I'm starting to hate college football

[ckDOG]

I don’t think profit ultimately wins. Cannon motors didn’t care about profit when they paid players, now they can “advertise” for them. Bel Mac roofing wasn’t paying Cam Newton for ROI. Every law firm from Gautier to Southaven is going to have a Rebel DL saying one call, that’s all.

It's possible. But I surely don't think the scope remains the same as the collectives environment we're in now.

Would be swell if there was a regulating body that would look at those examples and, if they aren't arms length valid marketing arrangements, take away the player's eligibility. They can keep getting paid but they won't be playing.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Probably more so, with legalized gambling available in many states.

And this is the phenomena that interests me.

Early on, it was about your state pride and your team. Colleges basically recruited a lot of locals. As it got bigger, so did the money, schools suing NCAA over TV, regional and national recruiting. Then you have SMU and all the pay for play/probation era, and you had the era of all the different national champs determined by AP writers. To me, the system was the best mix from 1998-2013....the BCS era. You got a national champ, you had tribal pride at an all-time high, you had a consolation bowl prize if you were one of the dozen teams that could never win a national title realistically.

Anyways, doesn't matter which time was the best, that can be debated. Basically what I'm saying is that it's become more of a gambling and otherwise entertainment (whether it's TV or tailgating) event. Winning and losing has taken a back seat. It might be a good metaphor for the collective psyche of the country.

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

I don't hate CFB because MSU is having a terrible time. I don't hate college football. I'm just saying that I anticipate the changes in college football will have an immediate effect on the teams. You'll have somebody occasionally who will break the standard top 25, but most of the time, the rich will get richer, and the poor will get poorer.

 

[dorndawg]

Anyways, doesn't matter which time was the best, that can be debated. Basically what I'm saying is that it's become more of a gambling and otherwise entertainment (whether it's TV or tailgating) event. Winning and losing has taken a back seat. It might be a good metaphor for the collective psyche of the country.

 

[Dawgbite]

Here is our situation as I see it.
1. Cohen was ill prepared for the NIL revolution to college sports. He wasn’t proactive and slow to react. He was probably the worst type of AD we could possibly have had at the infancy of NIL.
2. We never had a well organized network for under the table fund raising. Schools like Alabama have been organized under the table forever but couldn’t fully utilize their network due to fear of NCAA sanctions. That fear is no longer there and they and other schools hit the ground running. We’re much further behind now than we were pre NIL.
3. while we do get the SEC money, it can’t be spent directly on NIL. Our NIL budget across all sports is in the 3 million range. That’s minuscule compared the the Bama’s, Georgia’s, and Texas’s of the world. A large percentage of that 3 mil is spent basically on scholarships. There’s no such thing as a walk-on any more. NIL is reimbursing what used to be walk-ons for tuition and cost of attending. With recruits demanding visit fees and up front cash payments to sign, we just can’t afford to even recruit a large percentage of players we once could. How many total student athletes do we have, 200-300? How many walk-ons are now being provided “ Scholarships “ through NIL. Divide 3 mil by 200 athletes.
4. Our athletic dept is rich due to the SEC money compared to most schools but our private fund raising is poor. We’re much close to UAB in private funds than we are to Alabama yet we are having to compete with the SEC elite.
5. Our roster has been decimated due to the coaching turnover. Good coach or bad coach we’re going to have to stick with Libby awhile to let him build a foundation to build off of. We ain’t hiring Nick Saban or anyone who could walk through the door and have a big immediate impact.
6. G5 schools are still pretty much playing by the old recruiting rules. NIL hasn’t impacted them like it has the Power 5 schools. They can still build an experienced team over time through recruiting where we’re having to buy a new team every year. They are still building a team and putting an experienced team on the field. We are hiring mercenaries and we can’t afford the cream of the crop. I think your going to see a lot of experienced G5 schools beating the Power 5 have nots.
It’s not sustainable , at least not for us. We’re not alone, there are probably 30-40 athletic departments in the same boat we are in. Every power five school not among the elite are facing the same thing. We are further separated from the G5 schools financially but at the same time we’re becoming further separated from the elite. We’re in a no man’s land, we’re in a league where we have to compete with Bama, Georgia,and Texas and it’s obvious we can’t afford to do it. We can’t recruit and develop players like the G5 schools anymore because players in this league are a one year deal not four years. That’s why your going to see more G5 schools beating the also rans of the Power 5. I wish I knew the answer.

 

[Perd Hapley]

This is what I mean about destroying the "middle class." The lower budget big conference schools are the middle class and this system is pushing them down closer to the "lower class".....any non P4. The "upper class" blue-bloods keep getting even richer and have a distinct advantage even if a rebuild is needed.

Scholardhip limits, transfer rules, recruiting rules were all in place to help create a more level playing field and you could argue that the blue bloods were actually subsidizing the old system (I know some still cheated) because if those rules didn't exist they'd have too much of an unfair advantage over other schools.....welll we've kind of thrown that out the window for kids with their hands out and a portal that allows them to run away with no consequences. We deserve the system we have but it will eat itself unless changes are made.

This is the exact problem. Lower tier P4 programs like MSU are in even worse shape than the G5…..particularly in the P2 (SEC and B1G). G5 teams can give the big middle finger to NIL, only lose 1-2 valuable players in the portal per year, yet still build a competitive program within their league the old fashioned way. They aren’t out much vs. where they were in the old system.

The MSU’s of the world don’t have this luxury. We have to get some of the elite portal mercenaries just to have a prayer at .500 overall in the SEC. Yet, we can’t afford the best guys, and we still have to deal with the culture issues created from paying the best guys that we can get (who aren’t even good enough in the first place).

You put NIL or Toledo in the SEC right now, they are both still 4-8 programs. We are completely in no man’s land.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

4. Our athletic dept is rich due to the SEC money compared to most schools but our private fund raising is poor. We’re much close to UAB in private funds than we are to Alabama yet we are having to compete with the SEC elite.

It’s not sustainable , at least not for us. We’re not alone, there are probably 30-40 athletic departments in the same boat we are in. Every power five school not among the elite are facing the same thing. We are further separated from the G5 schools financially but at the same time we’re becoming further separated from the elite. We’re in a no man’s land, we’re in a league where we have to compete with Bama, Georgia,and Texas and it’s obvious we can’t afford to do it. We can’t recruit and develop players like the G5 schools anymore because players in this league are a one year deal not four years. That’s why your going to see more G5 schools beating the also rans of the Power 5. I wish I knew the answer.

I think what you'll see happen, is that we absolutely will do whatever necessary to stay with the P2/4/whatever as long as they will allow us, we're going to exhaust our TV money keeping revenue sports inside that club. And in 2024 when the increased roster limits and TV NIL starts, that will become more expensive. So what goes? The non-revenue sports, particularly men's, unless they change things.

I am really, REALLY intrigued and concerned about what that means for college baseball at non-blue blood universities, including us. Because it's going to take private money to keep them afloat. And who knows what it means for G5.....they won't have the TV money that we do, but they also won't have the huge NIL expense that we will.

I really wonder if these commissioners have thought of these things. I know the ADs have, hell even Greg Byrne is sounding the alarms and he's at a blue blood.

 

[STATEgrad04]

Do you have anything positive to add about MSU football, I'd like to hear something? MSU posters don't come to this forum to talk about the positive things other teams are doing, at least not in the many years I've been hanging around here. If you want to discuss the positive things about other teams then an ESPN forum or Gene's page is probably where you need to head because I don't think we'll be discussing how great other teams are doing on this forum.

There have been MANY discussions in the last couple of years about all the things that UM is doing better than us...NIL, marketing, coaching, football.

 

[Trojanbulldog19]

I'm still watching a lot of college ball but msu football has regressed to what it used to be. The abysmal no shot. Keenum and Arnett blew it up and then I'm not sure if Selmon and Lebby are the people to drag it out.

 

[BoDawg.sixpack]

Gotta give the big Lebowski 3 years to shovel the ****. He's learning on the fly and the first year will be punishment no one deserves. There are some 70-0 beat downs coming up shortly.

 

[3407Dewey]

Honestly, I enjoy it more. I am at the point where the State losses don’t affect me but big wins make me happy. Years ago, if we lost the 11 o’clock game, I couldn’t enjoy the rest of the day. Now I get over it and can gleefully watch the next 10 hours.

Yeah, I was at a concert while Toledo was destroying us. I checked the score once and felt a slight pang of grief, then moved on and was able to enjoy the show. I will celebrate the wins and ignore the losses.

 

[Podgy]

It'll be interesting with the large rosters allowed how schools are going to creatively add more women's sports to be Title IX compliant.

 

[The Peeper]

There have been MANY discussions in the last couple of years about all the things that UM is doing better than us...NIL, marketing, coaching, football.

Those discussions are still all about what we are doing wrong more than what they are doing right. Posters don't come here to say hey, I've got a Rebel friend and I want to tell you the great things he's told me about their school.

 

[HRMSU]

It'll be interesting with the large rosters allowed how schools are going to creatively add more women's sports to be Title IX compliant.

One of the reasons schools are trying hard to keep players from being employees. If they are employees then the school has to pay them and even though football subsidizes all other sports it would start eating into the margins. The players could still land advertising deals which is what NIL was supposed to be instead it's a bastardized way of pay to play with the school keeping their money and remaining an arms length transaction away.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

 

[ckDOG]

This is the exact problem. Lower tier P4 programs like MSU are in even worse shape than the G5…..particularly in the P2 (SEC and B1G). G5 teams can give the big middle finger to NIL, only lose 1-2 valuable players in the portal per year, yet still build a competitive program within their league the old fashioned way. They aren’t out much vs. where they were in the old system.

The MSU’s of the world don’t have this luxury. We have to get some of the elite portal mercenaries just to have a prayer at .500 overall in the SEC. Yet, we can’t afford the best guys, and we still have to deal with the culture issues created from paying the best guys that we can get (who aren’t even good enough in the first place).

You put NIL or Toledo in the SEC right now, they are both still 4-8 programs. We are completely in no man’s land.

Was thinking about this earlier and I'm with you. Are there any turnover stats by program? Would like to see if there are really G5 vs lower P5 trends.

My gut reaction is that's it's better to have stable G5 talent where you can coach em up and establish veterans that have played together for a bit vs turning over your roster with SEC NIL leftovers. Those kids might be more talented but don't get to know each other or the coaching staff.

We own some of that with coaching turnover last 3 years but I fear it's going to be our place in this weird NIL world.

 

[CochiseCowbell]

I'd also guess WELL over half of this board is 35-50 years old. Those are peak ages for just having a lot of shiit going on.

So true.

If you value your sanity, don't have a teenager & a toddler at the same time...in your 40's!

 

[RopeDawg]

Where did I say we need to discuss MSU in a positive manner. I’m all for us talking about how bad we suck now. I’m talking about people that continue to make post about how bad college football sucks and how it’s been ruined and about how they don’t even watch it anymore.

You know what I don’t do and what I assume most people don’t do, continually talk about **** they don’t like or watch. I don’t like soccer, I don’t like volleyball, I don’t really even like basketball that much, so you know what I don’t ever talk about it. I certainly don’t make post on a msg board about how much I didn’t watch volleyball this weekend.

Because it’s not volleyball season, MSU didn’t just have a volleyball game and this isn’t a volleyball message board. Seriously?