John Cohen Bowl Rubber Game
- Thread starter 57stratdawg
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Technically would just need 7-5 or 8-4 but I’m not seeing the path to that. I am not sure we win another series.
The loss of Dohm is arguably a bigger deal than losing the actual game.
I agree in part, but we’ve had Cade Smith, Nixon, (likely) Dohm, Pico Kohn, Gartman, Brooks Auger, all miss time this year. Those are probably 6 of the top 10 arms on the staff.
That’s a lot for a staff to handle.
This year wouldn’t be as much of a problem if last year doesn’t happen.
if lemonis wants to keep a job, he needs to avoid a late season collapse. 4 weeks a lot can happen, but one thing is for sure I believe now. If we finish 2-10, he’ll be gone.
if lemonis wants to keep a job, he needs to avoid a late season collapse. 4 weeks a lot can happen, but one thing is for sure I believe now. If we finish 2-10, he’ll be gone.
All true, but you’ve still gotta figure out a way to give up less than 9 earned runs per game in conference play.
And, as unfortunate as it is, the game has changed substantially with the velocity emphasis that is pretty much universal now in both college and the big leagues. That means that honestly, every big time college program should be expecting a bare minimum of 15-20% of the pitching roster to be shelved by TJ every damn year…along with greatly increased risk of other nagging injuries as well. It sucks but that’s the game now….everyone has to deal with it so its no longer an excuse. In recruiting, you need backup plans on top of back up plans on top of backup plans with the pitching staff. Hard to do that when you miss on an entire class worth of pitchers like we did in 2021.
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Either it’s a) an abnormal number of injuries or b) standard in todays game and everyone deals with it
At this point, both require significant questioning bc it’s a two year stretch.
At the end of the day, pitching injuries are bad luck more often than not, but you’ve gotta figure out a way to maneuver through it. There’s a lot that can be said about Andy Cannizaro, but he took a team totally ravaged by pitching injuries and won 17 SEC games and a Regional with them.
I was more sympathetic to the injury situation last year when it was Sims we were talking about. That one injury totally changed the ceiling of our season. This year is different in my eyes. We were struggling from Week 1 against VMI before any notable injuries.
This. Although it sucks to lose pitching. We have been bad all season. And it’s not like we lost a 1st round arm that we were building our entire rotation around this season either
Struggling yes, but had made some recent headway.
Now, looks like have no closer of any nature.
Not that I have seen anyway.
How many games have those guys won us or would have won us. Only maybe a few of those guys are the level of pitcher we actually need. The arms that held us together the year we went to cws with Henderson were way better and don't forget we had magnum pitching some that year mid season. We have had a ton of arm injuries in the past and still put up better pitching that what we have seen this year and last. Foxhall and lemonis simply haven't found thre right talent or developed it
Especially when the staff is at fault for how they have worked with and developed this staff. Recruit and sign 6 Knuckleballers next year and get that guy at JSU that throws a 78 mile fastball to transfer in and we are in business.
Mostly agree, but actually think you gotta give the credit to Gary Henderson much moreso than Cannizarro with that team.
The biggest loss this year was easily Pico Kohn, who very well could have been our Friday night guy or a weekend starter at absolute minimum. Absolute worst case - he would have been our top middle reliever like he was at the end of last season. But as you said, he wasn’t going to be a Landon Sims level starter. Him not throwing a pitch all year, plus still having to hold Auger and Simmons on the roster really limited us in a lot of ways.
We still had 17 or 18 guys healthy in week 1, which should have been enough to cobble together an at least serviceable staff of 8-10 reliable arms. But it just hasn’t happened.
I actually think cannizario was a damn good coach and a damn good fit…. ON the field
he was also smart enough to surround himself with good coaches, kudos for him for doing so.
he definitely deserves more credit than he gets and was a main reason in getting kids like tanner Allen in here
Cannizzaro was a clown…..and he was a clown for a lot longer than people realize just from the affair stuff and for a lot more reasons than the affair stuff, too. The fact that he couldn’t even land another college assistant job and had to settle for a high school gig….and somehow found a way to get fired from that in the middle of his team’s playoff run ought to tell you all you need to know. Completely clueless and aloof as a manager of a high level college program, and a toxic narcissist to boot.
He was a great recruiter, but that’s about it. A lot of guys of his personality type are. Henderson and Gautreau basically kept both of those teams from going totally off the rails. Players hated Cann once they saw the real guy managing the day to day during the first offseason and fall camp, and it was a mutiny from them that was the real reason he was fired. People forget that he wasn’t even there for the fall camp before 2017….that was still Cohen and all Cann did was let the assistants mostly run the show in the preseason practices.
Funny take.
I can almost assure he there wasn’t a mutiny and he wasn’t fired because the players hated him. The stuff that you spout off that you claim to be true is downright comical.
The other stuff. Your welcome to your opinion on.
amazing a team with very little talent over achieved, won 40 games, he turned a guy into the national player of the year, but ya know he was actually a terrible coach/clown and the other members of the staff deserve all the credit
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And yet still, not near the circus clown that Lemonis is.
I mean you can believe whatever the hell you want….I don’t care. But all this comes from inside the program, and I’m far from the only one who heard the same stuff.
And its stunning that you can’t believe that the other staff members deserve the credit, when literally the very next season those exact coaches took that 2018 team - without the national player of the year - way further than they went in 2017….without Cann even being in the picture.
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With your history of spouting stuff off on these boards. I will believe whatever the hell I want. And it’s certainly not that.
what happened the following year means very little. The man over achieved in his one full season as head coach and developed players. He deserves all the credit in the world for that. It’s not hard to see.
you act like your the only one with connections to the program. I can assure you once again there was no mutiny.
truly hilarious take
also your inside the program connections obviously forgot that geatreau wasn’t even on staff in 2017. Hard for someone to “keep things on the rails” when he wasn’t there… more idiot type bull17s spouted off your mouth that isn’t anywhere near the truth
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Also utterly hiliarious that the next season he took the very same kids to the cws. The next season is when the group of Jordan Allen westburg and foscue came in. Along with Ethan small. That group had enormous talent and started from day one. Once they got some experience they got hot at the right time and the run was made.
But that class was arguably our best class of talent in recent memory.
but then again I guess we can give that credit to the “rest of the staff” as well for getting that group to Starkville
by the sounds of it you had a family member on those teams that probably didn’t get ti play or was cut by Cannizzaro. Bc you sound like a bitter travel ball parent
you can think question everything he did off the field. But facts are he made a positive impact on the program on the field. He vastly over achieved in his first year here and be recruited and was able to get to campus the core of the group that basically made the runs over the last few years. If you want to give that credit to Gary Henderson, who was put out to pasture after that season as well, and geatreau who wasn’t here to recruit that class nor has ever run a program himself at any level… then have at it, but as stated earlier that’s truly a funny take
But that class was arguably our best class of talent in recent memory.
but then again I guess we can give that credit to the “rest of the staff” as well for getting that group to Starkville
by the sounds of it you had a family member on those teams that probably didn’t get ti play or was cut by Cannizzaro. Bc you sound like a bitter travel ball parent
you can think question everything he did off the field. But facts are he made a positive impact on the program on the field. He vastly over achieved in his first year here and be recruited and was able to get to campus the core of the group that basically made the runs over the last few years. If you want to give that credit to Gary Henderson, who was put out to pasture after that season as well, and geatreau who wasn’t here to recruit that class nor has ever run a program himself at any level… then have at it, but as stated earlier that’s truly a funny take
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Fun fact: Cann is back in coaching. He is coaching a u9 Knights team in the Grand Slam State Tournament soon. Wake up the bats!
Well, it seems I have my own stalker now who is literally replying with two posts to every one of mine. Adorable.
When you’re saying the assistant staff aren’t the ones that deserve any credit, the fact that they were the only ones around the next season when we had a higher degree of success means quite a bit.
No, I’m certainly not the only one. And I said that. Nothing I said is that much of a secret to people who were in and around Starkville during his tenure.
Never said he was. Just said the main assistants held those 2017-2018 teams together and you can add Will Coggin to that mix too.
You’re making a fool of yourself now.
From 2017-2018, our team OPS dropped from .789 to .757 with the addition of the “enormous talent”. And yes, that class was very talented, but none of those guys were anywhere close to finished products as freshmen….as evidenced by the production. And none of them were 2017 Brent Rooker either.
Pitching wise, it was mostly a wash in 2017 vs. 2018. Team ERA improved margially 4.9 to 4.4, but BA allowed increased from .244 to .267. Small came back from TJ and was very good, but Pilk took a step back from his 2017 form in both ERA and BA allowed. Lost Spencer Price which hurt, and didn’t have a very deep pen.
You need to stop looking at names on jerseys and start looking at the actual production. We were a virtual wash offensively and pitching / defensively from 2017 to 2018, but we went from winning an easy road regional and getting crushed in the supers to being a game away from the natty series. You think Cann is the one who did that?
Westburg started from Day 1? Nah. Only 120 AB’s on the year in 2018. Only played in 42 games with a .707 OPS.
TA did start from Day 1 and replaced Rooker in the field / lineup. But obviously there was a huge downgrade in production from 2017. Of course, he was still pretty good for a freshmen.
Foscue replaced Ryan Gridley’s 2017 OPS of .850 with his .675 OPS.
Jordan did start and was a good addition obviously.
Nope. Cannizarro deserves credit for being a good recruiter, as I’ve said he was. He was 100% the guy that got us TA. Hard to know how much was him vs Cohen with Foscue and Westburg, who both signed mere days after he was named coach as the change happened to fall during the signing period. But Cann committed and signed them so credit to him. Unlikely that the previous staff had no involvement with them though on the recruiting trail, as I’m sure both were having to communicate with recruits before and during the AD transition. Small was already here under Cohen.
Just an odd statement…..you’re certainly the only triggered one here. You are about the only one left that I’ve seen toting water for Cann as anything other than a hitting coach / recruiter after everything that has transpired….not only during his tenure but after as well. He got himself completely blackballed from college baseball….in case you haven’t noticed. Just one affair or sex scandal doesn’t do that. See Petrino, Freeze, Pitino, etc. And now it seems he can’t even get a HS job as he is stuck coaching 9 year olds travel ball.
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Cant and wont argue with stupid: The 2018 got hot at the end of the season. Jordan/Foscue/Allen all hit over 300 in conference play. When you start freshman expect some growing pains. The 2018 also had 2 future 1st round draft picks, Left handed power arms staritng for them. The 18 team took two guys that started weekend games for them in 17, and they didnt make 1 sec start all year. The 18 team was LOADED with talent, and when it all fell into place the run happened...
But your looking at it wrong. Look what he inherited in 17. He lost 6 starters, his top 2 weekend arms, and his top 3 bullpen arms were all gone off the previous year. That team won 44 games, he won 40 after losing all that talent. Gridley, Brown, Rooker, all made HUGE jumps in develop from the previous season, and Stovall was also better as well. He took everyone thought would take a huge step back, and won with them. Finished 14 in the polls AND landed what is probably the best recruiting class weve had in recent memory----- BUT again ALL the assistants credit there
But again I'm done arguing with stupid.... If you dont want to give Cannizarro credit for the 2017 team and give it to henderson and will coggin and Geautreau (who wasnt even there) So be it. He took a bunch of nearly nobodies and won 40 games (Cody Brown hitting 4th, no Sunday starter), sure give that credit to will coggins
If you dont want to give Cannizarro credit for recruiting, signing, and getting to campus what is probably the best class we've had here in recent memory---and you prefer to give that credit to the assistants go right ahead-- or even the departing coach, go right ahead
If you want to give Will Coggin credit for Rookers year go right ahead
And if you think Cannizarro was an clown and ON the field was a determint to the program go right ahead.
I can assure you there was NEVER a riot, a mutinty, or anything of the such with those players. And his relationship with the player or how he was running the program ON the field, was never an issue with getting him fired.
I'm not triggered or anything of the such. You have an obvious beef with Cannizzaro and you speak about knowing things inside the program (which again is very funny, i can tell this by the way you talk, I'm sure your grandpa has season tickets and talks to Big E every now and then). Any sain person can look at what he did and who he brought in, and give credit where its due. You cant. It comes across like the travel ball mom thats in the stands that cant stand the head coach bc little johnny isnt playing short and hitting 3rd and loves the assistants. Blaming the head coach for every little mistake adn if a tournament is won, its bc the assistants were great.
But your looking at it wrong. Look what he inherited in 17. He lost 6 starters, his top 2 weekend arms, and his top 3 bullpen arms were all gone off the previous year. That team won 44 games, he won 40 after losing all that talent. Gridley, Brown, Rooker, all made HUGE jumps in develop from the previous season, and Stovall was also better as well. He took everyone thought would take a huge step back, and won with them. Finished 14 in the polls AND landed what is probably the best recruiting class weve had in recent memory----- BUT again ALL the assistants credit there
But again I'm done arguing with stupid.... If you dont want to give Cannizarro credit for the 2017 team and give it to henderson and will coggin and Geautreau (who wasnt even there) So be it. He took a bunch of nearly nobodies and won 40 games (Cody Brown hitting 4th, no Sunday starter), sure give that credit to will coggins
If you dont want to give Cannizarro credit for recruiting, signing, and getting to campus what is probably the best class we've had here in recent memory---and you prefer to give that credit to the assistants go right ahead-- or even the departing coach, go right ahead
If you want to give Will Coggin credit for Rookers year go right ahead
And if you think Cannizarro was an clown and ON the field was a determint to the program go right ahead.
I can assure you there was NEVER a riot, a mutinty, or anything of the such with those players. And his relationship with the player or how he was running the program ON the field, was never an issue with getting him fired.
I'm not triggered or anything of the such. You have an obvious beef with Cannizzaro and you speak about knowing things inside the program (which again is very funny, i can tell this by the way you talk, I'm sure your grandpa has season tickets and talks to Big E every now and then). Any sain person can look at what he did and who he brought in, and give credit where its due. You cant. It comes across like the travel ball mom thats in the stands that cant stand the head coach bc little johnny isnt playing short and hitting 3rd and loves the assistants. Blaming the head coach for every little mistake adn if a tournament is won, its bc the assistants were great.
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