Opinions on 4 cities

Pookieray

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Oct 14, 2012
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You're all ignoring the important issues.

Patriots and Red Sox
Steelers and Pirates
Cowboys and Mavericks
Orioles, Nationals, Commanders, and Ravens

He should definitely make this decision based on his fan preference.*
Haha, unfortunately he is not a sports fan at all. Just not his thing, when UVA was playing for the NCAA basketball championship I asked him if he was watching the game , his response was what game!
 

ZombieKissinger

Well-known member
May 29, 2013
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Know nothing about Pittsburgh.

Bethesda
Boston
Dallas

but if he hates the cold, don’t do Boston. Lived in that area for 2 years. Hated winter there much more than I hate it in the west
 

Drebin

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Aug 22, 2012
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My son is starting a post Doc and is having to make a decision between
1) Pittsburg, Pa
2) Boston, Ma
3) Bethesda, Md
4) Dallas, Tx

what are the pros/cons if you’ve lived at any of these places?
Pittsburg is probably the best of the 4 in my opinion. Cost of living isn't crazy, weather is mild, plenty of recreational fun, beautiful area.

Boston cost of living is astronomical. Same for the Bethesda area. Too much congestion. Lots of big city problems.

I work in Dallas and I'm there almost weekly. You can find places to live that aren't outrageous, but in the city, cost of living is also high. Traffic is terrible and the weather sucks. It was over 100 degrees for 30 something straight days this summer.
 

Drebin

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The upside of Dallas would be, likely closer to family (assuming in/near Miss since this is a State message board) and can hop on an airplane and be anywhere directly/quickly.
assuming it's not sprinkling rain because that will shut down DFW for an hour and cause massive flight delays/cancellations
 

Drebin

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Aug 22, 2012
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I'm pleasantly surprised by the Pittsburg love on here. I know nothing about it, but always assumed it was it was Detroit but with the loss of steel jobs driving the crappy rather than the loss of auto jobs. I may have to visit now.
Pittsburg is a nice place. It's as close to a 'southern lifestyle' as what you'd see in that part of the country. And it's not really in an area I'd consider "northeast." It's really more rust belt to me.
 

eckie1

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Jun 23, 2007
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My son is starting a post Doc and is having to make a decision between
1) Pittsburg, Pa
2) Boston, Ma
3) Bethesda, Md
4) Dallas, Tx

what are the pros/cons if you’ve lived at any of these places?
Based on my experiences…

Boston is a beautiful city, but I wasn’t a fan of the people and I would never consider living there. The airport isn’t great, and the public transportation wasn’t either. Driving there is a lot different, too. Pretty harsh winters, but milder summers.

I’ve been to the belt line area, and it’s a cool enough place to visit but I wouldn’t live there either. Their summers aren’t amazing, and their winters can be harsh. Traffic is a nightmare and cost of living is absurd. DC has the best subway system out of all 4.

Never been to the ‘burgh, but always wanted to go. It’s not the ******** it was back in the 70’s. I have a good friend that goes all the time and he raves about it….

I live on the west side of DFW. All in all, I like it here a lot. Summers suck, but 102 here is generally more comfortable than 89 with 100% humidity. Winter starts in February, and is done in 2 weeks. The rest of the time is pleasant.

The scenery is less impressive for sure, but this area has almost everything food or shopping wise. It’s booming, and the people are friendly overall. It has the overall best airport out of any of the other options, as well as Love Field in Dallas. Traffic is probably not as bad compared to Boston or DC, either. Not saying it’s “good”, but I’ve driven in both other places and both wer an adventure. There are commuter trains in Dallas, but in general public transportation isn’t great here.
 
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The Peeper

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Feb 26, 2008
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No opinion of Boston or Bethesda,never been. Dallas would be my last choice on most any list of cities.

I had to go to Pittsburgh for the first time right before Covid for a meeting over about 4 days and dreaded it. I was shocked though, clean, progressive, modern, traffic wasn't bad while I was there, weather pleasant in the summer, I would definitely go back for any reason if the airlines ever get their shat figured out again
 

Bulldog Bruce

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Nov 1, 2007
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A weird thing about Pittsburgh. They don't seem to have a definitive food or cuisine. We went on vacation and stayed there for a leg of the trip, and no food suggestions involved "local" must have food. Perogies were the only things kinda mentioned.
 

The Peeper

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A weird thing about Pittsburgh. They don't seem to have a definitive food or cuisine. We went on vacation and stayed there for a leg of the trip, and no food suggestions involved "local" must have food. Perogies were the only things kinda mentioned.
We kept hearing about Primanti Bros Sandwiches & Pizza, they've been around almost 100 years and had multiple locations. We went twice and they were really good but not just out of this world
 

L4Dawg

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Oct 27, 2016
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Just from visits:
1) Boston. It's my favorite large American city that I have been to, lot's of history, some great food, and just a good vibe (to me anyway). The driving SUCKS, but that goes for the other two on your list I have been to as well.
2) Bethesda. I've never actually been to Bethesda, but I have been to the area several times. There is a lot to like.
3) Dallas. It's just a sprawling mass of suburbs with little to do other than normal suburban things. I don't care for it.
NA) Pittsburg. I have never been but have heard decent things about it. I want to go there someday for sure. One wing of my family settled there for while way back in the day.
 
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Maroon Eagle

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May 24, 2006
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My son is starting a post Doc and is having to make a decision between
1) Pittsburg, Pa
2) Boston, Ma
3) Bethesda, Md
4) Dallas, Tx

what are the pros/cons if you’ve lived at any of these places?
Compare the Research Institutions to each other first.

If there is one that’s regarded as much better than the others (e.g., Carnegie Mellon is in Pittsburgh and most people don’t just refuse without good reason an offer from them), then go for it regardless of COL of location.
 
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Johnnie Come Lately

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Nov 4, 2022
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My son is starting a post Doc and is having to make a decision between
1) Pittsburg, Pa
2) Boston, Ma
3) Bethesda, Md
4) Dallas, Tx

what are the pros/cons if you’ve lived at any of these places?

I hate cold weather and I hate snow even more. On the flip side, I love brisket. Just me, but this would not really be a decision, but more of a default selection through the elimination of non-qualifiers.
 
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Hot Rock

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So without getting too political, post-Covid I tend to look at these sorts of questions and think, under similar circumstances where would I be least likely to have my freedoms restricted. Based on that and with the cities you listed my choice would be obvious.
You are so right. They are restricting things in some states like crazy these days., even your healthcare choices are in jeopardy. You ever heard of an ectopic pregnancy? Some states refuse to let you and your doctor chose what to do and force you to let your wife or child die if they have one. But but but They say if the woman's life is in jeorpardy... You should never have to prove **** to anyone to make a healthcare decision. That is between you and your doctor and your God. Not some idiot in Washington. They are even trying to make it illegal for women to travel while pregnant in Alabama.

Some states are even eliminating things you can learn about in history such as African American Studies or even have you read the Seccession papers (Mississippi's https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states#Mississippi ) and don't want you talking about things like Tulsa riots or the fact that women could not even have a checking account until the 1970's or that the GI Bill only applied to White Americans and not Black ones which created a vast wealth and education gap. No way if I had a choice would I ever live in a Red State that wants to limit knowledge, these right wing fools around me are so tiresome.

They never offer any solutions that work for anything but they sure are good and stopping you from living your life based on their religions. Build that wall they said, any idiot can climb over, dig under or take a cutting torch and drive right through it. What a joke that was. I mean really, we have a bunch of them in my area still supporting a man that tried to overthrow our election process. He may be found guilty of treason and these ******** would still support him.

I am so old, I don't have choices these days.
 

eckie1

Well-known member
Jun 23, 2007
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You are so right. They are restricting things in some states like crazy these days., even your healthcare choices are in jeopardy. You ever heard of an ectopic pregnancy? Some states refuse to let you and your doctor chose what to do and force you to let your wife or child die if they have one. But but but They say if the woman's life is in jeorpardy... You should never have to prove **** to anyone to make a healthcare decision. That is between you and your doctor and your God. Not some idiot in Washington. They are even trying to make it illegal for women to travel while pregnant in Alabama.

Some states are even eliminating things you can learn about in history such as African American Studies or even have you read the Seccession papers (Mississippi's https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states#Mississippi ) and don't want you talking about things like Tulsa riots or the fact that women could not even have a checking account until the 1970's or that the GI Bill only applied to White Americans and not Black ones which created a vast wealth and education gap. No way if I had a choice would I ever live in a Red State that wants to limit knowledge, these right wing fools around me are so tiresome.

They never offer any solutions that work for anything but they sure are good and stopping you from living your life based on their religions. Build that wall they said, any idiot can climb over, dig under or take a cutting torch and drive right through it. What a joke that was. I mean really, we have a bunch of them in my area still supporting a man that tried to overthrow our election process. He may be found guilty of treason and these ******** would still support him.

I am so old, I don't have choices these days.
OP didn’t want to make it political. Nice job, SJW…. 🤦‍♂️
 

HRMSU

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Apr 26, 2022
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Pittsburgh is really nice. I would at least visit it before making a decision. It’s really a hidden gem.

I actually think Dallas might have the worst weather out of these options. It is miserably hot for 1/3 of the year now.

If you’re not buying a house, the cost of living between all these cities really isn’t too far apart. Chipotle and Starbucks in a suburb of Boston isn’t much different than Dallas.

Dallas has 2 months with mid 90s avg temp and 2 months with high 80s low 90s temps so if that is 1/3 of the year miserably hot I question your southernness ****

Also I'll put mid 90s Dallas in the shade vs high 80s Southeast in the shade against each other any day.....one you will be sweating in minutes and the other not so much.
 
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HRMSU

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Apr 26, 2022
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Dallas has some of the most horrendous weather on earth. I lived there for nearly 15 years and it is 17ing miserable. We experienced biblical level weather phenomena.

More than $150k worth of hail damage alone over 3 separate hail storms... Nearly lost a baby/wife because my wife was 40+ weeks pregnant and an ice storm killed power in the city for a week and the cold triggered early labor and we couldn't get to the hospital 4 miles away in less than 3 hours. Also was stuck on a flyover due to a crash when a tornado rolled by and missed us by less than a 1/4 mile. What the 17 do you do in that situation?

The heat is 17ing oppressive and ruins summer. The winters are grey and muddy and occasionally icy. The springs are down right deadly. Fall is the only reasonable season, but you can still hit 100° in October. And the occasional monsoon season might dump a flash flood in the fall.

17 Dallas weather.

Bethesda wins the weather battle. Loses because it's in 17ing DC.

Come on man with that October crap! Dude it's been 100 in Dallas 3 times in recorded history and the last time was Oct. 3rd 1951 so technically you are right but you didn't experience it. October and March is unbelievable weather in the Metroplex.

I agree about the hail but that's why you have insurance. After living in the Southeast for 30 years and in the Metroplex for almost 20 I can tell you from a heat index perspective the difference is marginal maybe a couple weeks longer but marginal.
 
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HRMSU

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Just from visits:
1) Boston. It's my favorite large American city that I have been to, lot's of history, some great food, and just a good vibe (to me anyway). The driving SUCKS, but that goes for the other two on your list I have been to as well.
2) Bethesda. I've never actually been to Bethesda, but I have been to the area several times. There is a lot to like.
3) Dallas. It's just a sprawling mass of suburbs with little to do other than normal suburban things. I don't care for it.
NA) Pittsburg. I have never been but have heard decent things about it. I want to go there someday for sure. One wing of my family settled there for while way back in the day.

DFW homer though I grew up in N. MS but I have to strongly disagree with the nothing to do statement.

You have every major league team including Hockey in Dallas heck you even have a double A baseball team in the northern suburbs. There are some amazing lakes in the Metroplex and within 2 hours drive. Gamblers can be in OK casinos in an hour. Awesome craft breweries all over the metroplex. Live music venues that most bands tour through like Dos XX Pavilion and Gexa and American Airlines Center and Jerry's World for the stadium bands. SMU & TCU in the Metroplex and Baylor less than 2 hours drive. Texas Live in Arlington next to Rangers stadium. Any type of sports coaching or organization you would want your kid to participate in. Friday night lights in high school stadiums. 2 PGA tournaments. The Stockyards, Gaylord Texan, Great Wolf Lodge, 4 Top Golf's, Texas Motor Speedway with NASCAR and Indy racing plus a Texas Country music festival. Perot Museum and Dallas Aquarium downtown with Fort Worth Children's Museum. 2 Zoos. Six Flags with a separate water park. Texas State fair with OU/TX game at Cotton Bowl. Numerous bowl games, ncaa tourney games and playoff games. Really nice public and private golf courses and country clubs if that's your thing.

If you couldn't find anything to do on your visit you may not have been trying that hard.
 
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HRMSU

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Dallas is a hell of lot closer to good skiing than those other 3

Made the 9 1/2 hour drive to Angel Fire several times! You can find cheap flights to Denver and drive a couple hours to the slopes. Heck, you can make Breck driving in 12 hours which is virtually the same as driving to Destin.
 

Bulldog Bruce

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We kept hearing about Primanti Bros Sandwiches & Pizza, they've been around almost 100 years and had multiple locations. We went twice and they were really good but not just out of this world
Yeah, but there is not A sandwich. Memphis and KC are pork BBQ. Texas is Brisket and chili. Carolina has their chopped BBQ with vinegar sauce. Lobster rolls in New England. Philly is cheese steak and soft pretzels. NY is Pizza, Bagels, Hot Dogs, Pastrami Sandwiches. South Louisiana is cajun. Ohio seven layer chili. Indiana with that hammered pork cutlet. Miami a Cubano. Hell Canada even has poutine.

There just wasn't a must have while you are in pittsburgh food.
 

nsvltndog

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I live in Northern Virginia & have spent a lot of time in all these options. I like it here in the DC area other than the Loudoun County politics. That said, if I was given the options listed & didn't have nearby ties to any location, I would pick Pittsburgh or Boston ahead of Bethesda unless John Hopkins is the destination. Maryland side of the DC beltway amps it up a notch. Ive spent my whole career dodging transfers to Dallas so others will need to pump it up. The 3 DC airports (Dulles, Reagan & BWI) are a unique differentiator if looking for a tiebreaker on Bethesda as it is very close to the geographic midpoint for all 3.
 

eckie1

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Jun 23, 2007
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Yeah, but there is not A sandwich. Memphis and KC are pork BBQ. Texas is Brisket and chili. Carolina has their chopped BBQ with vinegar sauce. Lobster rolls in New England. Philly is cheese steak and soft pretzels. NY is Pizza, Bagels, Hot Dogs, Pastrami Sandwiches. South Louisiana is cajun. Ohio seven layer chili. Indiana with that hammered pork cutlet. Miami a Cubano. Hell Canada even has poutine.

There just wasn't a must have while you are in pittsburgh food.
There’s a Pittsburgh style steak…. Charred as hell on the outside but raw as can be on the inside.
 

TaleofTwoDogs

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Jun 1, 2004
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You're all ignoring the important issues.

Patriots and Red Sox
Steelers and Pirates
Cowboys and Mavericks
Orioles, Nationals, Commanders, and Ravens

He should definitely make this decision based on his fan preference.*
Did the Texas Rangers quit baseball like we did?? Asking for a friend.
 

PooPopsBaldHead

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Dec 15, 2017
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Come on man with that October crap! Dude it's been 100 in Dallas 3 times in recorded history and the last time was Oct. 3rd 1951 so technically you are right but you didn't experience it. October and March is unbelievable weather in the Metroplex.

I agree about the hail but that's why you have insurance. After living in the Southeast for 30 years and in the Metroplex for almost 20 I can tell you from a heat index perspective the difference is marginal maybe a couple weeks longer but marginal.
1000011380.png

I guess I am just a big old exaggerating fool... only going to be 97° on Monday October 2nd. Not even close to 100°. Would be a great day to get out and do some fall activities like yard work or deer hunting.**

Beyond the heat, I remember October 2018 setting the record for the wettest month in DFW history with 16+ inches of rain that ruined an entire month of construction projects for me. Then in 2019 we had the worst tornado outbreak in Dallas and the entire state of Texas's history.

And don't get me started on March... I have seen 8 inches of snow (2010) and 8 inches of hail in late March. Last hail storm (March 19') actually busted through the windows and skylights and scared the shìt out of me and was the reason I left that hell hole of mother nature.

1000011383.png
1000011382.png

As for the "that's why you have insurance." Do you have any clue how expensive home and automotive insurance is in DFW compared to most of America? My old house in DFW is worth 30% less than my current home. My insurance was $3k a year 4 years ago on the house in TX. That same home is now at $4.5k per year (sold it to my friend.) My current home has a high rating for the area because we are in a wildfire zone. I pay $800 a year for 30% more coverage than my friend who bought my old house.

Car insurance is 1/3 of what it was in DFW.


Lot to love about DFW, but weather and access to outdoor recreation is horrible. .
 
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eckie1

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Jun 23, 2007
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View attachment 412816

I guess I am just a big old exaggerating fool... only going to be 97° on Monday October 2nd. Not even close to 100°. Would be a great day to get out and do some fall activities like yard work or deer hunting.**

Beyond the heat, I remember October 2018 setting the record for the wettest month in DFW history with 16+ inches of rain that ruined an entire month of construction projects for me. Then in 2019 we had the worst tornado outbreak in Dallas and the entire state of Texas's history.

And don't get me started on March... I have seen 8 inches of snow (2010) and 8 inches of hail in late March. Last hail storm (March 19') actually busted through the windows and skylights and scared the shìt out of me and was the reason I left that hell hole of mother nature.

View attachment 412828
View attachment 412831

As for the "that's why you have insurance." Do you have any clue how expensive home and automotive insurance is in DFW compared to most of America? My old house in DFW is worth 30% less than my current home. My insurance was $3k a year 4 years ago on the house in TX. That same home is now at $4.5k per year (sold it to my friend.) My current home has a high rating for the area because we are in a wildfire zone. I pay $800 a year for 30% more coverage than my friend who bought my old house.

Car insurance is 1/3 of what it was in DFW.


Lot to love about DFW, but weather and access to outdoor recreation is horrible. .
The person you’re replying to literally lives in DFW. I feel as though he has a feel for the insurance vibe here. It’s no worse than anywhere else, but your line of work caught some raw deals. Bless it. **** happens.
 

TaleofTwoDogs

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Jun 1, 2004
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If he lives in Charlottesville, he is technically still in the South. Be warned that yankees live north of the Mason - Dixon line.

My choices based on living or visiting the city.

1. Dallas - Weather can range from 100+ in the summer to the teens in winter but the lows in winter are infrequent. Fall and spring are similar to Mississippi. Summer is brutal in July - August with the heat and lack of rain. Positive - jobs are plentiful in many different industries. Skiing is either Colorado or New Mexico. Both are a short trip from DFW airport.
2. Bethesda, MD - Mostly a commuter town and has numerous corporate offices for job opportunies. Pretty cosmopolitan due to the reliance on Washington DC.
3. Pittsburg - Somewhat revitalized. Nice city but is yankee ground zero.
4. Boston - Nice summers, brutal winters. Funny accents and the locals can be anti-social to outsiders. City is old with narrow streets and one-ways. Nice place to visit for the American history but I wouldn't want to live there.
 

PooPopsBaldHead

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Dec 15, 2017
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The person you’re replying to literally lives in DFW. I feel as though he has a feel for the insurance vibe here. It’s no worse than anywhere else, but your line of work caught some raw deals. Bless it. **** happens.
I understand he lives there. I also lived there most of my adult life. If you don't think the insurance or weather is "no worse" than anywhere else you have lost your mind.


1000011386.pnga


Look I get it. Your proud of your city. But it's absolutely garbage in insurance and weather. I mean pure t-total shìt. Brag about the economy, sports, concerts, whatever... but not those 2 things. That and the number of yuppie douché bags... Yuck.
 
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eckie1

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I understand he lives there. I also lived there most of my adult life. If you don't think the insurance or weather is "no worse" than anywhere else you have lost your mind.


View attachment 412842a


Look I get it. You’re proud of your city. But it's absolutely garbage in insurance and weather. I mean pure t-total shìt. Brag about the economy, sports, concerts, whatever... but not those 2 things. That and the number of yuppie douché bags... Yuck.
You are absolutely psychotic when it comes to your beliefs in your own opinions about everything. And, I mean everything.

Mail out some stupid looking coozies to make yourself feel better and buy friends or something.
 
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HRMSU

Well-known member
Apr 26, 2022
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View attachment 412816

I guess I am just a big old exaggerating fool... only going to be 97° on Monday October 2nd. Not even close to 100°. Would be a great day to get out and do some fall activities like yard work or deer hunting.**

Beyond the heat, I remember October 2018 setting the record for the wettest month in DFW history with 16+ inches of rain that ruined an entire month of construction projects for me. Then in 2019 we had the worst tornado outbreak in Dallas and the entire state of Texas's history.

And don't get me started on March... I have seen 8 inches of snow (2010) and 8 inches of hail in late March. Last hail storm (March 19') actually busted through the windows and skylights and scared the shìt out of me and was the reason I left that hell hole of mother nature.

View attachment 412828
View attachment 412831

As for the "that's why you have insurance." Do you have any clue how expensive home and automotive insurance is in DFW compared to most of America? My old house in DFW is worth 30% less than my current home. My insurance was $3k a year 4 years ago on the house in TX. That same home is now at $4.5k per year (sold it to my friend.) My current home has a high rating for the area because we are in a wildfire zone. I pay $800 a year for 30% more coverage than my friend who bought my old house.

Car insurance is 1/3 of what it was in DFW.


Lot to love about DFW, but weather and access to outdoor recreation is horrible. .

This time of year the high last about 3 hours so mid 90s is mid 80s morning noon and evening. That is comfortable especially at night in the shade or on the patio. Does July, August and half of September suck....heck yes but for the most part it did where I grew up too. Anyway it's good lake and pool weather.

If you live here you NEVER complain about the rain but I get how it screwed up your jobs so totally understand that frustration.

I enjoy March but it can be bipolar especially 1st couple weeks but we are usually at the lake (not in the water) for Spring Break. I've had one hail roof claim in almost 20 years but I could just be lucky. Had several hail storms but very few property damage level storms.

I do notice insurance costs, heck I saved a couple grand shopping it a couple years ago...need to be more consistent with that. Property taxes is what kills me as I pay in one month what I paid in MS for the full year. We've been fortunate to see good market appreciation so that's part of it. I'm sure you could live other places and cut your taxes and insurance if that was your main goal.
 
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HRMSU

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Apr 26, 2022
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I understand he lives there. I also lived there most of my adult life. If you don't think the insurance or weather is "no worse" than anywhere else you have lost your mind.


View attachment 412842a


Look I get it. Your proud of your city. But it's absolutely garbage in insurance and weather. I mean pure t-total shìt. Brag about the economy, sports, concerts, whatever... but not those 2 things. That and the number of yuppie douché bags... Yuck.

Maybe I'm being a little defensive when I think things are a little out of context definitely not trying to fan boy out but the positives way outweigh the negatives and it's not even close.

Look, I lived in the Southeast for most my life and DFW for a couple decades and I prefer DFW. You lived here for most of your adult life and prefer somewhere else and that's great....really.
 

PooPopsBaldHead

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You are absolutely psychotic when it comes to your beliefs in your own opinions about everything. And, I mean everything.

Mail out some stupid looking coozies to make yourself feel better and buy friends or something.
Say what you will about me, I earn every bit of it... But did you just get dookie hurt and blaspheme the greatness of The Dude Koozie?

Looks like someone is off the list for a sleeve of Dude Balls if we beat Alabama this weekend.

1000011391.png
 
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L4Dawg

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DFW homer though I grew up in N. MS but I have to strongly disagree with the nothing to do statement.

You have every major league team including Hockey in Dallas heck you even have a double A baseball team in the northern suburbs. There are some amazing lakes in the Metroplex and within 2 hours drive. Gamblers can be in OK casinos in an hour. Awesome craft breweries all over the metroplex. Live music venues that most bands tour through like Dos XX Pavilion and Gexa and American Airlines Center and Jerry's World for the stadium bands. SMU & TCU in the Metroplex and Baylor less than 2 hours drive. Texas Live in Arlington next to Rangers stadium. Any type of sports coaching or organization you would want your kid to participate in. Friday night lights in high school stadiums. 2 PGA tournaments. The Stockyards, Gaylord Texan, Great Wolf Lodge, 4 Top Golf's, Texas Motor Speedway with NASCAR and Indy racing plus a Texas Country music festival. Perot Museum and Dallas Aquarium downtown with Fort Worth Children's Museum. 2 Zoos. Six Flags with a separate water park. Texas State fair with OU/TX game at Cotton Bowl. Numerous bowl games, ncaa tourney games and playoff games. Really nice public and private golf courses and country clubs if that's your thing.

If you couldn't find anything to do on your visit you may not have been trying that hard.
To each his own. There is little history there. No really significant museums. There is no natural beauty at all. To get to the rest, which is almost all sports, it takes a real effort, and you can get that in most places (esp since you brought two hour drives into the mix). The 4 places in this thread all have most of that, and the stuff I mentioned.
 

BulldogBlitz

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1. Noxapater





1083. All others.



Those four options are different. His personal preference will play into this decision, not us random interweb peeps going on and on about some relative of ours living in one of the four.
 
  • Haha
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