Jake Mangum called up soon?

[WrightGuy821]

I'm not super plugged in to Tampa Bay's organization, but with them trading away one of their starting OF's is Jake Mangum on the short list to get called up and replace him, or will they trade for a new outfielder? He's been pretty good lately in their AAA club

 

[Anon1704414204]

I'm not super plugged in to Tampa Bay's organization, but with them trading away one of their starting OF's is Jake Mangum on the short list to get called up and replace him, or will they trade for a new outfielder? He's been pretty good lately in their AAA club

I was listening recently on T & L Jake has been tearing it up the last month or so. Has a lack of power been holding him back? Does Billy Bean still have pull with The A's?

 

[DawgatAuburn]

Jake's not on their 40 man roster, so first they would have to add him to that. They do have a spot available but they had one even before the trade. Arozarena is/was a corner OF. Jake's mainly a CF although they have played him on the corners some in the minors, and the Rays already have a CF, albeit not a great one though he does have more pop in his bat than Jake does. I'd love to see it but it seems like if they were going to do it they would have already given him a shot.

 

[Anon1704414204]

Jake's not on their 40 man roster, so first they would have to add him to that. They do have a spot available but they had one even before the trade. Arozarena is/was a corner OF. Jake's mainly a CF although they have played him on the corners some in the minors, and the Rays already have a CF, albeit not a great one though he does have more pop in his bat than Jake does. I'd love to see it but it seems like if they were going to do it they would have already given him a shot.

Time is still on Jake's side but won't be for long. He's been toiling away for a while now, no? Will never forget his off the charts enthusiasm.

 

[greenbean.sixpack]

I've read on the other board that Magnum has no chance of being called up. The negativity on that board dwarfs the negativity on this board and that's a high bar.

 

[CoastTrash]

Pulling for Jake!

 

[Perd Hapley]

Jake just has a lot of things that are beyond his control that are working against him.

He can truly hit and get on base at an MLB level. No question.

He can also run the bases and play outfield at an MLB level. No question.

But in the analytics era, MLB outfield positions are not at a defensive premium, which means everyone is looking for big offense and power in those spots in the lineup, and there is a much larger sample size of players to choose from that fit those roles.

He’s also been screwed by the expanded roster sizes and platooning craze. His greatest and most rare asset - being a switch hitter - no longer matters anymore. 15 years ago when they had the dress roster capped at 25 players or whatever it was, he’d have tremendous value as an end of the bench PH and utility outfielder. But now, everyone has 1-2 big bats from each side that they can PH with, AND a defensive specialist who can probably also hit with some pop.

He’s never going to be able to throw right handed, which means he’ll never be able to play infield. And his physical traits are never going to put him in that 30-35 HR stratusphere, either. Those are the hard facts. He does everything else as well as you could expect any MLB every day player to do them.

The TLDR version: Analytics and the emphasis on role specialization has totally screwed over the old school players who are really good at a lot of different things, but not elite at any of them.

 

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Jake is like Tolu. Both Jake and Tolu would be great pro players in 70’s and 80’s, but the MLB and NBA are totally different games now than they were then.

 

[patdog]

Jake just has a lot of things that are beyond his control that are working against him.

He can truly hit and get on base at an MLB level. No question.

He can also run the bases and play outfield at an MLB level. No question.

But in the analytics era, MLB outfield positions are not at a defensive premium, which means everyone is looking for big offense and power in those spots in the lineup, and there is a much larger sample size of players to choose from that fit those roles.

He’s also been screwed by the expanded roster sizes and platooning craze. His greatest and most rare asset - being a switch hitter - no longer matters anymore. 15 years ago when they had the dress roster capped at 25 players or whatever it was, he’d have tremendous value as an end of the bench PH and utility outfielder. But now, everyone has 1-2 big bats from each side that they can PH with, AND a defensive specialist who can probably also hit with some pop.

He’s never going to be able to throw right handed, which means he’ll never be able to play infield. And his physical traits are never going to put him in that 30-35 HR stratusphere, either. Those are the hard facts. He does everything else as well as you could expect any MLB every day player to do them.

In another era, he maybe could have had a solid 10-year career. But all of what you say plus the fact he didn’t turn pro until he was 23 years old really work against him.

 

[DawgatAuburn]

In another era, he maybe could have had a solid 10-year career. But all of what you say plus the fact he didn’t turn pro until he was 23 years old really work against him.

I've been hoping since last year that the rule changes might increase his chances of a callup. Banning the shift gives singles/doubles hitters a better opportunity for success. Larger bases can lead to more hits when you have good speed. It also led to a dramatic increase in stolen base attempts last year (but Jake hasn't proven to be much of a runner in the minors). So far it hasn't happened for him though, and even at just 28, Jake is getting old to still be in AAA without ever having earned a callup.

 

[Perd Hapley]

In another era, he maybe could have had a solid 10-year career. But all of what you say plus the fact he didn’t turn pro until he was 23 years old really work against him.

I do think the age thing is a bit overblown. But him not turning pro until 23 is all related to everything above. It’s not a problem, it’s a symptom of the other limitations. He’d have been a 1st round pick as a sophomore if he was hitting 10-15 HR’s against SEC pitching.

 

[Anon1704414204]

So "Money Ball" was just a short fantasy honeymoon

 

[MSUDC11-2.0]

So "Money Ball" was just a short fantasy honeymoon

Well those teams were also over 20 years ago now.

 

[DoggieDaddy13]

Roy Hobbs.

 

[TheDawgSaint]

So "Money Ball" was just a short fantasy honeymoon

Ummm 20 years is a long honeymoon***

 

[Bulldog Bruce]

Jake just has a lot of things that are beyond his control that are working against him.

He can truly hit and get on base at an MLB level. No question.

He can also run the bases and play outfield at an MLB level. No question.

But in the analytics era, MLB outfield positions are not at a defensive premium, which means everyone is looking for big offense and power in those spots in the lineup, and there is a much larger sample size of players to choose from that fit those roles.

He’s also been screwed by the expanded roster sizes and platooning craze. His greatest and most rare asset - being a switch hitter - no longer matters anymore. 15 years ago when they had the dress roster capped at 25 players or whatever it was, he’d have tremendous value as an end of the bench PH and utility outfielder. But now, everyone has 1-2 big bats from each side that they can PH with, AND a defensive specialist who can probably also hit with some pop.

He’s never going to be able to throw right handed, which means he’ll never be able to play infield. And his physical traits are never going to put him in that 30-35 HR stratusphere, either. Those are the hard facts. He does everything else as well as you could expect any MLB every day player to do them.

The TLDR version: Analytics and the emphasis on role specialization has totally screwed over the old school players who are really good at a lot of different things, but not elite at any of them.

Harrison Bader has never hit more than 16 HRs in a season and has only hit double digits 3 times. He has been on a major league roster since 2017 (4 teams currently with the Mets). He is a career .245 hitter. I have watched him this year and Jake is better than he is. The only Center Fielder in MLB with more than 17 HRs this season is Judge. He deserves a chance.

But this is baseball. I knew plenty of guys that could have been good MLB players but never got a chance. I also know guys that got on the good side of talent evaluators and the scouts/management try to prove themselves right and give those players way too many opportunities.

 

[Bulldog Bruce]

So "Money Ball" was just a short fantasy honeymoon

They had an awesome pitching staff. That walking BS was a load of

 

[Anon1704414204]

They had an awesome pitching staff. That walking BS was a load of

One of my favorite movies / baseball stories though. Grew up a Mets fan and remember being disappointed when Billy didn't pan out.

 

[Perd Hapley]

Harrison Bader has never hit more than 16 HRs in a season and has only hit double digits 3 times. He has been on a major league roster since 2017 (4 teams currently with the Mets). He is a career .245 hitter. I have watched him this year and Jake is better than he is. The only Center Fielder in MLB with more than 17 HRs this season is Judge. He deserves a chance.

But this is baseball. I knew plenty of guys that could have been good MLB players but never got a chance. I also know guys that got on the good side of talent evaluators and the scouts/management try to prove themselves right and give those players way too many opportunities.

When Bader was last where Jake is (2017), he hit 20 HR’s in 479 plate appearances in AAA. Went deep 4.1% of the time.

You don’t have to even go that far though. Current Rays CF Jose Siri is hitting .211 on the year. Awful. But, when he was where Jake is right now, he had a .921 OPS, had 16 HR’s in 397 PA (4.03%) in his last AAA season before call-up, and he’s keeping that HR rate up even in the show.

Jake is having a great year, but he’s currently hitting a HR in only 0.8% of plate appearances. Even those 2 really mediocre players are going yard 5x as often as he would. Don’t have to be able to hit it out a ton, but you’ve gotta be a threat to do it at least once every 5-6 games or so. Could he still make it in some organization? Probably, but he’d have to be pigeon holed into a situation where a club was getting a lot more power than is typical from the middle IF / C positions in the order, and thus could sacrifice a little bit in the leadoff spot there. And he would still be pretty expendable there even if he got to stick around for a little bit.

 

[HuntDawg]

Jake just has a lot of things that are beyond his control that are working against him.

He can truly hit and get on base at an MLB level. No question.

He can also run the bases and play outfield at an MLB level. No question.

But in the analytics era, MLB outfield positions are not at a defensive premium, which means everyone is looking for big offense and power in those spots in the lineup, and there is a much larger sample size of players to choose from that fit those roles.

He’s also been screwed by the expanded roster sizes and platooning craze. His greatest and most rare asset - being a switch hitter - no longer matters anymore. 15 years ago when they had the dress roster capped at 25 players or whatever it was, he’d have tremendous value as an end of the bench PH and utility outfielder. But now, everyone has 1-2 big bats from each side that they can PH with, AND a defensive specialist who can probably also hit with some pop.

He’s never going to be able to throw right handed, which means he’ll never be able to play infield. And his physical traits are never going to put him in that 30-35 HR stratusphere, either. Those are the hard facts. He does everything else as well as you could expect any MLB every day player to do them.

The TLDR version: Analytics and the emphasis on role specialization has totally screwed over the old school players who are really good at a lot of different things, but not elite at any of them.

He can’t hit or get on base at the mlb level. If he could, he would have been called up. His ops career is under 800, this is being older than most of the player he’s played against at all levels. He’s considered below average offensively. Also the fact that he’s started half the games in left and right and the other half in center… also means he’s not as dynamic defensively as needed to be… in other words there in a center fielder whose better than him on the roster.

the fact he’s been in 4 organization, is 28 years old, and never even been on a 40 man roster. says a lot… but he doesn’t do everything else as well as you could expect an mlb player to do… he honestly does almost nothing as an mlb regulat every day player ……. Just hard facts


maybe he gets a cup of coffee out of respect for a long minor league career…. But he’s never getting anything more than that

 

[HuntDawg]

Harrison Bader has never hit more than 16 HRs in a season and has only hit double digits 3 times. He has been on a major league roster since 2017 (4 teams currently with the Mets). He is a career .245 hitter. I have watched him this year and Jake is better than he is. The only Center Fielder in MLB with more than 17 HRs this season is Judge. He deserves a chance.

But this is baseball. I knew plenty of guys that could have been good MLB players but never got a chance. I also know guys that got on the good side of talent evaluators and the scouts/management try to prove themselves right and give those players way too many opportunities.

bader is in a different stratosphere defensively than magnum is….l not to mention better offensivelay at every comparable age and level thru the minor leagues.

jake only had success in the minors when he started playing against kids that didn’t have his experience.

grezt College player. Not a pro. like many others before him.

 

[Bulldog Bruce]

When Bader was last where Jake is (2017), he hit 20 HR’s in 479 plate appearances in AAA. Went deep 4.1% of the time.

You don’t have to even go that far though. Current Rays CF Jose Siri is hitting .211 on the year. Awful. But, when he was where Jake is right now, he had a .921 OPS, had 16 HR’s in 397 PA (4.03%) in his last AAA season before call-up, and he’s keeping that HR rate up even in the show.

Jake is having a great year, but he’s currently hitting a HR in only 0.8% of plate appearances. Even those 2 really mediocre players are going yard 5x as often as he would. Don’t have to be able to hit it out a ton, but you’ve gotta be a threat to do it at least once every 5-6 games or so. Could he still make it in some organization? Probably, but he’d have to be pigeon holed into a situation where a club was getting a lot more power than is typical from the middle IF / C positions in the order, and thus could sacrifice a little bit in the leadoff spot there. And he would still be pretty expendable there even if he got to stick around for a little bit.

Good stats. Jake has been improving through his minor league career. He has hit better in AAA than any other level. Bader peaked early and has been in a slow decline. I still think there is a place for .300 hitters.

 

[Perd Hapley]

He can’t hit or get on base at the mlb level. If he could, he would have been called up.

His AAA career OPS is better than quite a few longterm MLB players were at the same level. Adam Frazier being one of them just off the top of my head. He can certainly hit and get on base at an MLB level.

His ops career is under 800,

Well the average MLB OPS is about .750, sooooo……

this is being older than most of the player he’s played against at all levels.

What does that matter? You don’t hit a 98 mph fastball better just because you’re older than the guy that threw it. This is a nonfactor.

He’s considered below average offensively.

This is a gross oversimplification. He just doesn’t hit for enough power at a position that now demands it, almost without exception, in today’s game. But his overall offensive profile is plenty good enough for MLB in general. He’d certainly make it easily as a 2B, SS, or C. And most days he’d be good enough as an OF, just doesn’t have the power ceiling he needs.

Also the fact that he’s started half the games in left and right and the other half in center… also means he’s not as dynamic defensively as needed to be… in other words there in a center fielder whose better than him on the roster.

There is probably a better CF than him on the roster….Kameron Misner who was the 35th overall pick out of Mizzou in same draft as Jake. But it’s not necessarily that he’s better defensively. He has 15 bombs, and just has better offensive measurables. He and Jake both have the exact same OPS though at .805. The HR’s are what matter though.

 

[HuntDawg]

His AAA career OPS is better than quite a few longterm MLB players were at the same level. Adam Frazier being one of them just off the top of my head. He can certainly hit and get on base at an MLB level.


Well the average MLB OPS is about .750, sooooo……


What does that matter? You don’t hit a 98 mph fastball better just because you’re older than the guy that threw it. This is a nonfactor.



This is a gross oversimplification. He just doesn’t hit for enough power at a position that now demands it, almost without exception, in today’s game. But his overall offensive profile is plenty good enough for MLB in general. He’d certainly make it easily as a 2B, SS, or C. And most days he’d be good enough as an OF, just doesn’t have the power ceiling he needs.


There is probably a better CF than him on the roster….Kameron Misner who was the 35th overall pick out of Mizzou in same draft as Jake. But it’s not necessarily that he’s better defensively. He has 15 bombs, and just has better offensive measurables. He and Jake both have the exact same OPS though at .805. The HR’s are what matter though.

1. His career ops is higher than some mlb players because most mlb players don’t have 3 seasons to compile those stats. They are there for a breif period and gone.

2. sub par 800 ops guys aren’t going to just move that right over against mlb pitching. His ops in the bigs would be much less than 750

3. Goes back to experience. Lots of advantages to being seasoned vs trying to figure it out.

4. All postitons demand an element of power. He’s proven not on most days, but all days he’s not good enough to be an mlb outfielder. we can all wish he was an elite 2b or ss but he’s not.. we could all wish to throw 100 as well….

5. There isn’t probably a better outfielder. It’s there is definitely a better outfielder. If Jake were the best center fielder hed get more than half his starts at the position and he doesn’t.

end of day. Jake will never have a big league career. At this point you hope he gets a cup of coffee and I hope that hard for him. But he’s 28, never made a 40 man, been in many organizations to be given that shot.. and he can’t get over the hump. Seems like hes a career minor leaguer… won’t be the first or last

 

[StillTbonewannabe]

He was either 1st or 2nd in spring training in batting avg. MLB for the most part just doesn't care about avg anymore. I don't enjoy watching MLB as much as I used to.

 

[ababyatemydingo]

He was either 1st or 2nd in spring training in batting avg. MLB for the most part just doesn't care about avg anymore. I don't enjoy watching MLB as much as I used to.

I was in Tampa week before last for a conference and we went to the Rays and Cleveland Guardians (Indians) game. Seemed like every batter they had on the jumbotron had .206 avg. crazy. Saw the same thing a couple months back in Biloxi at the Shuckers game.

 

[Perd Hapley]

I was in Tampa week before last for a conference and we went to the Rays and Cleveland Guardians (Indians) game. Seemed like every batter they had on the jumbotron had .206 avg. crazy. Saw the same thing a couple months back in Biloxi at the Shuckers game.

Its horrible. MLB sucks so damn bad now with this crap. Its not that guys can’t hit as well as they used to. They just aren’t even trying to do anything besides hit home runs, or walk. It makes for a terrible product. You have this gigantic, beatiful plot of grass and turf in these MLB parks that never gets used for anything.

Can’t really blame the players or the coaches. They are only doing what actually is the most efficient thing in the current environment. Something just needs to be done to make the game more well rounded again. A heavier ball, higher seam, or larger strike zone would be my biggest 3 requests. Maybe do all of those things.

 

[TNDawg1]

I figure that if Robson could get a minute then Jake would, brief as it would be.

 

[HuntDawg]

The rays traded for a 24 year old mlb outfielder that was once a highly regarded prospect at the trade deadline.. Dylan Carlson. Pushing Jake further down the depth chart. Jake needs to get into another organization. Was hoping for him the trade deadline open up some space but seems like it clogged it.

 

[thatsbaseball]

What Jake needs (if he hasn't already gotten it) is a call from a wealthy State alumni saying " son, when you get tired of those a-holes you're dealing with, call me....we need to talk".

 

[JackShephard]

I've read on the other board that Magnum has no chance of being called up. The negativity on that board dwarfs the negativity on this board and that's a high bar.

It's generally Todd, Coach, and a couple of other wanna be know it alls, who don't actually know much, arguing with each other. Any time there's a baseball thread on any MSU message board and I see a comment by Todd, I skip over it. Years ago, I didn't know any better.

 

[She Mate Me]

It's generally Todd, Coach, and a couple of other wanna be know it alls, who don't actually know much, arguing with each other. Any time there's a baseball thread on any MSU message board and I see a comment by Todd, I skip over it. Years ago, I didn't know any better.

For me, one of the truly great things about this site is the fact that Coach34 is not here.

He absolutely ruined it for me. I literally left for a few years. Was overjoyed to find out he was Ghandi.

 

[Perd Hapley]

The rays traded for a 24 year old mlb outfielder that was once a highly regarded prospect at the trade deadline.. Dylan Carlson. Pushing Jake further down the depth chart. Jake needs to get into another organization. Was hoping for him the trade deadline open up some space but seems like it clogged it.

Carlson is just another subpar warm body who already appears to have been a bust. He’s only 24 but he started in the minors at age 17. OPS of .515 this year for the Cards….in his 5th year of MLB. He’s not even as good as Siri….the current CF for the Rays who is also not having a great year…..and he also has no power to speak of.

I agree that Jake could use a change of scenery….as he really needs a very specific set of circumstances to line up for him to make it up. But this move is a nothingburger.

 

[HuntDawg]

Carlson is just another subpar warm body who already appears to have been a bust. He’s only 24 but he started in the minors at age 17. OPS of .515 this year for the Cards….in his 5th year of MLB. He’s not even as good as Siri….the current CF for the Rays who is also not having a great year…..and he also has no power to speak of.

I agree that Jake could use a change of scenery….as he really needs a very specific set of circumstances to line up for him to make it up. But this move is a nothingburger.

Oh I wasn’t saying that Carlson was great. Just saying he’s clearly above Jake on the pecking order and shows that the rays aren’t looking to move Jake or any of the minor leaguers up at this point despite success or lack there of

 

[patdog]

Oh I wasn’t saying that Carlson was great. Just saying he’s clearly above Jake on the pecking order and shows that the rays aren’t looking to move Jake or any of the minor leaguers up at this point despite success or lack there of

Yep. I think realistically Jake is playing for the joy of it and the hope that maybe he can get a cup of coffee in the big leagues in the next couple of years. I think he has to know he's just not going to get the chance for anything other than a 10-day injury roster addition.

 

[HuntDawg]

Yep. I think realistically Jake is playing for the joy of it and the hope that maybe he can get a cup of coffee in the big leagues in the next couple of years. I think he has to know he's just not going to get the chance for anything other than a 10-day injury roster addition.

Yep. And the lack of the entire mlb roster being allowed to expand to 40 in September has hurt those guys looking for their one shining moment.

However again… Mangum would have to be added to a 40 man roster to even have a shot.. and that’s a big hurdle he’s yet to climb and something that isn’t just easy for mlb teams to do

 

[ZombieKissinger]

For me, one of the truly great things about this site is the fact that Coach34 is not here.

He absolutely ruined it for me. I literally left for a few years. Was overjoyed to find out he was Ghandi.

Same. I was gone a few years mostly because of him. I think that’s when I lost the Henry Kissinger profile and had to come back as a zombie

 

[ZombieKissinger]

Same. I was gone a few years mostly because of him. I think that’s when I lost the Henry Kissing profile and had to come back as a zombie

He was kind of like glfr but for sport-related topics instead of politics, but I actually like glfr

 

[Perd Hapley]

Yep. I think realistically Jake is playing for the joy of it and the hope that maybe he can get a cup of coffee in the big leagues in the next couple of years. I think he has to know he's just not going to get the chance for anything other than a 10-day injury roster addition.

Yeah, I mean he gets the equivalent of about $55-$60k to play a kids game every day for 5-6 months a year, and do whatever the hell he wants for the other half of the year. And whether he gets called up or not, he still gets to lay claim to being one of the top 0.0001% of baseball players on planet Earth either way.

There are worse outcomes, for sure.

 

[patdog]

Yeah, I mean he gets the equivalent of about $55-$60k to play a kids game every day for 5-6 months a year, and do whatever the hell he wants for the other half of the year. And whether he gets called up or not, he still gets to lay claim to being one of the top 0.0001% of baseball players on planet Earth either way.

There are worse outcomes, for sure.

And he doesn’t have to worry about what he’s going to do after baseball. He’ll have options. And will do well whatever he decides to do.