I'm truly on the fence about Howland

[BonzoGoesToCollege]

I hate to split hairs, but it's 18 wins, unless you know something I don't about tonight's Tennessee game...If you were on the fence before last night, and you've been an MSU fan more than a year or two, last night's win was more frustrating than it is hopeful because this is the team you see on rare occasions. The team that plays even remotely close to its potential. That's usually followed by an embarrassing faceplant in the next game(or two). It was fool's gold, plain and simple. Get back with me after we get drubbed by Tennessee and the first mid major we play on the road in the NIT and tell me if you're still on the fence.

I couldn't agree with this more. I'm expecting a blowout Tennessee win tonight.

 

[HomeBoyDawg]

You'll be able to retract your post a little after 7 p.m. Central tonight when UT shows that last night was more about USC's poor play than it was about MSU's good play.

 

[ColoradoDawg]

This season is just like every season with Howland. If you want a coach that will get you to the NIT every year then he is fine. Want to make the tourney consistently, then we need a new coach. At this point the sample size is large enough to know exactly what you are going to get.

 

[BonzoGoesToCollege]

I'm not on the fence anymore. Like most people on this thread, he's likable, has done a good job resurrecting the program after Ray, and for the most part his teams have been drama free. But after watching this year, I just don't think his approach is gonna work. He still wants to play inside out. Doesn't matter who we have on the perimeter shooting....he and his staff just can't seem to run an offense to get them open looks.

But if he leaves, I'm really nervous about who the next guy is gonna be.

 

[BigWorm.sixpack]

Rick Ray kinda burnt the building down tho

No, the person who hired RR burnt the building down!

 

[Dawgtruc]

Career and is a gem of a person but he has not done a good job this year with the talent he has brought in. We don’t play hard consistently and we can’t shoot consistently.

Great person. Was once an upper tier basketball coach.

I get the sense that something happened at UCLA that changed how he coaches...and how he interacts with student-athletes, and not for the better.

 

[Cooterpoot]

We're getting a new coach. That's a fact. So you guys riding the fence are just getting splinters in your ***. I think we'll upgrade.

 

[JML105]

I like and respect CBH, and it really bothers me when people bash him, but the only way this program will get to the next level is if he starts "playing the game" like Nick Nolte did in Blue Chips. I surely don't want that to happen, so the only other way is to find a new up and coming coach with the energy/talent to take us to The Dance more consistently.

 

[Dawgtruc]

Seems our fan base looks for reasons to justify how crappy we are

If smart people wake up and do what's right, the student section/atmosphere would be fixed for the next head coach. Otherwise, he will be fighting an uphill battle.

 

[thekimmer]

Let me start off by saying that I've spent way too much time googling basketball coaches over the last month but here we are 19-14 (that's not a fireable record) we are going to the postseason again (NIT is never preferred but again not fireable) we have a top 3 overall SEC player in Molinar that wasn't ever signing with another SEC team so that is a huge Howland find in recruiting, same with Garcia and Tolu, we have exciting young players imo (Matthews, Fountain, Moore, Garcia, Carter). From all reports we have several very talented players joining up next year.

Do I wish we played more exciting basketball on offense? Hell yes. Is it beyond frustrating when we can't shoot a 3? Yup. You know what is promising though? Only giving up 51 points. Andersson Garcia having 14 rebounds (again). Healthy Tolu all year we are already in the tourney. We can't fire Howland after this year. I've now removed myself from the fence. You should as well.

19-14 in and of itself is not fireable but this is about more than one season. It's about 5 seasons of frustrating play and chronic underachievement. Yes howland lifted us up from the Ray years but that is not enough. The howland years are characterized by anticipation of finally being an NCAAT team only to fall short on the bubble. We stumbled along until this season we finally had an ultimatum year. The general consensus was with the talent we had we needed to make the NCAAT or coach needs to move on. Well we didn't make it based on our record. I don't count catching fire in the SECT and we are a LOOOOONG way from doing that anyway. So based on that its time to move on. Also those blaming fans for not supporting him need to give it a rest. We don't have a big supply of casual fans to fill up an arena but State fans have proven that they will support a team that plays up to their potential. The teams howland has put on the court that seem to play in fits and starts, with terrible offensive motion and a propensity to compete just enough to lose are not appealing to fans. It is not the fan's fault. I hope we do win tonight and Sat and Sun but if we do that is even more evidence that Howland needs to go because if we can do this then one must ask where has that team been all season?

 

[mstateglfr]

I like and respect CBH, and it really bothers me when people bash him, but the only way this program will get to the next level is if he starts "playing the game" like Nick Nolte did in Blue Chips. I surely don't want that to happen, so the only other way is to find a new up and coming coach with the energy/talent to take us to The Dance more consistently.

The talent on this roster is plenty good enough to make the NCAAT, if it is managed effectively.
We dont need to buy a tractor for some white kid from Indiana in order to have talent.

 

[Snave]

I don't know how you can be on the fence with this coach as MSU has not made it to the round of 32 in his tenure.

 

[Wizard.sixpack]

Let me start off by saying that I've spent way too much time googling basketball coaches over the last month but here we are 19-14 (that's not a fireable record) we are going to the postseason again (NIT is never preferred but again not fireable) we have a top 3 overall SEC player in Molinar that wasn't ever signing with another SEC team so that is a huge Howland find in recruiting, same with Garcia and Tolu, we have exciting young players imo (Matthews, Fountain, Moore, Garcia, Carter). From all reports we have several very talented players joining up next year.

Do I wish we played more exciting basketball on offense? Hell yes. Is it beyond frustrating when we can't shoot a 3? Yup. You know what is promising though? Only giving up 51 points. Andersson Garcia having 14 rebounds (again). Healthy Tolu all year we are already in the tourney. We can't fire Howland after this year. I've now removed myself from the fence. You should as well.

Riley Kugel

[tweet]1484958883101777921[/tweet]

We ain't going to the NIT. Howland is gone as soon as we make our departure from the SEC tourney.

 

[Dawg_4_lifes]

I'm all over the board on Ben. It was a good hire, especially coming off the Rick Ray years. Something is just missing. I think its the lack of having pure shooters. We have and have had the athletes, defenders, bangers, gritty tough guys and glue pieces...but never a guy that can just burn the net from the 3 and make the defense stretch out. I do not want to fire him, but I would not mind him taking a nice earned retirement.

 

[mcdawg22]

Howland absolutely improved the program…. But it stopped improving years ago. We have been treading water ever since our triumphant return to the NCAAT ended with a loss to Liberty.

You can be thankful that he got us out of the cellar and still feel like his tenure has run its course here. If you’re not making the tournament with this team or the 2020 team then I have a hard time believing that in your mid 60’s you’re capable of suddenly turning it all around and making the tournament again with any roster.

Also, you’ve got to be able to draw fans in to your program and he has been totally unable to do that. It’s easy to blame the fans but the program bears a lot of responsibility for that failure.

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[PartTimeGenius]

Howland until we lose....

 

[curseddawgs]

In my opinion, effort has not been a problem the last 2 years. In 2020-21 it was a combination of a young team and lack of offensive weapons with DJ Stewart and Molinar (Tolu had his moments). This year it has been inconsistencies to close games and late game scoring combined with an inability to play away from the Hump. The only time over the last two years when I questioned how hard the team played was at A&M last Saturday and we had a respectable 2nd half to close the gap.

 

[mstateglfr]

I could see us being a 4 or 5 seed in the NIT.

 

[hailstate19]

If he doesn’t win the SEC tournament good riddance. It’s not likely he does.

 

[ShrubDog]

Seriously man how can anyone be on top of this fence when it’s razor wire? How many NCAA games have we played in since 2002? There’s no more excuses. It’s every damn year woulda shoulda coulda. We look the same as day 1 with Ben. I appreciate all that he has done but this game has passed him by years ago. Not one adjustment made.

It doesn’t matter who we bring in, the song remains the same. Same song , second verse etc.


We have more talent than ever and we flop. And don’t give us the Tolu injury.

Never thought it was ok to hang hats on NIT appearances. Not In Tourney

 

[ShrubDog]

He’s not unlucky. Nobody was projecting us in the tournament last year. And injuries happen to every team. Underperforming is what’s defined his tenure at Mississippi State.

Pat I’ve been away but I can assume you have filled the void with reasonable analysis.

 

[msstate7]

Seriously man how can anyone be on top of this fence when it’s razor wire? How many NCAA games have we played in since 2002? There’s no more excuses. It’s every damn year woulda shoulda coulda. We look the same as day 1 with Ben. I appreciate all that he has done but this game has passed him by years ago. Not one adjustment made.

It doesn’t matter who we bring in, the song remains the same. Same song , second verse etc.


We have more talent than ever and we flop. And don’t give us the Tolu injury.

Never thought it was ok to hang hats on NIT appearances. Not In Tourney

We have been pretty unlucky imo in 2 huge cases...

Tolu has been injured pretty much the whole season. Since getting healthy, he's avg 20.6 ppg.

Molinar 3-pt fg % last 3 years:
'19 - 37.1%, '20 - 43.6%, '21 - 26.0%

Injuries are part of the game, and howland shoulda got at least 1 more shooter this past offseason, but tolu being injured and Molinar nosediving from 3 seems really tough luck for us and howland.

 

[DAWG61]

Howland isn't a stranger to tough luck injuries. The year he got fired at UCLA he won the PAC12 regular season, lost his best player to a broken foot on the last play of their semi win over Arizona in the PAC12 tourney and then was fired ten days later after they lost in the PAC12 Champ game and got upset in the Round of 64 while missing their best player to a broken foot. Doesn't get more unlucky than that. Utterly absurd UCLA fired him. He's still their winningest coach since Wooden.

 

[PirateDawg]

Howland has got to go. He runs the most boring offense in the country. Even when he has good talent he bores me. That's why nobody is showing up at the Hump.

 

[MSU124]

8 games under .500 isn’t awful. Go look at what teams finished worse.

 

[Rezpup]

His teams have played with tin gym level intensity and that’s why he hasn’t succeeded and why the fan base isn’t there.

I hear we are getting the Murray State coach or the Wichita State coach.

 

[Snave]

Still on that fence?

 

[Cooterpoot]

Anyone still on the fence has splinters in their gooch.

 

[M R DAWGS]

Here’s the pertinent question. Are MSU fans more or less enthused about basketball 7 years into Howland’s tenure? The answer is less, and not at any point in those 7 years have we actually turned the corner. We have to at least try something else.

 

[jdbulldog]

Great person. Was once an upper tier basketball coach.

I get the sense that something happened at UCLA that changed how he coaches...and how he interacts with student-athletes, and not for the better.

what does this mean?

 

[bully12]

I would actually say 5 (Newman, Perry, Carter, Woodard and N Weatherspoon). Newman and Weatherspoon didn't work out that well but they were both very talented guys. Newman looked pretty dang good after leaving for Kansas and NW had his moments, just couldn't stay out of trouble. And that doesn't even count Brooks who we got this one year from (should have been 4).

Did Mackey White have any children?

 

[WilCoDawg]

If he’s still around next year, that’s Cohen giving the middle finger to anyone who cares about MBB.

 

[DAWGS1.sixpack]

In my opinion, effort has not been a problem the last 2 years. In 2020-21 it was a combination of a young team and lack of offensive weapons with DJ Stewart and Molinar (Tolu had his moments). This year it has been inconsistencies to close games and late game scoring combined with an inability to play away from the Hump. The only time over the last two years when I questioned how hard the team played was at A&M last Saturday and we had a respectable 2nd half to close the gap.

You obviously have not watched us play or know nothing about basketball beyond the final score

 

[jackbaddawg]

Bottom line- Ben hasn't done any better than Stans at all- this team could get close in games and just fold- That's on the coach . BYE BEN .

 

[Mr. Cook]

Bottom line- Ben hasn't done any better than Stans at all- this team could get close in games and just fold- That's on the coach . BYE BEN .

So we should have never gotten rid of Stans?

 

[tcdog70]

So we should have never gotten rid of Stans?

having watched the Dogs since Joe Dan Gold, IMHO, Stans has been by far the best Coach. Sure Williams went to the final 4--but with Stans recruits. If we had kept Stans we would have continued to be a top 5 SEC team. Only two teams in the SEC had winning records against Him. If His record was in football-he would have a statue.

 

[RocketDawg]

having watched the Dogs since Joe Dan Gold, IMHO, Stans has been by far the best Coach. Sure Williams went to the final 4--but with Stans recruits. If we had kept Stans we would have continued to be a top 5 SEC team. Only two teams in the SEC had winning records against Him. If His record was in football-he would have a statue.

I thought we should have kept Stans as well, but I'm not quite ready to deify him. **

 

[Cooterpoot]

having watched the Dogs since Joe Dan Gold, IMHO, Stans has been by far the best Coach. Sure Williams went to the final 4--but with Stans recruits. If we had kept Stans we would have continued to be a top 5 SEC team. Only two teams in the SEC had winning records against Him. If His record was in football-he would have a statue.

GTF outta here! Stans hasn't been in the tournament in almost 15 years. His *** ain't special at all. He was done when divisions were anyway.

 

[patdog]

Stans has 6 of our 11 all-time NCAA tournament appearances. I'm certainly not suggesting we should hire him or that he's a great coach now. But when he was at Mississippi State, for the most part he was a pretty damn good coach.