OT: Gang Activity at Germantown Middle and High Schools in Madison?

[615dawg]

Last week, there was a pretty brutal fight at Germantown Middle School involving about a dozen kids, including some 16 year old scholars that apparently are driving to middle school. The video looks like it could be any inner city school, except for the clean cut white kids in the background looking on in shock and horror. The school sent a letter home to all parents that basically scolded the parents. The problem is the parents that read the letter aren't the parents of the problem kids.

Then yesterday, there was a fight at the high school, and one of the students involved was the kid that signed with Georgia. If you have never seen him, he's a grown *** man. The local rumor mill says that this is spilling over from some gang activity in Jackson and Canton.

They built those apartments just north of the school recently. Apparently the trouble is coming from there. The problem is those apartments aren't zoned for Germantown, they are in the Canton school district. People are being lured into those apartments and coached on how to get around the residency requirement for Madison schools.

South Panola got around all that back in the day because they declared themselves an "open school district" under Mississippi law. Madison isn't and will not do that no matter how good Germantown wants to be at football, so they are doing it sideways.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

When I read this post, the first thing that came to mind was this part of a lengthy comment from you last year:

I'm going to add this - they aren't there yet, but Canton Academy could be a sleeper. They are close enough to Gluckstadt to be attractive and there are a ton of rooftops in Gluckstadt with kids. I think they could learn from Hartfield. Change their name, change their focus and they could grow. They already have SACS accreditation (UCS did not when they changed to Hartfield). I'm not sure the current board of CA is interested though. My prediction is that if they don't do it, someone else will see this prime opportunity and jump at it - either a church, or an existing school will expand into Gluckstadt.

From here: Link.

 

[grimedawg1]

Germantown

Is there video? Is it available?
I wish there were new leadership in the district at all levels - but it's always going to be insular until they can get decent leadership that has a track record of success outside the district. The superintendent I think is a nice lady that is well connected socially. But, she is basically a career back bencher in the district that was promoted after a dreadful failure by the board on hiring the prior one (she wasn't even certified in MS). To put it in terms state fans can understand, her hire would have been equivalent to us hiring Raffo after Polk.

The districts get results because of the general raw material (students and parents) that they have to deal with. But, it may not always be so.

One issue is that the Board is populated with 3 residents of the madison central zone, 1 ridgeland and 1 Velma. There is no one rep that carries the water for the GHS zone.

The school board has to redistrict by law after the census. Residents of the Germantown zone need to make sure a district is drawn that gets them a rep on the school board. That would be a start.

 

[615dawg]

Yep. Said the same thing to a friend this morning. No great private choices for as many students are out in Gluckstadt. A bunch of parents are highly concerned after seeing this video.

A private school West of 55 and north of Reunion Parkway would grow very quickly. Someone needs to pull the trigger (checks land rolls ... Interesting)

 

[615dawg]

Someone out Lake Caroline/Stribling way could win a seat if they educated the public that Germantown had zero representation on the board. Its absurd that not one rep on the board lives in the Germantown zone.

 

[Smoked Toag]

I think those Madison schools are under the County school district, so I'm sure they can mix and match. Not sure how living in Canton affects it.

You got a link?

 

[grimedawg1]

The districts are currently drawn encircling Madison the city basically.
10 years ago, GHS did not exist, so it probably made sense.
But, now, GHS is a 6a school and definitely needs representation.

It is just different when a resident is expected to represent the school in their zone. I don't know if there is any explicit bias, but it sure looks like it.

For instance, GHS is about to hire an assistant from Oak Grove to be their head football coach. There would be marching in the streets with pitch forks if Madison Central ever considered something like that. The Coach may do great things at GHS. And, I hope he does. But that would never ever in a million years fly for Madison Central.

 

[grimedawg1]

Canton is its own municipal district.

Madison County has Madison Central, Germantown, Ridgeland and Velma Jackson.

 

[615dawg]

Canton has its own school district and supports its own school zone. If you live in the Canton school district (where those apartments are), you are supposed to attend Canton City Schools, even though those apartments are within long walking distance of the Germantown school property. There isn't a really good map available online.

 

[615dawg]

If we were allowed to completely be truthful - Germantown just isn't going to be competitive in big time football. They would be part of the proposed 7A as well. The athletes that would help them compete with Madison Central, Clinton, Starkville and Brandon aren't growing up in Lake Caroline, Hathaway Lake or Johnstone.

There is a segment of people at the school and involved in the booster club that would love to see those apartments zoned to Germantown officially, then another segment that has no problem with it being "unofficial." Unfortunately, when you have a fight of that caliber with rumors of gang activity attached to it, it hurts keeping the scheme under wraps.

 

[grimedawg1]

Yes, Germantown is not going to be successful at football. There is a lot of talk that coaching has held them back. And, I think there is a little bit of truth in that. But, in general, GHS is not trotting out the numbers of athletes that are needed to compete in football. And, truth is Madison Central wouldn't be (as successful) but for East Flora.

But, there is no reason a school in Madison County cannot hire a top quality football coach with the expectation of reasonable results - similar to State expectations (Germantown) versus Alabama expectations (Madison Central).

 

[Smoked Toag]

Canton has its own school district and supports its own school zone. If you live in the Canton school district (where those apartments are), you are supposed to attend Canton City Schools, even though those apartments are within long walking distance of the Germantown school property. There isn't a really good map available online.

So what is this "coaching" going on?

 

[615dawg]

GHS is having to hire that guy from Oak Grove because NO ONE wanted the job. Its an impossible job to be competitive in that district. And there are booster club members pissed about being turned down and have no issue skirting the law to get talent in.

As one parent put it: "I don't give a **** if they lose every game, we're not going to have a 17-ing gang war in the middle school."

 

[GloryDawg]

How hard is it for a *** hole from one school to get into another school to start problems. It's not. When you 2500 kids in that school how does one person know who everyone is. A Canton Highschool kid who want to go to Germantown to start a fight or sell drugs or what ever has no problem getting in. When the bell rings walk in with the other kids. I am basing this on Brandon Highschool. I drop my daughter off and all the kids are just walking in. No way the teacher at that door can know who everyone is. Now me being a grown *** man could not walk in.

 

[Smoked Toag]

Yep. Said the same thing to a friend this morning. No great private choices for as many students are out in Gluckstadt. A bunch of parents are highly concerned after seeing this video.

A private school West of 55 and north of Reunion Parkway would grow very quickly. Someone needs to pull the trigger (checks land rolls ... Interesting)

If not for my son loving football (real football, not private school daddy balling), public schools wouldn't even be on my radar.

 

[615dawg]

Ways to skirt the residency requirement.

1. Have someone complete a affidavit that student lives with someone other than their parent. There was a scheme in Clinton a few years ago where people were making money by selling these.
2. Straight up fake the documentation. Really easy to do when you know that they won't check.

When those apartments opened last year, there was a Facebook post in the Madison County talk groups about it. Someone had signed a lease and moved into those apartments after being told that they were Germantown schools. It was shut down pretty quickly, but there were multiple responses along the lines of "Lie. They don't check."

 

[grimedawg1]

And, you think daddy balling is not a thing in public schools?

 

[GloryDawg]

Ways to skirt the residency requirement.

1. Have someone complete a affidavit that student lives with someone other than their parent. There was a scheme in Clinton a few years ago where people were making money by selling these.
2. Straight up fake the documentation. Really easy to do when you know that they won't check.

When those apartments opened last year, there was a Facebook post in the Madison County talk groups about it. Someone had signed a lease and moved into those apartments after being told that they were Germantown schools. It was shut down pretty quickly, but there were multiple responses along the lines of "Lie. They don't check."

McLaurin Highschool had a bunch of Brandon guys who were second and third team at Brandon football playing for them. They also have guys from Brandon who could not make the baseball team playing baseball for them. You are so right about getting into other school living out of that zone or district. That part of Madison County is a lot like Rankin. You have grand parents and uncle or aunt's who live outside the city limits of Brandon who are in McLaurin School zone doing exactly what you are saying. Canton an Germantown are so close it is very possible.

 

[grimedawg1]

If the booster club ever thinks they are competing with Madison Central, it just isn't going to happen the way things are currently set up.
With reasonable expectations, they should be able to compete decently.

The old football coach was also the AD. An assistant AD was made interim AD when the old one retired. Do you know if the job was offered as a football only job or also an AD job as well?

The interim AD is likely going to stay permanent AD so I wonder if that was any kind of hang up for more qualified folks. Was that part of the deal all along?

 

[615dawg]

"Hello, this is Coach with the football team. Jim Bob could really help us this season but he just doesn't have a good home life. Him and your son are pretty good friends, you think he could stay with y'all for a couple weeks as school is getting started?"

"Sure. We don't own a Taco Bell, but we have some extra room."

"Great. Gonna need you to sign this form saying he is staying with y'all."

"No problem."

SCHOOL STARTS

"Jim Bob's momma got her an apartment right by the School. Things are looking up. Thanks for your help."

 

[horshack.sixpack]

View attachment 23704

 

[Smoked Toag]

And, you think daddy balling is not a thing in public schools?

Sure it does, just seems it's more pronounced at private schools, because obviously parents are much more involved.

 

[615dawg]

AD wasn't part of it, but I'm sure booster club package was enough to offset it.

Weak administration + pressure of "impossible Job" + shadow of Madison Central + no talent pool = Its a tough draw. Remember, GHS was never really competitive in 4A and 5A as they were growing. They made the playoffs and won a weak district a couple of times, but could never make it out of second round of playoffs.

 

[AlCoDog]

NVm. I immediately regretted responding to your nonsense.

 

[jethreauxdawg]

No one mentioned frats

fraternity boys 17 their girlfriends right out from under them.

Keep telling yourself you are cool

 

[AlCoDog]

I’ll add you to the list.

 

[thatsbaseball]

That's a shame, I hope they can get that crap stopped. Hell of a lot of money being bet on that area with one of the main reasons being the schools.

 

[blackjackdog3]

I don’t know if a private school is the solution. Many private schools are openly recruiting the same kids that are the problem you are referencing. Too many coaches and parents are getting caught up in a win at all cost mentality and don’t care about the kids they bring in just as long as they can play whatever sport they’re being recruited for.

 

[615dawg]

It can be fixed really quickly, but ultimately, people in the community are going to have to accept that Germantown is just not going to have good football, ever. They may have the occasional season where they are able to beat Clinton and make the playoffs as the region 4 seed, but they will not be a serious threat in 6A/7A football. They are terrible in Boys basketball, and better in baseball, but Madison Central won the national championship in high school baseball, so they are overshadowed there as well.

That is proving hard to accept for some people.

 

[615dawg]

Here's what I am seeing. Yes, some private schools are recruiting kids from lower income classes, but they are doing a great job getting these kids to see it as an opportunity. The private school coaches are stepping into roles and encouraging and mentoring these kids. When a public school does it, they are just throwing them into another school. They don't see Madison Central or Germantown as any different than their schools at Canton or JPS and they find themselves in the Same **** that they supposedly left behind.

Ultimately, it gets back to the core issue that is wrong with a lot of our country. Fathers need to step up.

 

[grimedawg1]

No joke!

That's a shame, I hope they can get that crap stopped. Hell of a lot of money being bet on that area with one of the main reasons being the schools.

If the school does not change course, there is a ton of lost property value that may occur in that zone!

We are talking athletics, but academically as well. Madison Central trots out 30 merit semifinalist and GHS is lucky to have 1 a year. MC is touting its 30 plus ACT club and GHS is giving mugs to those that make a 22 I think.

At MC, there is a focus on the top performers it seems. At GHS, the focus seems to be to get low performers to the middle. There needs to be some sort of middle ground - with no group getting left out. Top performers are challenged, the middle are challenged and the lower groups improve. The district basically lets the principals set the agenda at their school it seems. On these sorts of larger policy goals, the district and board ought to be more clued in and setting expectations for the principals to meet.

All this talk over athletics is a waste of time. Schools that are safe and have good academics are places people want to be - athletes and mathletes alike!

 

[grimedawg1]

Does the booster club contribute directly to coaching salaries?

You can pull a 990 for a booster club just like a private school. I don't see any line in expenses that looks like it could be a salary supplement.

 

[johnson86-1]

If we were allowed to completely be truthful - Germantown just isn't going to be competitive in big time football. They would be part of the proposed 7A as well. The athletes that would help them compete with Madison Central, Clinton, Starkville and Brandon aren't growing up in Lake Caroline, Hathaway Lake or Johnstone.

There is a segment of people at the school and involved in the booster club that would love to see those apartments zoned to Germantown officially, then another segment that has no problem with it being "unofficial." Unfortunately, when you have a fight of that caliber with rumors of gang activity attached to it, it hurts keeping the scheme under wraps.

It never ceases to amaze me that there are grown adults that care enough about high school football enough for stuff like this. I'm surprised with how many people move their just for the school district that there aren't enough parents to put a stop to that.

 

[mstateglfr]

The problem is those apartments aren't zoned for Germantown, they are in the Canton school district. People are being lured into those apartments and coached on how to get around the residency requirement for Madison schools.

 

[grimedawg1]

So much of Germantown's present was dictated when it was founded. Shramek hired a basketball coach that had never been more than an assistant and at the time was a football coach in JPS. They did so because he could (supposedly) teach a science (who parents immediately complained about) and because coaching was, something to the effect of, just being able to work with kids. It set the stage for 10 years of a miserable boys basketball program.

In baseball, they should always have a decent level of talent. But, that does not mean the program succeeds at the level it should. GHS has had a couple of good players transfer out to go to Madison Central - primarily because of how the program at GHS is run. One happened to be the Montgomery kid that signed with Stanford. He was Madison's ace and threw in the mid-90s. Get this, as a sophomore at GHS, he did not pitch because "they had enough pitching". Well, he transferred to Madison because of that and I understand some other reasons. And, Madison won the state with him as their ace and 4 hole hitter.

 

[GloryDawg]

That's funny.

 

[Go Budaw]

Ways to skirt the residency requirement.

1. Have someone complete a affidavit that student lives with someone other than their parent. There was a scheme in Clinton a few years ago where people were making money by selling these.
2. Straight up fake the documentation. Really easy to do when you know that they won't check.

When those apartments opened last year, there was a Facebook post in the Madison County talk groups about it. Someone had signed a lease and moved into those apartments after being told that they were Germantown schools. It was shut down pretty quickly, but there were multiple responses along the lines of "Lie. They don't check."

What does any of that have to do with the football program? Sounds like its pretty easy to skirt the rules, regardless of whether its an athlete or not. Anyone who lives in an apartment right across from Germantown is obviously going to want to attend Germantown.

 

[GloryDawg]

I don’t know if a private school is the solution. Many private schools are openly recruiting the same kids that are the problem you are referencing. Too many coaches and parents are getting caught up in a win at all cost mentality and don’t care about the kids they bring in just as long as they can play whatever sport they’re being recruited for.

My nephew was starting QB for Sturgis highschool while in the 9th grade. A booster for Starkville Academy approach my brother and said they want him to play for Starkville Academy. My brother said he could not afford that. The booster said it would be paid for. My brother wisely said I don't want my two daughters to go to different schools. All three went free to Starkville academy. That has been a long time ago. I know a guy his daughter was really good at basketball. JA gave her a academic scholarship. They did not have to pay a dime for JA. She was really smart and deserved the scholarship but just so happens she was a good athlete as well. Neither my brother or my friend went bat **** crazy. They just went and watched them play.

 

[Smoked Toag]

It can be fixed really quickly, but ultimately, people in the community are going to have to accept that Germantown is just not going to have good football, ever. They may have the occasional season where they are able to beat Clinton and make the playoffs as the region 4 seed, but they will not be a serious threat in 6A/7A football. They are terrible in Boys basketball, and better in baseball, but Madison Central won the national championship in high school baseball, so they are overshadowed there as well.

That is proving hard to accept for some people.

This is it. You have to decide what type of school you want to be. Generally, only a bigger private school can have both, because there's a barrier to entry (i.e. money).

 

[615dawg]

If the school does not change course, there is a ton of lost property value that may occur in that zone!

We are talking athletics, but academically as well. Madison Central trots out 30 merit semifinalist and GHS is lucky to have 1 a year. MC is touting its 30 plus ACT club and GHS is giving mugs to those that make a 22 I think.

At MC, there is a focus on the top performers it seems. At GHS, the focus seems to be to get low performers to the middle. There needs to be some sort of middle ground - with no group getting left out. Top performers are challenged, the middle are challenged and the lower groups improve. The district basically lets the principals set the agenda at their school it seems. On these sorts of larger policy goals, the district and board ought to be more clued in and setting expectations for the principals to meet.

All this talk over athletics is a waste of time. Schools that are safe and have good academics are places people want to be - athletes and mathletes alike!

This is as well said as anything I have ever seen on this board. Lots of money being invested in that area but due diligence on the schools has been relaxed. Everyone just assumes that they are great because that's what they've been told.

Germantown is giving out yard signs to kids when they make a 20 on the ACT. That's below the national average. Lake Caroline is full of them.