What’s the brass tacks on recruiting budgets?

[BigDawg0074]

As a semi-casual fan who just buys tickets, concessions, and merch I have no idea what the shortfalls really are when it comes to NIL and recruiting budgets. I’ve seen people say that MSU is almost dead last in terms of dollars spent on recruiting by the athletic department. Is that true? Is there excess budget left over that could be spent to build those relationships? Does anyone have solid info on these figures or have a link to a resource I could research myself?

 

[Smoked Toag]

Oh, so you're curious now that Charlie ripped you a new one? Maybe you should ask questions BEFORE you act an *** next time?

 

[aTotal360]

The last numbers I saw (from 2019) indicated we are dead last in the SEC not counting Vandy.

https://www.on3.com/news/ranking-co...g-georgia-alabama-tennessee-clemson-arkansas/

Missouri and Sakerlina spend 2x what we do and are 10th and 11th.

 

[BigDawg0074]

Oh, so you're curious now that Charlie ripped you a new one? Maybe you should ask questions BEFORE you act an *** next time?

Ripped me a new one? Yeah I don’t think so. My post was no different than another popular post that shared similar sentiments. Go find some boots to lick. Nobody is willing to talk money except those with their hand out.

 

[BigDawg0074]

The last numbers I saw (from 2019) indicated we are dead last in the SEC not counting Vandy.

https://www.on3.com/news/ranking-co...g-georgia-alabama-tennessee-clemson-arkansas/

Missouri and Sakerlina spend 2x what we do and are 10th and 11th.

I haven’t found anything post-NIL.

 

[dawgnabit]

The last numbers I saw (from 2019) indicated we are dead last in the SEC not counting Vandy.

https://www.on3.com/news/ranking-co...g-georgia-alabama-tennessee-clemson-arkansas/

Missouri and Sakerlina spend 2x what we do and are 10th and 11th.

Dang…. Are we really that poor or do we just choose not to spend that much money?

 

[Cooterpoot]

Dang…. Are we really that poor or do we just choose not to spend that much money?

We screw over our football program by not putting more into recruiting and other things. We fail to prioritize the greatest money maker on campus because we "stay in our lane and settle for 6 wins".

 

[Seinfeld]

I think these recruiting financials are about as clear and consistent as a house cleaner’s 1040 that only accepts cash.

There is absolutely zero chance that an athletic department with a $120M budget is spending $450k in total on recruiting. They are probably reporting things like mileage, airline tickets, and hotel bills, but I guarantee that there are millions in booster money and other sources being spent as well.

 

[047Dog]

Dang…. Are we really that poor or do we just choose not to spend that much money?

We still clutch to those tight purse strings. There’s still a lot of LT mentality in our 55, 60, 70 year old fanbase that are resistant to change and want to continue being same ol MSU.

You see it continue to pop up in these forums with those who want to continue living in the 3 yards and a cloud of dust era, accept the SEC payout like a good little boy and not rock the boat. We are MSU and supposed to be quiet, do what Daddy SEC tells us to do and not upset the hierarchy.

 

[BigDawg0074]

I think these recruiting financials are about as clear and consistent as a house cleaner’s 1040 that only accepts cash.

There is absolutely zero chance that an athletic department with a $120M budget is spending $450k in total on recruiting. They are probably reporting things like mileage, airline tickets, and hotel bills, but I guarantee that there are millions in booster money and other sources being spent as well.

That’s probably true. I pretty much never see anyone around here quoting real figures about Mississippi State’s programs but there’s always talk of others. I find that curious and would like more info. Surely it is required by regulation to share that info somewhere in a public forum.

 

[aTotal360]

Amounts probably changed but I bet the rankings haven't.

 

[Cooterpoot]

If you look at recruiting budgets in general, the top 25 is most of the top 25 in budget. That's not a coincidence. Hell, Minnesota & Rutgers spend more than us.

 

[Maroonthirteen]

Both articles reference 2019
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/much-does-college-spend-recruiting-020000637.html


https://athleticdirectoru.com/articles/an-analysis-of-football-recruiting-costs/

There is this database. But I can't get exact recruiting numbers. Maybe y'all can.

https://knightnewhousedata.org/fbs/sec/mississippi-state-university

 

[Dawgbite]

Here is the problem as I see it. Mississippi is a poor state relative to the other states in the SEC and what wealth that is here is split primarily between the two SEC schools. Not to mention Southern Miss, three HBCU schools, Delta State, the W, Ms College, and a huge Junior College system relative to the population of the state. There is too many colleges dividing the meager resources of this state and its graduates. For many many years we ,State, we're content to be everyone's homecoming game. We sold our home games for gods sake. I think that Byrne finally righted the ship but we were 40-50 years behind the real players in college football. They had an established network that we have yet to duplicate. I don't care how much money we get from the SEC, the Bamas and LSU's of the world are getting the same check. We're not gaining one inch. NIL is just further separating us from the leaders. We can still compete in the pure sports like baseball, softball, soccer and possibly a few more. We may can even catch lightning in a bottle and make a run in mens basketball but competing for a championship in football is just a preseason dream. Big time college football is an expensive sport. We can afford to play but we can't afford to win.

 

[mcdawg22]

It seems we are talking about two different things. NIL in its intent is to allow current student athletes to benefit from their image without being penalized from the NCAA. As you all know when this was pushed through, the legality got blurred and it seems a year ago using the promise of NIL to a recruit was a no no but that idea seems to have flown out the window too.

I guess with these changes impermissible benefits to recruits somehow don’t apply anymore and that’s where these huge weekends come into play? Do we know whether the funds came from Texas or a Texas NIL. I think the official recruiting budget from the school would pay for these official visits not NIL. But I have no idea.

With regards to actual NIL money, it’s my understanding that the school can’t give money to them. We can talk about ESPN money all we want but the school can’t divert those funds to pay athletes. So getting mad at State for not subsidizing NIL seems a little misdirected.

I have an idea, when the SEC restructures their deal, earmark a percentage to a school’s partnered NIL initiative. ESPN makes millions off of these athletes image with advertising and subscriptions. Sure other schools will be way ahead of use with merchandise and private donations but that’s the way it has been for years. At least you will get your lower income teams a fighting chance against schools outside the conference.

As far as NiL and recruiting. Who knows? It’s the Wild West. I have a feeling when we start getting these sob stories of players that were promised all of the riches to go to A&M but are in transfer portal he’ll because they fell down the depth chart, we’ll get an article with Ed Obanon lamenting over the monster he created.

 

[Maroonthirteen]

Well I believe all this NIL talk got stirred up, again, when Rosebowl wanted to bust the fans chops for nil.

A good point was made. Mississippi State isn't even trying in recruiting itself. We banked 22 million last year yet we are next to last in recruiting expense. So MSU needs to pick up the pace as well in areas that it can. Because at the end of the day, a nil deal is one thing but more important is everything Involved in the recruiting process on campus.

 

[Smoked Toag]

Lot of talk, but no actual solutions. That's why I say again, like I said earlier:

"Which is why we must innovate and have a very clear plan. Whether it's the Air Raid, Triple Option, Malzahn, transfer portal, recruiting strategy, whatever.

Then people throw out stuff like "Mullen's/Riley's/Kiffin's offense"....those guys don't have an 'offense'. They aren't system coaches. They have offensive backgrounds and are good at organizing. And they all have recruiting strategies. So dropping Lincoln Riley at MSU won't suddenly make our offense awesome. Competent, sure, as Mullen did this coming off the Croom years. But we have to find a way to get players. It seems to me that recruiting to a system, from a base camp of MS underdeveloped players, would be the best way to do this. Because it won't be NIL.

I personally think we should spend our limited NIL monies on defensive linemen (and defense in general) because that's what we're known for and that's where MS produces the most high-level players. The rest has to be innovated."

Let the ones who want to donate to NIL, donate. The ones who don't, don't. Rosebowl needs to stop with the shaming. There are plenty of us, like me, who buy tickets, wear gear, and show up to games. That IS something, and Rosey tried to act like it wasn't, and that's wrong. But I'm within the 3-4 hour window of geography who CAN go to all the games. If anything, you out-of-state guys could pick up the slack with NIL if you wanted to help (if you want to).

 

[Maroon Eagle]

We still clutch to those tight purse strings. There’s still a lot of LT mentality in our 55, 60, 70 year old fanbase that are resistant to change and want to continue being same ol MSU.

As a 55 year old, it’s not that we’re resistant to change.

(I like change!)

But we’re in money saving, getting ready for retirement mode.

Show us the Return on Investment.

Where IS the Return on Investment?

 

[Mr. Cook]

Win some games and maybe you can complete for my entertainment dollar. I don't have "mama" and "daddy" to rely on for money and a roof over my head

 

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Last in SEC excluding Vanderbilt, around 50th in NCAA.

 

[Cooterpoot]

As a 55 year old, it’s not that we’re resistant to change.

(I like change!)

But we’re in money saving, getting ready for retirement mode.

Show us the Return on Investment.

Where IS the Return on Investment?

And you've got to spend money to make money.

 

[Cooterpoot]

Here is the problem as I see it. Mississippi is a poor state relative to the other states in the SEC and what wealth that is here is split primarily between the two SEC schools. Not to mention Southern Miss, three HBCU schools, Delta State, the W, Ms College, and a huge Junior College system relative to the population of the state. There is too many colleges dividing the meager resources of this state and its graduates. For many many years we ,State, we're content to be everyone's homecoming game. We sold our home games for gods sake. I think that Byrne finally righted the ship but we were 40-50 years behind the real players in college football. They had an established network that we have yet to duplicate. I don't care how much money we get from the SEC, the Bamas and LSU's of the world are getting the same check. We're not gaining one inch. NIL is just further separating us from the leaders. We can still compete in the pure sports like baseball, softball, soccer and possibly a few more. We may can even catch lightning in a bottle and make a run in mens basketball but competing for a championship in football is just a preseason dream. Big time college football is an expensive sport. We can afford to play but we can't afford to win.

We bank over $15MM a year. It would take less than $1MM of that to get us up to speed with the top 25.

 

[Mr. Cook]

Here is the problem as I see it. Mississippi is a poor state relative to the other states in the SEC and what wealth that is here is split primarily between the two SEC schools. Not to mention Southern Miss, three HBCU schools, Delta State, the W, Ms College, and a huge Junior College system relative to the population of the state. There is too many colleges dividing the meager resources of this state and its graduates. For many many years we ,State, we're content to be everyone's homecoming game. We sold our home games for gods sake. I think that Byrne finally righted the ship but we were 40-50 years behind the real players in college football. They had an established network that we have yet to duplicate. I don't care how much money we get from the SEC, the Bamas and LSU's of the world are getting the same check. We're not gaining one inch. NIL is just further separating us from the leaders. We can still compete in the pure sports like baseball, softball, soccer and possibly a few more. We may can even catch lightning in a bottle and make a run in mens basketball but competing for a championship in football is just a preseason dream. Big time college football is an expensive sport. We can afford to play but we can't afford to win.

This sounds eerily comparable to the condition of higher education in the State of Mississippi in general

 

[Maroon Eagle]

So long as we don’t siphon away any TANF money we’re good. **

 

[Dawgbite]

We bank over $15MM a year. It would take less than $1MM of that to get us up to speed with the top 25.

Just because you won a bundle at the casino and buy a house on a lake in a gated community, doesn't mean you belong there. Your still going to be an outcast and never be accepted as one of " them". You've got to earn the right to be a pretty person, you can't just buy it.

 

[BigDawg0074]

Well I believe all this NIL talk got stirred up, again, when Rosebowl wanted to bust the fans chops for nil.

A good point was made. Mississippi State isn't even trying in recruiting itself. We banked 22 million last year yet we are next to last in recruiting expense. So MSU needs to pick up the pace as well in areas that it can. Because at the end of the day, a nil deal is one thing but more important is everything Involved in the recruiting process on campus.

This is what I’m talking about. How much is the AD investing in the program before running and asking for more? It looks like bare minimum to me. The BI is basically a talent scouting agency designed to provide faces for ads. That’s fine, it’s what NIL is about but make no mistake that it is quid pro quo. I’m more interested to see if corners are being cut by the athletic department and potential lack of resources being provided to the football program.

 

[MSUDawg25]

Serious question, what does a recruiting budget actually get spent on? It’s not like it all goes to travel and board for recruiting trips. So what are other teams spending that money on? Parties, parades, and whores? I’m just having a hard time seeing a situation where more recruiting money automatically equals better recruits. Because we could definitely afford to triple or quadruple that budget if that would push us into the top 15 consistently in the rankings.

 

[bruiser.sixpack]

Serious question, what does a recruiting budget actually get spent on? It’s not like it all goes to travel and board for recruiting trips. So what are other teams spending that money on? Parties, parades, and whores? I’m just having a hard time seeing a situation where more recruiting money automatically equals better recruits. Because we could definitely afford to triple or quadruple that budget if that would push us into the top 15 consistently in the rankings.

Maybe some of it needs to be spent on getting a Target in Starkville. That ought to bring in the Top Recruits!

 

[BigDawg0074]

Serious question, what does a recruiting budget actually get spent on? It’s not like it all goes to travel and board for recruiting trips. So what are other teams spending that money on? Parties, parades, and whores? I’m just having a hard time seeing a situation where more recruiting money automatically equals better recruits. Because we could definitely afford to triple or quadruple that budget if that would push us into the top 15 consistently in the rankings.

I think it’s also important to ask if some of the budget could be spent on additional and/or higher quality staff too. Of coarse the coach has to be on board with the personnel selections but I doubt CML would balk at additional support.
My point in all this is that before we as a fan base start debating the head coach and system we should verify that the AD is adequately supporting the program based upon the overall earnings each year. Virtually none of us will be fully aware of the dollars being spent but we should consider all publicly available information. Given the figures I have seen, this staff is achieving quite a lot considering the relatively skimpy budget they appear to be working with.

 

[Maroonthirteen]

Serious question, what does a recruiting budget actually get spent on? It’s not like it all goes to travel and board for recruiting trips. So what are other teams spending that money on? Parties, parades, and whores? I’m just having a hard time seeing a situation where more recruiting money automatically equals better recruits. Because we could definitely afford to triple or quadruple that budget if that would push us into the top 15 consistently in the rankings.

Only excuse I've heard regarding our recruiting budget is that our travel cost are low. Because there is so much talent in the SE US. Ok. However, you better expand that recruiting net to all of the US if all your SE US commits are 3*.

 

[dannyripms]

Every one on this board can give $100 a month. We waste that much money. If we can get 50k to give just $100 a month, that would make a world of difference in recruiting. we could take care of football and baseball with that amount. That's 60 million a year. We would have a hell of a recruiting class in football and baseball. I mean we have to until the rules change.

 

[dannyripms]

and you don't have to own a business to give. I give $150 a month, 100 to bulldog initiative and 50 to the ones the team put out a month ago.

 

[dorndawg]

Every one on this board can give $100 a month. We waste that much money. If we can get 50k to give just $100 a month, that would make a world of difference in recruiting. we could take care of football and baseball with that amount. That's 60 million a year. We would have a hell of a recruiting class in football and baseball. I mean we have to until the rules change.

Ok fellas the blueprint is laid out. All we gotta do is get 1/3 of our worldwide living alumni to commit to hand over $1200. This will EASILY have us competing for 3rd in the SEC west most years.

 

[Mr. Cook]

We could use an upgraded volleyball arena. I read where other schools are getting state funding for this

 

[Mr. Cook]

Paying Target to have a presence in Starkville will be the only way Starkville will get a Target there. It's the only way Target will be proitable there.

It should be noted that the presence of a Target in the town of of the university's location was ranked 4th most important in a recent recruiting survey

 

[dannyripms]

Ok fellas the blueprint is laid out. All we gotta do is get 1/3 of our worldwide living alumni to commit to hand over $1200. This will EASILY have us competing for 3rd in the SEC west most years.

Quit crying about recruiting then. That's the only way to get us in the top of sec. We don't have the big donors like most schools. This needs to be a lot of people giving a small amount. And yes i see no reason everyone can give $100 a month. That's a very small amount. Of course i wish it wasn't that way, the NCAA needs their A@@ whipped for not taking control. We need a salary cap for each team or something like that. I was all for paying kids something like $500/wk but kids are getting millions before throwing the first pass. So unfortunately we are in this situation and we need to do what we can to keep us near the top. The bulldog Initiative needs to get out there more as there are a lot of people who have no idea who they are or how to donate. No sense in being negative to people trying to find a solution, we all need to come up with ideas to get it done.

 

[Go Budaw]

Quit crying about recruiting then. That's the only way to get us in the top of sec. We don't have the big donors like most schools. This needs to be a lot of people giving a small amount. And yes i see no reason everyone can give $100 a month. That's a very small amount. Of course i wish it wasn't that way, the NCAA needs their A@@ whipped for not taking control. We need a salary cap for each team or something like that. I was all for paying kids something like $500/wk but kids are getting millions before throwing the first pass. So unfortunately we are in this situation and we need to do what we can to keep us near the top. The bulldog Initiative needs to get out there more as there are a lot of people who have no idea who they are or how to donate. No sense in being negative to people trying to find a solution, we all need to come up with ideas to get it done.

You and others are missing the bigger picture…..ordinary fans who became enamored with the emotional connection of college football don’t want to win that way. If college football has simply been reduced to a giant fundraising competition, what’s the 17ing point? It used to be at least somewhat about rooting on your peers, fellow students, those who chose YOUR school / city / region to showcase their talents. Its now just a giant bidding war. In the overwhelming majority of cases, these athletes don’t care about MSU, Starkville, or school in general. It’s just a means to an end.

If my annual income was $100 billion per year, you know how much of that I’d donate to NIL? Zero. And the reasons above are why.

 

[Smoked Toag]

You and others are missing the bigger picture…..ordinary fans who became enamored with the emotional connection of college football don’t want to win that way. If college football has simply been reduced to a giant fundraising competition, what’s the 17ing point? It used to be at least somewhat about rooting on your peers, fellow students, those who chose YOUR school / city / region to showcase their talents. Its now just a giant bidding war. In the overwhelming majority of cases, these athletes don’t care about MSU, Starkville, or school in general. It’s just a means to an end.

If my annual income was $100 billion per year, you know how much of that I’d donate to NIL? Zero. And the reasons above are why.

You laid it out fairly perfectly here. Funny thing that I've learned over the years, is that there are a ton of these 'TV' fans, that had a tie to a team and became a fan, but they didn't have the same attendance/tailgating/hands-on/etc. experience that maybe I, or many of you others, had growing up. So they don't quite understand the viewpoint you just laid out, all they see is that the schools are big and on TV, so 'they' need to do things better. In general, this group is the pro-player pay group, and constantly want better and better games, because it's essentially just entertainment to them. They don't mind all this money flying around.

 

[thatsbaseball]

I'm glad you wrote this and I'm right there with you...great post

 

[dorndawg]

Quit crying about recruiting then. That's the only way to get us in the top of sec. We don't have the big donors like most schools. This needs to be a lot of people giving a small amount. And yes i see no reason everyone can give $100 a month. That's a very small amount. Of course i wish it wasn't that way, the NCAA needs their A@@ whipped for not taking control. We need a salary cap for each team or something like that. I was all for paying kids something like $500/wk but kids are getting millions before throwing the first pass. So unfortunately we are in this situation and we need to do what we can to keep us near the top. The bulldog Initiative needs to get out there more as there are a lot of people who have no idea who they are or how to donate. No sense in being negative to people trying to find a solution, we all need to come up with ideas to get it done.

Why not shoot for 100,000 alumni giving 1000 a month? Gotta get over this small minded thinking