When Six Pack changes your political stance

[615dawg]

Every fiber of my conservative being supports school choice. Every student in Mississippi deserves a chance at a good education.

But reading that Collierville thread - school choice in MS would not be used to better education, it would be used to win football games. Disgusting. Just like someone said - college football is basically mercenaries at this point, high schools are quickly going that route.

 

[Lucifer Morningstar]

In b 4 lock. This should end well.

 

[615dawg]

In b 4 lock. This should end well.

Why. It's a follow up on a sports topic. We can have an adult conversation.

We are ruining college and high school sports. Missouri passed NIL for HIGH SCHOOL kids. Some running back is demanding $25k to play high school football.

 

[Darryl Steight]

Why. It's a follow up on a sports topic. We can have an adult conversation.

We are ruining college and high school sports. Missouri passed NIL for HIGH SCHOOL kids. Some running back is demanding $25k to play high school football.

I like the thread title because I believe in the power of the Pack. We can make a difference on here. If Bill Maher can see glimpses of the light, I am still holding out hope for dorndawg.**

 

[GloryDawg]

I like the thread title because I believe in the power of the Pack. We can make a difference on here. If Bill Maher can see glimpses of the light, I am still holding out hope for dorndawg.**

I may not agree with dorndawg on most political stuff, but I think I could sit down shoot the **** about other things and drink a root beer with him.

 

[HuntDawg]

How exactly are we ruining high school sports?

 

[NWADawg]

Got family that works at our local school admin office and I can say that 99% of school transfer requests have more to do with education and location (town is located on the way to =>closer to the big towns where many work). We have benefitted from a few future D1 transfers but they were from other parts of the state and moved the entire family into our school district to be close to UPig and get exposure.

 

[dorndawg]

I may not agree with dorndawg on most political stuff, but I think I could sit down shoot the **** about other things and drink a root beer with him.

My NIL fee is 2 Barq's Root Beers in the glass bottle, iced down in a Yeti cooler.

 

[HuntDawg]

Got family that works at our local school admin office and I can say that 99% of school transfer requests have more to do with education and location (town is located on the way to =>closer to the big towns where many work). We have benefitted from a few future D1 transfers but they were from other parts of the state and moved the entire family into our school district to be close to UPig and get exposure.

this exactly.

There are many more kids in the "wrong" schools right now due to education and other factors than are in the "wrong" schools to play a sport.

 

[615dawg]

How exactly are we ruining high school sports?

I don't know where you live, but high school sports in a lot of areas are more cut throat than they should be. The kid from Tupelo being turned in by Pearl for running in a sport that Mississippi doesn't even have, thus disqualifying him. The Jackson area private schools are basically recruiting the best talent. Coaches are being made principals and even superintendents with zero education administration skills, etc.

 

[HuntDawg]

I don't know where you live, but high school sports in a lot of areas are more cut throat than they should be. The kid from Tupelo being turned in by Pearl for running in a sport that Mississippi doesn't even have, thus disqualifying him. The Jackson area private schools are basically recruiting the best talent. Coaches are being made principals and even superintendents with zero education administration skills, etc.

Disagree.

Kid from tupelo broke the rules and was turned in. This has been happening for years. Schools want to win and turn others schools in that dont follow the rules. Jackson Private schools and other private schools have been recruiting talent for years.

Coaches cant be made principals of schools without an ADMIN license, which a lot more than you think have.

Private school play by their own rules always have.

But not seeing how any of that is ruining sports. Its been happening for years.

 

[dorndawg]

I like the thread title because I believe in the power of the Pack. We can make a difference on here. If Bill Maher can see glimpses of the light, I am still holding out hope for dorndawg.**

 

[TaleofTwoDogs]

Another "sky is falling" thread. If somebody is stupid enough to pay a kid $25K to play HS ball then society has more ills than HS sports.

 

[dawgstudent]

Disagree.

Kid from tupelo broke the rules and was turned in. This has been happening for years. Schools want to win and turn others schools in that dont follow the rules. Jackson Private schools and other private schools have been recruiting talent for years.

Coaches cant be made principals of schools without an ADMIN license, which a lot more than you think have.

Private school play by their own rules always have.

But not seeing how any of that is ruining sports. Its been happening for years.

My only comment is the kid from Tupelo. It's a stupid rule and he should not have been in trouble.

 

[GloryDawg]

My NIL fee is 2 Barq's Root Beers in the glass bottle, iced down in a Yeti cooler.

What no Moon pie?

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

What no Moon pie?

Needs an RC Cola

 

[HuntDawg]

My only comment is the kid from Tupelo. It's a stupid rule and he should not have been in trouble.

I wont disagree with that. However a rule is a rule. The rule was broken. Doesnt mean athletics was cut throat or all of a sudden has gone rouge.

Id actually argue the opposite of cut throat happened in that circumstance. The school, player, and admin were all warned prior to the event. In the past or maybe even today, those people wouldnt have been notified until afteward and then got slapped with the penality.

 

[GloryDawg]

Needs an RC Cola

and chase it with a Dr. Pepper with peanuts in the bottle.

 

[dawgstudent]

I wont disagree with that. However a rule is a rule. The rule was broken. Doesnt mean athletics was cut throat or all of a sudden has gone rouge.

Id actually argue the opposite of cut throat happened in that circumstance. The school, player, and admin were all warned prior to the event. In the past or maybe even today, those people wouldnt have been notified until afteward and then got slapped with the penality.

That I didn't know. He was told before he left he would get penalized and still went? Regardless of how ignorant the rule is, then that's on the parents of the child.

 

[dorndawg]

What no Moon pie?

Only if it's been microwaved a few seconds.

 

[pseudonym]

this exactly.

There are many more kids in the "wrong" schools right now due to education and other factors than are in the "wrong" schools to play a sport.

School choice affects a lot more people than high school sports. By definition, the majority of students aren't athletic enough to play varsity high school sports, much less change schools for sports.

But I don't doubt that opponents of school choice will make bad-faith arguments of why school choice would lead to chaos in sports, and that's why poor families have to keep sending their kids to failing schools.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

and chase it with a Dr. Pepper with peanuts in the bottle.

Bleh. That’s just something that I have never been able to stomach.

 

[HuntDawg]

That I didn't know. He was told before he left he would get penalized and still went? Regardless of how ignorant the rule is, then that's on the parents of the child.

Yes. A school reported to the MHSAA, the MHSAA alerted the school, coach and admin of tupelo. That if said player went and participated in the event, that he would be deemed ineligible to compete the rest of the season for the team.

Player decided to go anyway... and Tupelo High School self reported the incident... Player was ruled ineligble for rest of the season as told before he participated.

Tupelo admin or any school official at all for that matter-- has said anything negative about the ruling or process--- the parents of the kid caused a stink over it

 

[HuntDawg]

School choice affects a lot more people than high school sports. By definition, the majority of students aren't athletic enough to play varsity high school sports, much less change schools for sports.

But I don't doubt that opponents of school choice will make bad-faith arguments of why school choice would lead to chaos in sports, and that's why poor families have to keep sending their kids to failing schools.

Im not here to join a discussion about school choice and whats best in that regard.

But saying that high school athletics has gone off the rocker or is ruining high school education is just plain silly

 

[patdog]

My only comment is the kid from Tupelo. It's a stupid rule and he should not have been in trouble.

Agree. A rule that takes away opportunities from kids is a bad rule. I know you have to enforce rules, but this is one case where an exception should have been made while the rule was changed.

 

[Villagedawg]

Every student in Mississippi deserves a chance at a good education.

By all means agree. Now for the love of all that's good and decent, let's give it to them! All of them.

 

[The Peeper]

My NIL fee is 2 Barq's Root Beers in the glass bottle, iced down in a Yeti cooler.

You should demand a bag of Tom's Peanuts too

 

[bolddogge]

I like the thread title because I believe in the power of the Pack. We can make a difference on here. If Bill Maher can see glimpses of the light, I am still holding out hope for dorndawg.**

Mr. Morningstar would have a better chance of changing his line of work that that.

 

[kired]

Yes. A school reported to the MHSAA, the MHSAA alerted the school, coach and admin of tupelo. That if said player went and participated in the event, that he would be deemed ineligible to compete the rest of the season for the team.

Player decided to go anyway... and Tupelo High School self reported the incident... Player was ruled ineligble for rest of the season as told before he participated.

Tupelo admin or any school official at all for that matter-- has said anything negative about the ruling or process--- the parents of the kid caused a stink over it

That's kind of what happened, but not complete details. They were informed the day before flying to Boston he would be suspended for 1 full year (not just the 2024 track season) for competing in an indoor event after outdoor season had started, even though Mississippi has no indoor season. What's funny is MSHAA uploaded a new sports calendar in March with "indoor track" added at the bottom. The URL literally shows 2024/03 date even though the form says updated 7/31/2023. They added that specifically in response to this trying to justify their decision.

New Calender from March
https://www.misshsaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/2023-24-Sports-Calendar11.pdf

Original Calendar
https://www.misshsaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/2023-24-Sports-Calendar8.pdf

Suspension would include spring track and cross country in the fall. Tupelo would at a minimum be put on probation for allowing him to compete. So Tupelo removed him from the track roster and he ran unattached. Technically the school broke no rules, nothing to report. Brown was ineligible to join the track team this spring because he broke the rule prohibiting him from competing unattached.


The superintendent did say he believes the rules should be amended. School officials can't really come out and say anything negative if they don't want the school to get reprimanded.
https://www.djournal.com/sports/hig...cle_ae4df620-f67e-11ee-8bf6-8bc2fec48199.html

“Then I started learning more about it and hearing about it, and I said, something is wrong here, something bigger than just a kid broke a rule,” he said.
Picou believes the rules Brown was accused of violating should be amended to accommodate athletes with talent as prodigious as Brown’s.
“What I’ve learned is, individual sport competition on a national level has changed dramatically. So are these rules keeping up with the changes in national competition? … I personally believe that there needs to be contextual efforts to accommodate these national-type athletes. It’s not just in track, it’s in golf, every sport we have these athletes that are special. And I feel like they should accommodate their efforts to get national recognition.”

 

[dudehead]

Another "sky is falling" thread. If somebody is stupid enough to pay a kid $25K to play HS ball then society has more ills than HS sports.

Ain't that the damn truth. But I've about had all I want of college football and how much money we pour into that form of cultural bread and circus.

 

[HuntDawg]

That's kind of what happened, but not complete details. They were informed the day before flying to Boston he would be suspended for 1 full year (not just the 2024 track season) for competing in an indoor event after outdoor season had started, even though Mississippi has no indoor season. What's funny is MSHAA uploaded a new sports calendar in March with "indoor track" added at the bottom. The URL literally shows 2024/03 date even though the form says updated 7/31/2023. They added that specifically in response to this trying to justify their decision.

New Calender from March
https://www.misshsaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/2023-24-Sports-Calendar11.pdf

Original Calendar
https://www.misshsaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/07/2023-24-Sports-Calendar8.pdf

Suspension would include spring track and cross country in the fall. Tupelo would at a minimum be put on probation for allowing him to compete. So Tupelo removed him from the track roster and he ran unattached. Technically the school broke no rules, nothing to report. Brown was ineligible to join the track team this spring because he broke the rule prohibiting him from competing unattached.


The superintendent did say he believes the rules should be amended. School officials can't really come out and say anything negative if they don't want the school to get reprimanded.
https://www.djournal.com/sports/hig...cle_ae4df620-f67e-11ee-8bf6-8bc2fec48199.html

“Then I started learning more about it and hearing about it, and I said, something is wrong here, something bigger than just a kid broke a rule,” he said.
Picou believes the rules Brown was accused of violating should be amended to accommodate athletes with talent as prodigious as Brown’s.
“What I’ve learned is, individual sport competition on a national level has changed dramatically. So are these rules keeping up with the changes in national competition? … I personally believe that there needs to be contextual efforts to accommodate these national-type athletes. It’s not just in track, it’s in golf, every sport we have these athletes that are special. And I feel like they should accommodate their efforts to get national recognition.”

Right. thanks for clearing up the details.

End of day: They knew the rules. They decided to break the rules. They got a penality for breaking the rules.

Regardless if we believe the rules to be right or not.. they are the rules... and we have to follow them. And everyone involved in my understanding, from the MHSAA, the reporting school, Tupelo, Tupelo School Admin, Parent, Student-Athlete-- knew exactly what would happen prior to going.... To me thats a job well done... kid/family made his decision. Live with the consequences.

Its not a cut throat situation like mentioned at the start. Had it been cut-throat-- none of the above would have happened.

If the Tupelo superintendant feels that way. He for sure as a voice in the equation to change it. As stated many times before. The MHSAA doesnt make the rules. They enforce the rules voted on by its members. Tupelo knows the process to get a rule changed, hopefully the superitendant has begun that process

 

[johnson86-1]

I wont disagree with that. However a rule is a rule. The rule was broken. Doesnt mean athletics was cut throat or all of a sudden has gone rouge.

Id actually argue the opposite of cut throat happened in that circumstance. The school, player, and admin were all warned prior to the event. In the past or maybe even today, those people wouldnt have been notified until afteward and then got slapped with the penality.

What is the rule that was broken? The quote that keeps getting passed around as the rule being broken doesn't appear to apply on its face. Unless the quote is wrong they are going out of their way to declare him ineligible when they don't have too.

ETA:

6.2.3 A student who is a member of a MHSAA school team shall not participate in any manner in any event in a meet or a contest as an unattached contestant against a high school team, a junior high school team, a collegiate team, a club team or other unattached individuals in that same sport. One individual shall constitute a team in indoor and outdoor track and field. https://www.misshsaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/2020-21-MHSAA-Handbook.pdf

The rule doesn't say that indoor and outdoor track and field are considered one in the same.
Rule 6.2.4.3 also treats them as separate. "Participation in a road run as an individual and not as a school representative during the indoor and/or outdoor track season." Section 7.10 treats them as separate by adopting the NFHS Track and Field Rules for both boys and girls, and indoor and outdoor. Unless he was part of Tupelo's indoor track and field team, which my understanding is they don't have, he didn't break the rule unless there is something incorporated into the rule book that specifies that they are the same thing. You would think there would be something somewhere that they can point to that he violated as presumably the parents would have raised hell, but it's odd to me that nobody is reporting on what rule he actually broke.

 

[Lucifer Morningstar]

Why. It's a follow up on a sports topic. We can have an adult conversation.

We are ruining college and high school sports. Missouri passed NIL for HIGH SCHOOL kids. Some running back is demanding $25k to play high school football.

No offense but don't be dense. We all know where anything political goes on this board and there is rarely a political conversation that ends well. Hopefully I am wrong, but I doubt it.

 

[johnson86-1]

That I didn't know. He was told before he left he would get penalized and still went? Regardless of how ignorant the rule is, then that's on the parents of the child.

They were going to have to eat the plane tickets, hotel, and entry fee. I can see deciding it's more important to run against good competition and not waste the money and then hope sanity prevails or just wait until the next year.

 

[HuntDawg]

What is the rule that was broken? The quote that keeps getting passed around as the rule being broken doesn't appear to apply on its face. Unless the quote is wrong they are going out of their way to declare him ineligible when they don't have too.

There is an entire thread about it with many details from when this news actually broke. Even the parents of the family admitted a rule was broken.. but everyone says/agrees its a stupid rule (which i dont disagree with)

 

[Dawgbite]

Bleh. That’s just something that I have never been able to stomach.

 

[Pink Floyd.sixpack]

Look across Mississippi. County districts are successful and the city districts are failing. Anyone worried about their kids education are leaving these city districts due to this and have been for 20 years now. I live in a county where the city district is on the bottom 20 in the state. County district is in the top 10. Closest “academy” is 32 miles away. You can’t give property in the city away at the moment. Athletics aside…..we need to be worried about educating ALL kids and set all the other BS aside. The athletics will sort itself out. But here in Mississippi we will continue doing what we do because we have such a love affair with being 50th in everything. Go to the MDE and website and spend a little time doing some research. It’s eye opening.

 

[johnson86-1]

There is an entire thread about it with many details from when this news actually broke. Even the parents of the family admitted a rule was broken.. but everyone says/agrees its a stupid rule (which i dont disagree with)

Why has nobody provided the text of the rule broken? And if they are claiming 6.2.3 was broken, why can't they point to any provision stating that indoor track and outdoor track and field are to be treated as a single sport?

 

[Maroon13]

Back to the school choice bill.....

My kid will be out of school by 2029, so I haven't paid much attention.

However if I understand this right, each kid will get $8,000 -$10,00 of appropriated funds from the state out of the general fund, to pay for their attendance at the school of their choice. Is this generally the idea?

So the state Gov is going to create another expenses to pay for thousands of kids to go wherever they want?

Are the counties going to credit their citizens property tax if they go to school in another county? Is the state to allow a credit on the income tax return for those that don't get the state grant but pay for a school of choice?

If Arkansas can make it work with similar demographics, financially speaking, I guess Mississippi can. But damn, that seems like a lot of red tape and opportunity for fraud or false intentions to attend another school.

I can tell you if school choice was a thing in desoto county, Lewisburg, Hernando and maybe Desoto central would have all the kids. OB, Southaven and Horn Lake would have big drops in enrollment.

 

[dorndawg]

By all means agree. Now for the love of all that's good and decent, let's give it to them! All of them.

We could even consider actually fully funding it.