I do. I think this stuff is super interesting. Plus it’s summer. I guess we could talk about how your WNBA fantasy team is doing, but I think realignment is a good topic.

 

[patdog]

Been seeing all of this a lot this week (particularly Colorado) but can't figure out where the money is coming from? Hard to believe their freshly minted TV contract includes equal pro rata shares for an endless number of schools as I don't know that any of these are exactly brand names that might demand such. Certainly might be missing something.

Part would come from savings from no longer paying the PAC-12 for a tv rights deal. It’ll be interesting to see what happens. If the Big 12 adds everyone they’re rumored to add, that would be 16 +2 basketball only. I’m not sure why they would add Colorado or both Arizona schools. If I’m the Big 12, I’m going big & trying for Washington & Oregon, plus Utah and either an Arizona school or Stanford.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

I could see this. The 2-4 leftover Pac schools ‘absorbing’ most or all of the MWC. If nothing else, it would probably preserve some of the existing bowl agreements (and their payouts) for a few years.

Why can't they do this now? Don't let Colorado, Arizona and Utah leave. Add UNLV and Boise State, two schools that are in states/areas that are growing like crazy. Relocate the HQ to Vegas. Just abandon SoCal, let the B1G have it, nothing they can do about it anyway.

So now you're back to 12 for a while. Once you get media rights in place, and start seeing some chinks in the Big 12 armor (which are sure to come), I think you start looking hard to Texas Tech and TCU at that point. That's a strong conference. And we all know the Pac-12 has wanted into Texas for a long time.

But I guess it all comes back to whether your bell cows of Washington and Oregon ever get that B1G invite. I just don't see it happening though. I think things stabilize until we closer to the 2036 ACC meltdown.

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

Who could the SEC add that would add value? I think the SEC is done until the ACC grant of rights gets close to expiring.

No one that would leave the ACC probably is worth the hassle. FSU and Clemson may look good on the surface but I think they would not add as much as they might appear.

I would still like to trade Missouri for Oklahoma State but that's just me. God knows Missouri has given our conference so much.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

No one that would leave the ACC probably is worth the hassle. FSU and Clemson may look good on the surface but I think they would not add as much as they might appear.

I tend to agree. I think the SEC is pretty set for a while. We will eventually end up with 9 games, once ESPN antes up and some of these long term P5 OOC contracts have been bought up or dissolved.

Same with the B1G honestly.

 

[PooPopsBaldHead]

Why can't they do this now? Don't let Colorado, Arizona and Utah leave. Add UNLV and Boise State, two schools that are in states/areas that are growing like crazy. Relocate the HQ to Vegas. Just abandon SoCal, let the B1G have it, nothing they can do about it anyway.

.

The biggest thing I could see throwing a monkey wrench in this type of plan is the academics. The PAC schools are snotty about the academics and Boise State is pretty terrible academically. UNLV is probably as bad or worse by reputation and their football is not nearly as good as Boise State or San Diego State.

When UCLA and USC announced last year the talk was about 2 out of San Diego State, Boise State, and SMU being in the mix. SMU is desperate to get into the Big 12 now that the PAC is falling apart so I am not sure you could risk taking them only to have the Big 12 snatch em up.

I think SDSU is a no brainer with the best academics and athletics in the MWC these days. After that it would probably be BSU, but the president's would have to hold their nose to swallow the academics. Boise State people want in the PAC very badly so I am sure they are already working it. Colorado State could be in play as well with decent academics and football. UNLV is too far down in the pecking order I would think because their football is atrocious and that's what all of this is really about.

 

[patdog]

The biggest thing I could see throwing a monkey wrench in this type of plan is the academics. The PAC schools are snotty about the academics and Boise State is pretty terrible academically. UNLV is probably as bad or worse by reputation and their football is not nearly as good as Boise State or San Diego State.

When UCLA and USC announced last year the talk was about 2 out of San Diego State, Boise State, and SMU being in the mix. SMU is desperate to get into the Big 12 now that the PAC is falling apart so I am not sure you could risk taking them only to have the Big 12 snatch em up.

I think SDSU is a no brainer with the best academics and athletics in the MWC these days. After that it would probably be BSU, but the president's would have to hold their nose to swallow the academics. Boise State people want in the PAC very badly so I am sure they are already working it. Colorado State could be in play as well with decent academics and football. UNLV is too far down in the pecking order I would think because their football is atrocious and that's what all of this is really about.

PAC 12 isn’t adding anybody unless/until it has to because schools left. All of those schools you mentioned add negative value. PAC 12 biggest problem is getting a real commitment from Washington & Oregon. If the networks could be sure they’d stay, they could probably get a decent tv deal done.

 

[Dawgpile]

What I find fascinating is the fact that the PAC had an opportunity to pick off the best of the rest of the Big 12 after TU and OU announced for the SEC. Kansas, OSU, Tech, and TCU could have shored up their numbers and given them the added CST time zone for better exposure and attractiveness to media partners.

 

[MSUDOG24]

ESPN’s portion of the Big 12 contract includes pro rata for existing Power 5 schools. The Fox portion does not.

Well there you go, guess I need to start believing. For all of the reading I've done on this, I missed that detail.
Interesting, this seems to imply "any P5 school" is worth "32M" (think this is about the new contract)?

 

[PooPopsBaldHead]

PAC 12 isn’t adding anybody unless/until it has to because schools left. All of those schools you mentioned add negative value. PAC 12 biggest problem is getting a real commitment from Washington & Oregon. If the networks could be sure they’d stay, they could probably get a decent tv deal done.

The PAC 12 has to add soon or die. The 10 team conference won't work.

As far as adding value, BSU and SDSU are where Utah and TCU were were when they left the MWC. Year one those schools are in the top half of their conference and their brands grow exponentially.

Boise State is one of the most well known brands in college football due to the puke turf and lots of winning. Putting them on a bigger platform is a rising tide that will lift most of those crappy PAC boats. Even toiling in the MWC, from 2015-2021 their average tv viewership per game was 476K. That was right in between Kentucky and Vanderbilt nationally. It was better than 8 power 5 teams and only UCF and Memphis were better in the G5.

The PAC 12 needs eyeballs badly. Boise State brings them better than anyone else they could get at this point. In fact, during that same tv time period, Oregon State only averaged 295,000 viewers per game.

SDSU doesn't have the same history or following as BSU, but they are coming on fast in football and basketball.

 

[Dawgbite]

I realize that Missouri was a splashy addition but, historically they are more southern than Kentucky. I mean they did at least try to secede from the union. Lots of TV sets in Missouri which is the main reason they were added. Missouri was probably worth more to the bottom line of the SEC than either Clemson or FSU, maybe both combined

 

[Maroon13]

When the time comes, the SEC needs to add UNC. TV markets, basketball and academics.

But do you then add Miami or NCSt or Duke or FSU for the 18th team? The pros for FSU and Miami is the football match ups vs Bama, Texas, Florida etc. but that's all they bring to the table.

Duke brings basketball and academics. NCSt.... meh.

 

[Tall Dawg]

University of San Francisco and University of Portland…. to PAC 12…

 

[patdog]

When the time comes, the SEC needs to add UNC. TV markets, basketball and academics.

But do you then add Miami or NCSt or Duke or FSU for the 18th team? The pros for FSU and Miami is the football match ups vs Bama, Texas, Florida etc. but that's all they bring to the table.

Duke brings basketball and academics. NCSt.... meh.

Absolutely. UNC in the real prize in the ACC. Competition from the Big 10 will be fierce though. Another big overlooked prize is Virginia. If SEC loses out in those two, they’ll probably take 2 from Miami, FSU, Clemson or VA Tech.

 

[theoriginalSALTYdog]

No one that would leave the ACC probably is worth the hassle. FSU and Clemson may look good on the surface but I think they would not add as much as they might appear.

I would still like to trade Missouri for Oklahoma State but that's just me. God knows Missouri has given our conference so much.

They give you the St. Louis TV market, which is the only reason they were added to begin with....

 

[ronpolk]

No one that would leave the ACC probably is worth the hassle. FSU and Clemson may look good on the surface but I think they would not add as much as they might appear.

I would still like to trade Missouri for Oklahoma State but that's just me. God knows Missouri has given our conference so much.

Missouri gives you St. Louis and Kansas City. I’m sure that matters a lot to espn.

 

[QuaoarsKing]

Cal and Stanford should have some appeal to the Big 10, but I don't know that either of them are actually worth adding.

If the Ivy League ever wanted to get serious about athletics, they could be a very solid FBS conference, and maybe go to 12 with Duke, Vanderbilt, Rice, and Stanford (all of whom have similar academic profiles). Or if Stanford's just too far away, maybe Tulane, which isn't generally considered quite on the level of the others but could probably get there once formally associated with them.

 

[AstroDog]

My opinion is the ACC should have locked up UConn as a permanent member long ago, if nothing else, for basketball and the entire New England area geography in football.

Yeah, UCONN is pretty good in baseball, very good in basketball, sort of up and down (mostly down) in football. If they went out and got a good coach for their struggling football team, they'd be set. And of course, no worries for their women's basketball. I've visited the Storrs campus and it feels like a nice environement. Much like MSU in that they are big in farming and dairy. The forest land surrounding the campus is as thick as I have ever seen. Like Smokey Mtn. thick. You'd almost wouldn't know you're near a campus of any sort, until you got within a quarter mile of it.....