PSU vs Iowa was the most watched wrestling dual in BTN history
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glad to see viewership increase. Curious if people have ideas how to get increased viewership nationwide for a sport people on this board enjoy so much. I do like early stall warnings to try to get action going! It is amazing how much people pay to watch WWE type wrestling and of course people know results are choreographed but people find it exciting. I sure like college rules over international rules but that is just my preference. Any other thoughts on expanding viewership/interest?
These last few years have been difficult for everybody. And all the testing, and legitimate illnesses that are occurring, I think some leniency is in order. But looking back, Cael was averaging just about 40 matches a year (159-0), and some PSU guys like the Moore brothers were wrestling 45, even 50 matches a year. I'd say once everything gets back to normal (if that ever happens), this "ducking" issue needs addressed. If a ranked wrestler misses a match against another ranked wrestler, it should just be treated as a loss when conference and national seeding is done. Maybe more marquee matchups would occur. These matchups could be promoted with confidence that they will happen, and the product will be even better. High school kids wrestler 30 to 40 matches. We've gotten to a place where top wrestlers only have 10 to 15 matches well into February.
TangSoo-I was not aware of the "ducking issue
problem. Has it happened recently-just not aware of it, can you clarify when it has happened recently. If it has it sure hurts the sports-I love seeing number 1 going against number 2 for instance. Thank you. I am sure wrestlers miss matches because of illness, injury ( our national champions have missed meets recently) but did not know there was a ducking problem but I may not follow the sport as close as you do .Thanks for any further clarification.
problem. Has it happened recently-just not aware of it, can you clarify when it has happened recently. If it has it sure hurts the sports-I love seeing number 1 going against number 2 for instance. Thank you. I am sure wrestlers miss matches because of illness, injury ( our national champions have missed meets recently) but did not know there was a ducking problem but I may not follow the sport as close as you do .Thanks for any further clarification.
I think everyone can agree it sucks when the marquee matchups don't happen, and there definitely has been a trend of it happening more frequently, but making a broad stroke of counting any dual sit out as a loss seems extreme. I think the only way to really make sure this happens is to have a legit dual meet championship. Now I know the NCAA doesn't want a sport to have two championships, and I don't want to take away the fun of Nationals, but this is all a result of wrestling being a 1-2 weekend sport. Coaches are judged based on their team finishes at Nationals, that's pretty much it. Some of it is ducking and seed protection, but a lot of it I think is actual rest and recovery focused. We do it all the time too. I don't think a single PSU fan would have wanted to see Carter wrestle this weekend if it meant he might tweak his wrist more and potentially hurt his chances of being 100% at B1Gs and Nationals. Same with Dean after he got banged up Friday night. I'm pretty sure all of our stars have missed a big match at one point this season. Until our sport becomes about more than 1 weekend in March, our coaches will continue to make the decisions they feel gives them the best chance to have their team at full strength for that weekend. I don't think we'll ever get back to 45-50 matches again, and I don't think that is a bad thing. This sport is absolutely brutal on people's bodies. Especially now that you have kids starting at 5-6 years old an the good ones are wrestling all year long. So they're coming into college having wrestled 10+ years straight. Plus on top of that you have coaches using gray shirts, red shirts, medical shirts, covid years, etc to get guys extra years of eligibility. So now it's not unheard of to wrestle 6 more years in college. The top guys have plans of wrestling in the Olympics or moving to MMA after college and don't want to come out like Spencer Lee with no knees.
In my perfect world wrestling would start in January and nationals would be in mid to late April. Teams should have 10-12 duals and 1 multi-day tournament. Top 4 teams in the polls have a mini dual tournament at the end of march to determine the dual national champs, and this title would be something people really wanted. A week off then the conference tournament, two weeks off then nationals.
There is an issue but I really think that we are in the world of load management. In the past a nicked up guy would go. Now that same guy sits. I am sure back in the day Starocci wrestles this past weekend. This has been coming for a while.
David Taylor wrestled 137 matches
Bo Nickal wrestled 123
Phil Davis 126
Sanshiro Abe 140
I just don't think we ever get back to guys wrestling 40 matches in a season
David Taylor wrestled 137 matches
Bo Nickal wrestled 123
Phil Davis 126
Sanshiro Abe 140
I just don't think we ever get back to guys wrestling 40 matches in a season
Concerning 'ducking', it's been stated before elsewhere, that wrestlers aren't probably making the call to duck an opponent, it's more likely a coaches call and could be due to injury or illness, to see what another lineup guy is going to look like against better competition, and as some might postulate, to protect a seed. I'd guess that most wrestlers want to think they can beat most of the opponents they're going to face. If the ducking is actually to protect a seed, in my opinion that's really poor sportsmanship and how do you prove that? An incident that comes to my mind and I don't recall the specific tournament, but tOSU's Tom Ryan's son Jake was (if I am not mistaken) to wrestle Jason Nolf (I could also be wrong there) but tOSU coach decided that his son would forfeit the match and go to the wrestle-backs bracket, where, I believe he would have gotten an easier path to score more points at the tournament. That did seem (to me) an obvious case of 'ducking'. Of course most fan bases teams' Never duck an opponent, it's just the Other teams that practice that.
Great points. I recall the PSU-ASU match. I remember seeing the ASU heavyweight walking through the handshake line, with sort of a sheepish, maybe even embarrassed grin. I'm sure it was a coaches decision to not wrestle Kerk. Not the wrestlers fault, but still, not a good look.
I agree, we won't see that volume of matches. It just seems really extreme right now (10-15 matches well into February). And I do kind of withhold judgment until we get through the pandemic.
I don't know how this factors in, but there are only 76(?) D1 teams out there now. Perhaps before Title IX(?) there were more teams and more opportunities to wrestle shall we say, maybe not D1 types. Today's athletes just May be in better shape, better diet, much stronger, and at least in the Big 10, facing Top competition week after week than those of a generation ago. Maybe coaches are realizing you can't have guys wrestling top competition week in and week out without some injuries or better, load management (thanks for the new term). Check out the 5th, 6th and 7th year senior (citizens) on America's oldest team, the Iowa Hawkeyes. Kemmerer looks like he's walking off a battlefield, Eierman's got a taped up hand, and Marinelli, well, he's just plain ugly, but his wife makes up for that, and DeSanto is just one 'tap-out' away. Deep breath, Just joking... I think the toll on live-goes catches up to kids that wrestle HARD every day. I'd like to see more potentially dangerous calls called the second one's in trouble, particularly if they are wrestling a team like 'fight club'... Sorry - sometimes you gotta wonder what is the job of the second official. He's got eyes. Call the PD and stop wrestling and restart. Or, what's up with clubbing someone in the side of the head..?
We sometimes get glimpses of what goes on in the PSU room and catch that they don't always wrestle full speed and that allows experimentation, you're not cranking your opponents joint beyond what's reasonable. Wrestling can be fun.
It doesn't need to be a punishment.
Penn State has 17 duals on the schedule and if you add in the Big Ten Tournament and the National Tournament matches say up to 8 guys will be at 25. Nick Lee will likely wrestle no more than 22 matches this season. The last two seasons are one thing because of cancellations but there are plenty of guys that will barely make 20 matches.
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