Speaking of stadium upgrades - The Pirate

[RiceDawg]

I have had this opinion for some time. We had a football coach that was an icon. Not just on the college level, an icon of football as a sport. I am disappointed that no where within or near the stadium is any sort of memorial or mention that he was ever here. No picture, flag, plaque, brick with his name on it. Regardless of how you feel about his tenure, that should change.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Heck man, a sizable portion of our fanbase didn't like him. We didn't deserve him, honestly.

I feel bad for him and his legacy, and he probably should not have come to MSU.

 

[HumpDawgy]

I believe we can contract the sculptor for the Dwayne Wade statue for pretty cheap!****

 

[DawgInThe256]

I don't have a strong opinion about whether he deserves to be an official member of the ring of honor. If not, then having a black circle with the ML pirate helmet logo would be fine.

 

[85Bears]

Heck man, a sizable portion of our fanbase didn't like him. We didn't deserve him, honestly.

I feel bad for him and his legacy, and he probably should not have come to MSU.

Exactly. He should have went elsewhere

 

[Dawgg]

Heck man, a sizable portion of our fanbase didn't like him. We didn't deserve him, honestly.

I feel bad for him and his legacy, and he probably should not have come to MSU.

I feel like he turned a lot of people around with that final season. I know he did with me.

When he was first announced, I thought his offense was going to have a hard time in the SEC and, outside the LSU game, for that first season, I was right. Plus, the games were not fun to watch and we went from a decade of hard running QBs to guys that crumpled on contact or ran in the wrong direction under pressure. So, I mean... I feel like there were some justified concerns in season 1.

Then, we had season 2, and we need a miraculous comeback to beat LaTech at home and we lost to Memphis (yes, we got screwed on the punt return, but it shouldn't have been close enough to matter) and it didn't help that he was 0-2 vs Ole Miss. Then, there were the post game interviews and press conferences about Halloween candy and other nonsense. That's all well and fine when you're winning, but it kind of loses its luster after a loss.

But look, by Season 3, he had his system in place, his personnel in place, and we were rolling. Our defense was good and while Will was still crumpling on contact, he was getting the ball out faster and it was going to where it was supposed to go for the most part. We had a few runs sprinkled in. We looked like a program on its way to sustaining a yearly 6 to 9 win total. Plus, we were kind of fun to watch again. Suddenly, some hypothetical postgame soliloquy about Star Wars vs Star Trek wasn't so infuriating.

Maybe some other folks were still anti-Leach after season 3, but I think there are quite a few of us that reversed our opinion by the time he was gone. I think seeing how far down the program has gone since he's been gone has only improved memories of his tenure here.

ETA: I'm 100% in favor of a permanent shrine of some sort. I've heard others mention a Bulldog pirate logo flag at the top of the stadium and I think that would be kind of cool.

 

[RiceDawg]

I don't have a strong opinion about whether he deserves to be an official member of the ring of honor. If not, then having a black circle with the ML pirate helmet logo would be fine.

Something, somewhere. Even if it’s small.

 

[Car Ramrod.sixpack]

There is no doubt that we need some sort of memorial for coach Leach. It kinda ticks me off that we haven't done anything yet.

I would love to see a statue of him folding up the chairs on the sideline from the Auburn game.

 

[campshelbydog1116]

I have had this opinion for some time. We had a football coach that was an icon. Not just on the college level, an icon of football as a sport. I am disappointed that no where within or near the stadium is any sort of memorial or mention that he was ever here. No picture, flag, plaque, brick with his name on it. Regardless of how you feel about his tenure, that should change.

The fact that he doesn't have some sort of memorial is shameful.

 

[The Peeper]

I have had this opinion for some time. We had a football coach that was an icon. Not just on the college level, an icon of football as a sport. I am disappointed that no where within or near the stadium is any sort of memorial or mention that he was ever here. No picture, flag, plaque, brick with his name on it. Regardless of how you feel about his tenure, that should change.

This horse was thoroughly beaten recently:

Previous Mike Leach Memorial Thread

 

[OG Goat Holder]

I feel like he turned a lot of people around with that final season. I know he did with me.

When he was first announced, I thought his offense was going to have a hard time in the SEC and, outside the LSU game, for that first season, I was right. Plus, the games were not fun to watch and we went from a decade of hard running QBs to guys that crumpled on contact or ran in the wrong direction under pressure. So, I mean... I feel like there were some justified concerns in season 1.

Then, we had season 2, and we need a miraculous comeback to beat LaTech at home and we lost to Memphis (yes, we got screwed on the punt return, but it shouldn't have been close enough to matter) and it didn't help that he was 0-2 vs Ole Miss. Then, there were the post game interviews and press conferences about Halloween candy and other nonsense. That's all well and fine when you're winning, but it kind of loses its luster after a loss.

But look, by Season 3, he had his system in place, his personnel in place, and we were rolling. Our defense was good and while Will was still crumpling on contact, he was getting the ball out faster and it was going to where it was supposed to go for the most part. We had a few runs sprinkled in. We looked like a program on its way to sustaining a yearly 6 to 9 win total. Plus, we were kind of fun to watch again. Suddenly, some hypothetical postgame soliloquy about Star Wars vs Star Trek wasn't so infuriating.

Maybe some other folks were still anti-Leach after season 3, but I think there are quite a few of us that reversed our opinion by the time he was gone. I think seeing how far down the program has gone since he's been gone has only improved memories of his tenure here.

ETA: I'm 100% in favor of a permanent shrine of some sort. I've heard others mention a Bulldog pirate logo flag at the top of the stadium and I think that would be kind of cool.

So this is my question regarding that.

We are told to support Lebby, give him time, etc. We are told to suppress what we see out there, and our thoughts regarding hiring new coaches, lack of a plan, etc. Just.......come to games and mostly, give money. And for the most part, regardless of this terrible season, many fans still seem to be on board, despite no evidence or track record that this situation will be turned around anytime soon.

Let's use that analogy for Leach. He HAD the proof, the track record. At two schools just like us. And yet, so many fans (like you said above) picked apart his entire program, from the outset. Yes, at times some things didn't go right, but you had reasonable evidence that they eventually would. At the same time, nothing has went right for Lebby, yet his supporters are seemingly die-hard.

I truly don't understand that. I get your point, I understand the frustrations you and others had. What I don't get is how you didn't see the long game. I mean, if we can't get behind a guy like that on day one and unconditionally support, why should we do it for others? It's like we want the coach to come in and get us into our feels. Lebby did that, as did Mullen. But Mullen had the benefit of following a decade of terribleness, plus we looked like a competent team immediately, even if the wins weren't there.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

Heck man, a sizable portion of our fanbase message boards didn't like him. We didn't deserve him, honestly.

I feel bad for him and his legacy, and he probably should not have come to MSU.

FIFY

I would say in general the average State fan liked him.

 

[Dawgg]

So this is my question regarding that.

We are told to support Lebby, give him time, etc. We are told to suppress what we see out there, and our thoughts regarding hiring new coaches, lack of a plan, etc. Just.......come to games and mostly, give money. And for the most part, regardless of this terrible season, many fans still seem to be on board, despite no evidence or track record that this situation will be turned around anytime soon.

Let's use that analogy for Leach. He HAD the proof, the track record. At two schools just like us. And yet, so many fans (like you said above) picked apart his entire program, from the outset. Yes, at times some things didn't go right, but you had reasonable evidence that they eventually would. At the same time, nothing has went right for Lebby, yet his supporters are seemingly die-hard.

I truly don't understand that. I get your point, I understand the frustrations you and others had. What I don't get is how you didn't see the long game. I mean, if we can't get behind a guy like that on day one and unconditionally support, why should we do it for others? It's like we want the coach to come in and get us into our feels. Lebby did that, as did Mullen. But Mullen had the benefit of following a decade of terribleness, plus we looked like a competent team immediately, even if the wins weren't there.

Re: Long game

For me, it was the difference in being in the Big 12/Pac 12 vs being in the SEC. During Leach's era at Texas Tech, the defenses in the Big 12 were so bad that you could get a collection of 11 Sixpackers and we would have had a non-zero chance of scoring in that league. The Pac-12 defenses weren't much better. For my lifetime up until very recently, the SEC, Big Ten, and, to a lesser extent, the ACC were leagues that were still very much defense first while the Big 12 and Pac-12 were all offense all the time. If you go back and watch some of the Big 12 and Pac-12 games during those eras, they don't even tackle half the time, they just kind of run receivers out of bounds after a catch.

He was coming into a league with Alabama and LSU where almost their entire starting defenses were ending up in the NFL. I thought that just because throwing the ball a 50 times in a game worked out west didn't mean it would ever work in the SEC. That's it and I'll readily admit that I was wrong. He made it work by year 3.

Re: Buy in for Lebby and Mullen

Mullen had the benefit of following a terrible Croom tenure PLUS his offense had just won an SEC Championship, a national championship, and produced a Heisman winning quarterback. We looked pretty good that first season, came within an eyelash of beating LSU, and beat a pretty good Ole Miss team. Plus, he started talking trash about Ole Miss, which endeared him to a lot of folks.

The biggest problem with Lebby in my opinion is Hutzler. Lebby's offense looks good in flashes and you can kind of see the light at the end of the tunnel, but Hutzler's defense makes the whole product bad. It's like having an ice cream cone with one scoop of ice cream and one scoop of dog crap. It just makes the whole thing dog crap.

 

[85Bears]

Re: Long game

For me, it was the difference in being in the Big 12/Pac 12 vs being in the SEC. During Leach's era at Texas Tech, the defenses in the Big 12 were so bad that you could get a collection of 11 Sixpackers and we would have had a non-zero chance of scoring in that league. The Pac-12 defenses weren't much better. For my lifetime up until very recently, the SEC, Big Ten, and, to a lesser extent, the ACC were leagues that were still very much defense first while the Big 12 and Pac-12 were all offense all the time. If you go back and watch some of the Big 12 and Pac-12 games during those eras, they don't even tackle half the time, they just kind of run receivers out of bounds after a catch.

He was coming into a league with Alabama and LSU where almost their entire starting defenses were ending up in the NFL. I thought that just because throwing the ball a 50 times in a game worked out west didn't mean it would ever work in the SEC. That's it and I'll readily admit that I was wrong. He made it work by year 3.

Re: Buy in for Lebby and Mullen

Mullen had the benefit of following a terrible Croom tenure PLUS his offense had just won an SEC Championship, a national championship, and produced a Heisman winning quarterback. We looked pretty good that first season, came within an eyelash of beating LSU, and beat a pretty good Ole Miss team. Plus, he started talking trash about Ole Miss, which endeared him to a lot of folks.

The biggest problem with Lebby in my opinion is Hutzler. Lebby's offense looks good in flashes and you can kind of see the light at the end of the tunnel, but Hutzler's defense makes the whole product bad. It's like having an ice cream cone with one scoop of ice cream and one scoop of dog crap. It just makes the whole thing dog crap.

Yea he would never succeed here He pretty much sucked. I think he won nine games because of luck. I like these long winded backhanded compliments that justify all the crap dumped on him.

maybe for a more accurate measure lets see the next coach that wins 9 in their second/third full season. It will be more than a decade at least

 

[FlotownDawg]

Mike Leach would’ve had us a consistent 7-8 win team with an occasional 10-11 win team. Just like he did at Texas Tech and Washington State. He had a track record of success at schools with little history. It’s a shame, and typical MSU luck, that just at the peak of his tenure, a win over OM on the road and finishing with 9 wins (I credit him for the bowl victory), he tragically dies. He is greatly missed in college football and he absolutely needs something here to memorialize him. I’m not saying put him in the ring of honor, but he needs a plaque or something in the stadium at the very least.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Re: Long game

For me, it was the difference in being in the Big 12/Pac 12 vs being in the SEC. During Leach's era at Texas Tech, the defenses in the Big 12 were so bad that you could get a collection of 11 Sixpackers and we would have had a non-zero chance of scoring in that league. The Pac-12 defenses weren't much better. For my lifetime up until very recently, the SEC, Big Ten, and, to a lesser extent, the ACC were leagues that were still very much defense first while the Big 12 and Pac-12 were all offense all the time. If you go back and watch some of the Big 12 and Pac-12 games during those eras, they don't even tackle half the time, they just kind of run receivers out of bounds after a catch.

He was coming into a league with Alabama and LSU where almost their entire starting defenses were ending up in the NFL. I thought that just because throwing the ball a 50 times in a game worked out west didn't mean it would ever work in the SEC. That's it and I'll readily admit that I was wrong. He made it work by year 3.

Re: Buy in for Lebby and Mullen

Mullen had the benefit of following a terrible Croom tenure PLUS his offense had just won an SEC Championship, a national championship, and produced a Heisman winning quarterback. We looked pretty good that first season, came within an eyelash of beating LSU, and beat a pretty good Ole Miss team. Plus, he started talking trash about Ole Miss, which endeared him to a lot of folks.

The biggest problem with Lebby in my opinion is Hutzler. Lebby's offense looks good in flashes and you can kind of see the light at the end of the tunnel, but Hutzler's defense makes the whole product bad. It's like having an ice cream cone with one scoop of ice cream and one scoop of dog crap. It just makes the whole thing dog crap.

I guess. I figured at minimum, he’d have the same success here he had other places. Since his talent was likely increased from the other places. I thought it was pretty clear.

But I can’t say I see any optimism with Lebby. Being a HC is more than just calling plays on your preferred side of the ball.

 

[karlchilders.sixpack]

My view, give him a plaque in there of some type, just because, but statue, hell no.
JMO.

 

[Howiefeltersnstch]

Imo if you didn't like Mike as a person you have some serious personality issues. His style of football maybe. Everybody likes what they like. Personally we coulda been deadly and exciting with a more athletic QB doing some running. I think we should celebrate him but no statues or big pirate ships. We are Bulldogs. Not Pirates. THE Pirate was a character for sure and should be celebrated. Also I'm a fan of winning. If he stayed healthy I could see it getting even better. I'm not sure Lebby will hit 9 period.

 

[Wesson Bulldog]

Just fly a Jolly Roger on the South End Zone flag pole

 

[The Cooterpoot]

I have had this opinion for some time. We had a football coach that was an icon. Not just on the college level, an icon of football as a sport. I am disappointed that no where within or near the stadium is any sort of memorial or mention that he was ever here. No picture, flag, plaque, brick with his name on it. Regardless of how you feel about his tenure, that should change.

It's a big ole 17 NO! That mother 17er and his cohorts left this program in shambles. He had one good year and a losing record and killed this program in the process.

 

[campshelbydog1116]

It's a big ole 17 NO! That mother 17er and his cohorts left this program in shambles. He had one good year and a losing record and killed this program in the process.

He left a 9 win team that returned everyone. We put ourselves in shambles by hiring a moron that wanted to completely flip the offensive philosophy and hired the worst OC in modern history. This is an outrageous take.