Ok so let me see if I've got this right....

[DowntownDawg]

....according to Wardlaw's sources, and also all the general speculation that I've seen from ESPN and the rest of the world, Stoops was number one and Mullen was number two. And as Michael points out, Stoops is a coin flip as to whether or not he'd take it, while Mullen is absolutely not.

So basically, our football program is tied to Meyer's health, just like Florida's is. So as a State fan, I get to spend the next few months waiting on Urban to re-change his mind, or even quit after next year, which in my opinion is highly likely. Florida loses everything, and will probably be an 8 win team or so next year. With the drop off, the fans will start to grumble about whether or not Urban is or can give it his all. This will increase the pressure. Plus, he can't take losing, so he will probably pour himself back in if they drop a couple of games.

Basically, we are in an indefinite period of waiting for the other shoe to drop, and we all know that when it does, there's a 50 percent chance Mullen will be gone, and that's today. Imagine what happens if we are an 8 win team next year. That percentage goes up with every win. Put together a couple of back to back bowl seasons and Florida would probably just as soon have the younger and energetic coach with strong ties to Urban than they would Bob Stoops. Fantastic.

I realize that this is what happens when you hire a good coach that is not a retread. However, this Meyer health situation absolutely puts it over the top. I could see this being used against Mullen in recruiting.

We would've been much, much better off had Meyer stuck with his decision and Florida gotten somebody else. That would've bought us at least a few years with Florida. Now, who knows when Meyer will call it quits? It could be after the game Saturday. It could be after signing day. It could be in the middle of the summer. We all expect him to leave if he is successful, but we need to get at least 4-5 years out of the guy so the program can continue to grow.

In summary, we didn't dodge the bullet yesterday.

 

[DowntownDawg]

....according to Wardlaw's sources, and also all the general speculation that I've seen from ESPN and the rest of the world, Stoops was number one and Mullen was number two. And as Michael points out, Stoops is a coin flip as to whether or not he'd take it, while Mullen is absolutely not.

So basically, our football program is tied to Meyer's health, just like Florida's is. So as a State fan, I get to spend the next few months waiting on Urban to re-change his mind, or even quit after next year, which in my opinion is highly likely. Florida loses everything, and will probably be an 8 win team or so next year. With the drop off, the fans will start to grumble about whether or not Urban is or can give it his all. This will increase the pressure. Plus, he can't take losing, so he will probably pour himself back in if they drop a couple of games.

Basically, we are in an indefinite period of waiting for the other shoe to drop, and we all know that when it does, there's a 50 percent chance Mullen will be gone, and that's today. Imagine what happens if we are an 8 win team next year. That percentage goes up with every win. Put together a couple of back to back bowl seasons and Florida would probably just as soon have the younger and energetic coach with strong ties to Urban than they would Bob Stoops. Fantastic.

I realize that this is what happens when you hire a good coach that is not a retread. However, this Meyer health situation absolutely puts it over the top. I could see this being used against Mullen in recruiting.

We would've been much, much better off had Meyer stuck with his decision and Florida gotten somebody else. That would've bought us at least a few years with Florida. Now, who knows when Meyer will call it quits? It could be after the game Saturday. It could be after signing day. It could be in the middle of the summer. We all expect him to leave if he is successful, but we need to get at least 4-5 years out of the guy so the program can continue to grow.

In summary, we didn't dodge the bullet yesterday.

 

[DowntownDawg]

....according to Wardlaw's sources, and also all the general speculation that I've seen from ESPN and the rest of the world, Stoops was number one and Mullen was number two. And as Michael points out, Stoops is a coin flip as to whether or not he'd take it, while Mullen is absolutely not.

So basically, our football program is tied to Meyer's health, just like Florida's is. So as a State fan, I get to spend the next few months waiting on Urban to re-change his mind, or even quit after next year, which in my opinion is highly likely. Florida loses everything, and will probably be an 8 win team or so next year. With the drop off, the fans will start to grumble about whether or not Urban is or can give it his all. This will increase the pressure. Plus, he can't take losing, so he will probably pour himself back in if they drop a couple of games.

Basically, we are in an indefinite period of waiting for the other shoe to drop, and we all know that when it does, there's a 50 percent chance Mullen will be gone, and that's today. Imagine what happens if we are an 8 win team next year. That percentage goes up with every win. Put together a couple of back to back bowl seasons and Florida would probably just as soon have the younger and energetic coach with strong ties to Urban than they would Bob Stoops. Fantastic.

I realize that this is what happens when you hire a good coach that is not a retread. However, this Meyer health situation absolutely puts it over the top. I could see this being used against Mullen in recruiting.

We would've been much, much better off had Meyer stuck with his decision and Florida gotten somebody else. That would've bought us at least a few years with Florida. Now, who knows when Meyer will call it quits? It could be after the game Saturday. It could be after signing day. It could be in the middle of the summer. We all expect him to leave if he is successful, but we need to get at least 4-5 years out of the guy so the program can continue to grow.

In summary, we didn't dodge the bullet yesterday.

 

[8dog]

if he thought he was going to quit coaching.

guys like this dont just give it up. they just dont.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...we are arguably in just as much limbo as Florida is in.

 

[State82]

it also puts Mullen in sort of a catch-22. He can't sit back and wait because he has no idea what Meyer will do. He has to get out and really bust it recruiting because he has to be successful if he is to parlay this gig into something bigger in the future. If he doesn't, his dream shot never comes along. If this gets used successfully against him in recruiting battles, then success on the field never really materializes and he is screwed and so are we. If he is smart, he will say to hell with all this UF business, get on with running our program to the very best of his ability for a few years and no matter what, he should make all the money he can ever spend whether it is with us or some mega program in the future.

 

[biguglyjoe]

******

 

[JimC1097]

Jeez... Some things in life, you just can't worry about.

 

[AzzurriDawg4]

I agree with you about Meyer not quitting. However, a serious physical manifestation of the stress he puts himself through (read: heart attack), would put and end to his coaching career. Given the way we feel about Meyer (that he is hard-wired to coach and will never walk away voluntarily), you know that the current health situation had to be pretty serious. If it was enough to scare that guy into possibly walking away from coaching, it had to be fairly significant. Bump that up a notch and you have to figure he will step down, which would be a bad thing for not only UF and State, but also for college football overall.

We have all been put on notice, regardless of what happens at Florida. We had the top program in the country interested in our coach after a 5-7 season. Granted, there were some added connections, but still, Florida wasn't going to hire Mullen just because he was a Meyer disciple. A couple of 7 or 8 win years in the next 2 years will have him on the radar of every big program in the nation. It is a combination of the outside perception of MSU and Mullen's talent as a coach. This weekend was just a wake-up call for our fanbase. The best we can hope for is that Mullen wins enough and is here long enough to get the program in solid condition so that we don't have to reinvent the wheel aGAIN with the next hire. If Mullen moves on for greener pastures, I am confident Byrne will make another good hire - this time hopefully with the program on the rise.

That is, if Byrne is still here. 17.

 

[RonnyAtmosphere]

...but if Mullen bolts, why don't we just hire another coach?

Or should I say, if Mullen leaves, whether the MSU fanbase likes it or not, there is a 100% chance Ninja will hire another coach.

I don't get this prevailing sixpackspeak.com idea that Mullen is a seraphic mixture of Knute Rockne, Bear Bryant & Johnny Vaught.

Hell, Jackie came into a wrecked program & went 7-5 his first year. And even then, Jackie didn't receive the love Mullen is getting for going 5-7.

As unrealistic & far-fetched as this may sound, there are other Dan Mullens out there to be hired if it comes to that.

For some inexplicable reason, much of the MSU fanbase has latched onto Dan Mullen as an irreplaceable daddy figure, and if daddy leaves us, then oh ****.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...he could leave anytime. Normally, when you hire a coach away from a successful program, you don't have to worry about that coach quickly returning to that program, because part of being successful is stability. If Meyer goes on and coaches for 20 more years, I know somebody will get Dan, but that's 4-5 years down the road probably. Florida is the wild card and the situation is very unstable.

 

[OEMDawg]

Jesus Christ, some of you have the demise of the program already laid out? I love what Mullen and Byrne have brought to the program: youth, energy, enthusiasm. However, let's actually have a winning season first and see how all this plays out before we pull out the woe is me poor ol MSU ******** once again. Hopefully Byrne is doing his job so that, in case he does leave, he's taught others in the Athletic Dept. and the check writers that MSU CAN succeed without having to resort to retreads and the old LT way of thinking. With the renewed enthusiasm that they helped bring to MSU in just one short year, I dont have that fear any longer that we can't just operate like any other normal program out there, in the running for a decent coach, AD, or whoever we need to lead the program. Sure we don't have Florida or LSU money, but this is no longer your MSU that pays a football coach 400 grand and turns them loose to compete in the SEC.

 

[OEMDawg]

Agree completely. The hiring of Dan Mullen proved one thing: MSU can hire a coach just like any other college football program, offer a salary and a job and the coach accepts. It didn't take previous ties to Starkville, a past Bulldog hero, or a link in the Barrrrrrrr chain. Our AD went out and interviewed, offered a job and a paycheck, and we got a coach with a relatively hot name at the time. God forbid if Dan leaves, we do the same thing next time. I'd rather it not happen, but if it does, we damn sure are better equipped to handle it than at any other time in MSU history.

 

[DowntownDawg]

....Mullen wouldn't be on the radar of anybody else that would be a threat except Florida after a 5 win season. Basically, if you are into percentages, there was a 50 percent chance Mullen was gone on Saturday night if the speculation was correct. That percentage can only increase with success and with Stoops getting older. Again, I realize that we are going to lose Mullen at some point, but we need him to be around for 4-5 years. I'd say at this point, that's unlikely.

Byrne is indeed the silver lining if he is still around.. He hasn't screwed much of anything up yet.

 

[AssEndDawg]

If we are going to go after up-and-coming assistant coaches why wouldn't we put in a prohibitive buy-out for the first three years? Any coach we hire we are going to give at least three years barring some sex, drug, rock and roll scandal. So why not say "we are committing to you and we expect you to commit to us" with a $25 million buy-out for the first three years that goes both ways (with obvious exceptions for the aforementioned scandals). Now, if this is a hot-**** head coach already he would just refuse, but if we are talking assistants I don't see why we couldn't do this. If we hadn't hired Mullen because he wouldn't agree I don't think any of us would have even given it a second thought because while a good choice I don't recall anyone taking a "we must hire Mullen" stance. Just my thoughts. I think losing a coach within three years kills you from a recruiting/momentum point of view so I would do something to stop it from happening. (Maybe we do??)

 

[1984Dawg]

I promise you he is not wasting his time worrying about when his chance will come along. When a job opens up that he wants - and this was probably UF for that 12 hours or however long he knew about it- he will act on it but he does not strike me as the type that is concerned with hypothetical situations that could open up another job for him.

 

[rexxx]

....according to Wardlaw's sources, and also all the general speculation that I've seen from ESPN and the rest of the world, Stoops was number one and Mullen was number two. And as Michael points out, Stoops is a coin flip as to whether or not he'd take it, while Mullen is absolutely not.

So basically, our football program is tied to Meyer's health, just like Florida's is. So as a State fan, I get to spend the next few months waiting on Urban to re-change his mind, or even quit after next year, which in my opinion is highly likely. Florida loses everything, and will probably be an 8 win team or so next year. With the drop off, the fans will start to grumble about whether or not Urban is or can give it his all. This will increase the pressure. Plus, he can't take losing, so he will probably pour himself back in if they drop a couple of games.

Basically, we are in an indefinite period of waiting for the other shoe to drop, and we all know that when it does, there's a 50 percent chance Mullen will be gone, and that's today. Imagine what happens if we are an 8 win team next year. That percentage goes up with every win. Put together a couple of back to back bowl seasons and Florida would probably just as soon have the younger and energetic coach with strong ties to Urban than they would Bob Stoops. Fantastic.

I realize that this is what happens when you hire a good coach that is not a retread. However, this Meyer health situation absolutely puts it over the top. I could see this being used against Mullen in recruiting.

We would've been much, much better off had Meyer stuck with his decision and Florida gotten somebody else. That would've bought us at least a few years with Florida. Now, who knows when Meyer will call it quits? It could be after the game Saturday. It could be after signing day. It could be in the middle of the summer. We all expect him to leave if he is successful, but we need to get at least 4-5 years out of the guy so the program can continue to grow.

In summary, we didn't dodge the bullet yesterday.

You lost me after you said "Wardlaw's sources". Anything you said after that means as much as if you had said that Yancy said it.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...in any case, how about ESPN, the New York Times, and Florida message boards?

 

[DowntownDawg]

nm

 

[AzzurriDawg4]

Where in my post did I project doom and gloom or "woe is me poor ol MSU ********"?

We have one winning season in the last nine. ONE. Now, for the first time since 2001, we APPEAR to be on the upswing and we shouldn't be at least a little concerned about the future of the coach responsible for that upswing? Give me a 17ing break. This is a message board, this is what we talk about.

I am not talking about the demise of the program, I am talking about the success of the program, and it depends on some sustained success - going through yet another rebuilding process would not be good for our program...agree? That being said, where in my post exactly does it say that Mullen is the glue that holds our program's future together? We are operating under the assumption here that Mullen continues to improve and does well enough to be courted by top programs. My only concern is that we get the PROGRAM to a level of sustainability that makes the NEXT HIRE an easy, positive transition. I have no way of knowing if Mullen is the next Meyer or the next Kragthorpe, but what I do know is that we can't take another rebuilding effort. (The Byrne thing at the end of my post was tongue in cheek).

So, let me boil my post down to its simplest form for you:

If Mullen does get hired away some day, I hope he leaves the program in good shape.

Now what do you take issue with exactly?

 

[DowntownDawg]

....and I wonder if this is part of the ongoing contract negotiations with Byrne. I would think Mullen would be inclined to oppose this now. It would certainly be in our best interest to do something like this.

 

[Stormrider81]

Some folks worry too much. I'm not worried in the least about Mullen leaving. For one thing, if Florida hired Mullen after one 5-7 season they are idiots. He has a lot of potential as a head coach, but Florida hiring someone who has yet to prove he can get a team to a bowl game, much less compete for SEC and National Titles, is just stupid.

For another, if they hire him, so what. We'll go out and hire us another coach and play football the next season. It's not like Mullen is the only coach that has potential in the nation. It's also not like LT is running our program.

In any case, I'm not going to waste time worrying about it.</p>

 

[HireCohen]

but I for one think there is an extremely slight chance Newton commits to Auburn. The guy doesn't even decide to take a visit there until a few days prior to the weekend. I believe he is just trying to take in everything that comes with being a high-profile prospect. Everyone gets up in arms when they hear what he says about each visit, my question is simply what would you say? Assuming Mullen really wants him and has stayed on him throughout this entire process I believe he will commit to us. I believe the way the situation has played out, we couldn't be in a better situation. I for one know that none of us know about the behind the scenes details that go on in recruiting, but something strange would have to happen for him not to be a Bulldog. Whatever happens, we will be better at QB for the coming years compared to the past decade.

 

[Sutterkane]

He is hardly put on a pedestal like you say. The biggest reason everyone likes Mullen is because in one season he's taken easily arguably lesser talent and molded it into a solid football team that competed in almost every game. The idea is that coupling this with a few solid recruiting classes and a system that's had 2 years to be learned by the players should equal even more success in the near future.

"We will just hire another Mullen" is a stupid statement. How many promising young coaches also turn out to be huge busts. Hell Mullen could still turn out that way, but at this point it doesn't look like it. If there were Dan Mullens all over college football there'd be a lot more parody, either that or there are some seriously dumb athletic directors out there.

Someone get Colorado, Texas A&M, and Michigan on the phone...apparently we have a poster here that knows where all the potentially successful coaches in america are.

 

[hairy3rd]

I don't think it really matters either way about Florida. The chances of us hanging onto Mullen past 2010 are very, very slim. All he has to do is get us bowl-eligible next year and he'll be ripe for the picking.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...He won't leave after 2010 to anybody but Florida because nobody on that level will offer him a job that soon.

 

[hairy3rd]

Because Meyer went straight from Bowling Green to Florida, I guess...

 

[Todd4State]

First of all, if I was Dan Mullen, and Florida offered me the job, they are going to have to GUARANTEE me that Urban Meyer will not be allowed to come back. I don't think Florida would agree to that. And if you're Mullen, why would you put yourself in a position to essentially go from Florida OC to MSU HC to essentially UF interim HC back to Florida OC?

That's going to be Florida's hang up in all of this. No coach is going to want to go somewhere where they could be gone on a whim whether they win or not. Any coach worth his salt is going to want the keys to the car.

 

[DowntownDawg]

...When Meyer does resign, not an interim thing.

 

[Todd4State]

...When Meyer does resign, not an interim thing.

need that guarantee. Meyer is just now entering his 50's, which is a time when many coaches are in their prime. You just never know when Meyer is going to have that change of heart all of a sudden.

Like this time, he said he was done, and then the very next day, he changes his mind.

I just would not want that hanging over my head as a coach. I was using the term interim loosely, because while Florida will say, OK Dan, it's your job, but then a year later Meyer could say he wants back, and then Foley goes up to Dan and tells him to step aside. Who the heck would want to do that? Especially when at the very worst, you're happy at MSU.

 

[MFReb]

I think you missed his point. While MSU(or even Ole Miss) might not be the sweetest gig in the SEC, its certainly a highlight job to most of the nation.

 

[hairy3rd]

I wish. Until we string together many winning seasons and dramatically improve our facilities, we'll be stepping stone U in football.

 

[GroveHard]

Will State or Ole Miss ever be able to move beyond "stepping stone" status for successful coaches? If so, how? When Nutt was first hired, I thought we would be his last stop, not because we would be able to fend off other programs but because I figured he was in the twilight of his career. Now that doesn't even appear to be true.

 

[fairweatherfan]

DowntownDawg wrote:
I could see this being used <span style="font-style: italic;">against</span> Mullen in recruiting.

I don't see coaches using this to their advantage when recruiting. See example below:

<span style="font-weight: bold;">Coach:</span> "Son, you're a great ball player and we need you. You don't want to go to M-State. Hell, their coach is so good that Florida might call and hire him any day now."

<span style="font-weight: bold;">Recruit</span>: "You are right, Coach. I don't want to play for someone that is so good he may be hired by one of the best teams in college football. I'm glad you brought that up, I really could have screwed up without you pointing that out to me."

 

[8dog]

our facilities are fine and we could probably be one of the top 20 paying jobs in the country if we wanted to.

 

[HippyDawg]

He would not be hired otherwise.

If we pull Cameron Newton that will probably be at the end of 3 years. I am fine with that.

 

[MFReb]

but you dont see many SEC coaches going elsewhere. Right off I cant think of any who left the conference due to winning and being plucked off. So youre just going to stick with the MSU/Bowling Green angle for now? Any SEC coaching gig, possibly outside of Vandy, is a huge deal and highly sought after.......regardless of your recent performances.

 

[sardis]

First, I would hope that Mullen wants to be his own man and do what he said in the interview. If he does, we will find the money.

But, I still think there's a fishy side to this as loosing OC and DC adds a lot of pressure and maybe Meyer asked for more money for them like Tx., Fl. says no, so Meyer says, Ok, I'll resign for all the medical issues I have. He called their bluff and won. It could also be just trying to keep the recruits and players in check till he does retire when someone is hired after the Sugar Bowl.

Finally, I'm glad we have Mullen and I feel a lot better about our chances of filling his position when and if he ever leaves.

 

[ArrowDawg]

.......I was concerned over losing Mullen. How can a losing program do **** when you're constantly changing coaches? Maybe I'm crazy for thinking such an irrational thing.........

 

[DowntownDawg]

....with the top tier consisting right now of Florida, Alabama, Ohio State, and Southern Cal. Oklahoma might be in there. All schools are subject to losing a coach to any one of these places at any time. It gets hazy after that. Would Mullen leave State for South Carolina? I really don't think he would after only two years. I think he might after four, if he felt like he was ready for something new.

But to answer your question, we'll never be in that top tier, so yes, we'll always be stepping stone programs.