Further CFP expansion already in the works

[18IsTheMan]

If not officially, it is unofficially. People are already putting out lists of teams that stand to get excluded while other teams with the same record get it. The gist is "If A, B and C are worthy why isn't X since they have the same record" and "How can you let A in and not B? And if you let B in, how can you keep C out?"

Of course, this was all predictable. Short of a 134-team playoff there is no size playoff that will satisfy everyone. Someone wil ALWAYS feel unjustly excluded.

 

[gamecock stock]

It's like the NCAA basketball Tournament. I think when I was in college, it was a 16 or maybe 32-team playoff. Of course, it's now 60+

Thus, I believe a 16-team CFB playoff system is inevitable in very short order.

We probably won't make the 12-team playoff this year. If we did, would we be respectable? Based on the past few performances, I think the answer is "Yes". If we win out (playing like we have in the past few games) and don't make the 12-team playoff, there are going to be those in our fan base griping about being shut out. Should selection be based on the total season or how a team finishes the later half of the season? I can see validity on both sides of that argument.

 

[18IsTheMan]

I’m trying to imagine going back to the 90s and telling people in any given year you felt they were 12 teams with a legitimate shot at the national title at the end of the year. They would look at you like you had eight heads.

But, like a lot of things in our society these days, you say it loud enough and long enough, and people start to believe it. Or at least go along with it.

 

[gamecock stock]

I've said many times that we will never win the CFB national championship, nor even the SEC. I believe being an annual Top 20 team is doable for USC. Some of those years would put us in the playoffs. We would not be legitimate contenders to win it all. But, as a fan, making the playoffs would set us apart from the other 100+ FBS teams, making it a successful season. For me, making the playoffs is our "national championship".That's the way I see it.

 

[SouthernBelly]

I’m trying to imagine going back to the 90s and telling people in any given year you felt they were 12 teams with a legitimate shot at the national title at the end of the year. They would look at you like you had eight heads.

But, like a lot of things in our society these days, you say it loud enough and long enough, and people start to believe it. Or at least go along with it.

I liked the BCS. It ticked off so many people every season. But the reality is the BCS would have given college football the same matchup as the title game has in most seasons. There aren't 12 teams that are national title contenders. Usually, once we're outside the top 6 we're not looking at them either. And I would say in most seasons, not even all of the top 6.

I liked it when the bowls were valued by all, fun and unique way to end the season. Never wanted a playoff because of this very reason, it was never going to stay at 4 (four was the best format if it had to happen) and we all know it won't stay at 12 for long. Guess I am just curmudgeonly like that.

 

[atl-cock]

It's like the NCAA basketball Tournament. I think when I was in college, it was a 16 or maybe 32-team playoff. Of course, it's now 60+

Thus, I believe a 16-team CFB playoff system is inevitable in very short order.

We probably won't make the 12-team playoff this year. If we did, would we be respectable? Based on the past few performances, I think the answer is "Yes". If we win out (playing like we have in the past few games) and don't make the 12-team playoff, there are going to be those in our fan base griping about being shut out. Should selection be based on the total season or how a team finishes the later half of the season? I can see validity on both sides of that argument.

All collegiate football divisions besides FBS have at minimum a 16-team playoff.

Have the higher seed host each round up to the championship game, which should be played at a neutral site. Have it in Pasadena every year, rotate it amond Miamia, Atlanta, Dallas, Tampa, Pasadena, etc. or put it up for bids.

Let all the bowls, e.g., Peach-Fil-A, Orange, Sugar, Cotton, Rose, etc. conduct their games outside the playoffs. And if they want to wait a week or so and maybe invite a team whioch loses in the first or second round of the playoffs, have at it.

 

[atl-cock]

I’m trying to imagine going back to the 90s and telling people in any given year you felt they were 12 teams with a legitimate shot at the national title at the end of the year. They would look at you like you had eight heads.

But, like a lot of things in our society these days, you say it loud enough and long enough, and people start to believe it. Or at least go along with it.

How many of the 64 baseball teams and 68 basketball teams dancing have a legitimate shot?

Part of the fun and entertainment is the process of getting there, and of matching up teams in enviroments they normally do not inhabit.

 

[Beanerball]

I’d love it to go to 16, would add so much more excitement. But to say we can’t make a field of 12 is absurd. We could almost make it this year in a rebuilding year, in the mighty SEC. That we are in the SEC gives us a recruiting opportunity that other conferences don’t have. I’d rather in the party, the SEC, than being on the outside wishing you had an in. This season alone shows what the potential is for the program. Being on the outside, not so much.

 

[gamecock stock]

Why are we fans of USC? Is it for the potential of winning the national championship? If it's that, we might as well drop the sport now. Thus, I see nothing wrong at all with going to a 16-team playoff. At least if you make the playoffs, it validates the entire season as successful, meaning you were better than 100+ other FBS teams over the course of an entire season. If, on the other hand, you win a meaningless bowl game, that means you were better than one other team on one freaking afternoon. Whoopee.

Ask yourself this, too: what would help your recruiting more: going to a bowl game or making the playoffs? I believe it's making the playoffs.

 

[SouthernBelly]

Why are we fans of USC? Is it for the potential of winning the national championship? If it's that, we might as well drop the sport now. Thus, I see nothing wrong at all with going to a 16-team playoff. At least if you make the playoffs, it validates the entire season as successful, meaning you were better than 100+ other FBS teams over the course of an entire season. If, on the other hand, you win a meaningless bowl game, that means you were better than one other team on one freaking afternoon. Whoopee.

Ask yourself this, too: what would help your recruiting more: going to a bowl game or making the playoffs? I believe it's making the playoffs.

Are you talmbout having playoffs instead of bowls or expanding to 16 but some bowls still hanging around? But if it’s one format or the other there’s not much difference.

Bowl games have become meaningless but that’s still a fairly recent development. Validation of a good to great season is exactly what they were once upon a time.

If making the playoffs is the big accomplishment for the season and not a championship then the playoff game isn’t anymore meaningful than what a bowl game used to be. The more the playoff expands were bound to have more meaningless playoff games.

Obviously if it’s playoffs and bowls coexisting then it’s more valuable to claim a playoff spot. But before the playoffs were a thing making the upper tier bowls served the same purpose. (either way NIL/shot at NFL will trump either of those claims).

 

[18IsTheMan]

All collegiate football divisions besides FBS have at minimum a 16-team playoff.

And they are all inferior products.

 

[18IsTheMan]

How many of the 64 baseball teams and 68 basketball teams dancing have a legitimate shot?

Part of the fun and entertainment is the process of getting there, and of matching up teams in enviroments they normally do not inhabit.

Different sports. Baseball teams play best--of-series. Should football do that as well? Basketball plays multiple games a week. Should football do that as well?

 

[gamecock stock]

Are you talmbout having playoffs instead of bowls or expanding to 16 but some bowls still hanging around? But if it’s one format or the other there’s not much difference.

Bowl games have become meaningless but that’s still a fairly recent development. Validation of a good to great season is exactly what they were once upon a time.

If making the playoffs is the big accomplishment for the season and not a championship then the playoff game isn’t anymore meaningful than what a bowl game used to be. The more the playoff expands were bound to have more meaningless playoff games.

Obviously if it’s playoffs and bowls coexisting then it’s more valuable to claim a playoff spot. But before the playoffs were a thing making the upper tier bowls served the same purpose. (either way NIL/shot at NFL will trump either of those claims).

I'm fine with a 16-team playoff and bowls being available for teams that don't make the playoff.

To me, playing in a playoff is much more meaningful than playing in, say, the Gator Bowl. I believe 16-teams is the perfect size. I would not want to go more than that.

 

[Psycock]

Should go to 16, as I have always thought. Unfair to give 4 teams a bye when Top 4 will will often benefit from having a weaker schedule.

 

[will110]

It's like the NCAA basketball Tournament. I think when I was in college, it was a 16 or maybe 32-team playoff. Of course, it's now 60+

Thus, I believe a 16-team CFB playoff system is inevitable in very short order.

We probably won't make the 12-team playoff this year. If we did, would we be respectable? Based on the past few performances, I think the answer is "Yes". If we win out (playing like we have in the past few games) and don't make the 12-team playoff, there are going to be those in our fan base griping about being shut out. Should selection be based on the total season or how a team finishes the later half of the season? I can see validity on both sides of that argument.

The selection should be based on total season, but if the final spots are coming down to a handful of very similar teams, how they finished should come into play.

 

[will110]

All collegiate football divisions besides FBS have at minimum a 16-team playoff.

FBS college football is the only sport that I can think of - any level, any type - that historically named its champion without some sort of playoff system.

Can anyone think of a sport or league that doesn't have a playoff?

 

[3USC1801]

Do you want to see players commit to playing in bowl/championship games? Pay them to play.

As much as I hate the new NIL and portal dynamics, there’s no going back for major college football. So, why not pay players to show up for bowl/championship games?

With the amount of money made on bowl games, universities could easily pay each and every player a considerable amount—thousands of dollars. Tens of thousands. Use a sliding scale for those who play versus those who don’t.

 

[Blues man]

12 teams never made any sense when 16 can be done in the same amount of time. Plus byes are a stupid and an unnecessary advantage for teams already being rewarded by seeds. Some say byes are not an advantage at all and can actually hurt but either way, just add four more teams and end the stupidity.

 

[atl-cock]

And they are all inferior products.

Irrelevant.

 

[atl-cock]

Different sports. Baseball teams play best--of-series. Should football do that as well? Basketball plays multiple games a week. Should football do that as well?

The CFL did have a "best of three" for their west division champion back in the 1960s.

But we're not discussing what baseball and basketball do. Agin, if every other collegiate division and high school associations have playoffs, it's about time that FBS is finally coming around.

 

[atl-cock]

Should go to 16, as I have always thought. Unfair to give 4 teams a bye when Top 4 will will often benefit from having a weaker schedule.

If the Sun Belt champion can miraculously beat UGA in a first round playoff game in Athens, that champion deserves to move on to the second round. And the Dawgs can then accept a Sugar Bowl invitation, because the playoffs should operate completely outside of the bowl system.

 

[SC95]

Years ago while eating pizza and drinking beer at the Village Idiot (happy hour slices were 50 cents), a friend suggested that college football teams would eventually be professional teams affiliated with universities. The players would be paid, and may not even go to class. As crazy as it sounded then, it sounds more believable every day. With expanded playoffs, agents, NIL, free agency (transfer portal), etc., going to class sounds like a distraction.

 

[atl-cock]

Do you want to see players commit to playing in bowl/championship games? Pay them to play.

As much as I hate the new NIL and portal dynamics, there’s no going back for major college football. So, why not pay players to show up for bowl/championship games?

With the amount of money made on bowl games, universities could easily pay each and every player a considerable amount—thousands of dollars. Tens of thousands. Use a sliding scale for those who play versus those who don’t.

After expenses, schools have very little $$$ profit if any from bowl games.

 

[atl-cock]

Years ago while eating pizza and drinking beer at the Village Idiot (happy hour slices were 50 cents), a friend suggested that college football teams would eventually be professional teams affiliated with universities. The players would be paid, and may not even go to class. As crazy as it sounded then, it sounds more believable every day. With expanded playoffs, agents, NIL, free agency (transfer portal), etc., going to class sounds like a distraction.

Outside of the US and Canada, it's my understanding that professional sports teams are corporate owned. Sounds like the direction of NCAA D-I.

In that case, real collegiate sports will be in D-II, D-III, NAIA, Junior College, and Club teams.

 

[18IsTheMan]

Expand the CFP to 32 teams and then have mandated free therapy sessions with milk, cookies and fuzzy blankets for those teams that didn’t make it.

 

[SouthernBelly]

FBS college football is the only sport that I can think of - any level, any type - that historically named its champion without some sort of playoff system.

Can anyone think of a sport or league that doesn't have a playoff?

NFL & NBA. Looks like a playoff but is actually determined by the script

 

[DenverGamecock]

FBS college football is the only sport that I can think of - any level, any type - that historically named its champion without some sort of playoff system.

Can anyone think of a sport or league that doesn't have a playoff?

The soccer leagues in Europe do not have a playoff. They do have tournaments within their season that are separate.

 

[will110]

The soccer leagues in Europe do not have a playoff. They do have tournaments within their season that are separate.

Good point, I didn't think of them. But that's a system impossible to replicate in college football because of the vast difference in the number of teams. The Cup tournaments are a playoff system for those different titles, though.

 

[3USC1801]

After expenses, schools have very little $$$ profit if any from bowl games.

Really? Can you show profit/loss spreadsheet for us for each bowl game?

Universities are paid millions for bowl games (google it) and you’re telling us that travel expenses eat up all the profits? I seriously doubt it.

For context, the 2022 Gator Bowl (USC vs ND), paid $5,350,000.

 

[SC95]

Really? Can you show profit/loss spreadsheet for us for each bowl game?

Universities are paid millions for bowl games (google it) and you’re telling us that travel expenses eat up all the profits? I seriously doubt it.

For context, the 2022 Gator Bowl (USC vs ND), paid $5,350,000.

Check out article about bowl expenses. There are a lot of articles about the cost of college athletics.

 

[3USC1801]

Check out article about bowl expenses. There are a lot of articles about the cost of college athletics.

Thanks. But all the examples in the article were from over 14 years ago and from small bowls/markets.

I’ve read articles and seen payouts for all recent bowl games where the amounts are staggering. Bowls are big business. Universities and conferences could make changes but greed wins out.

As I said, I’m not happy with paying players, particularly with the current “system,” but it’s here to stay. Why not provide incentive for key players to participate in bowl games if the bowls are so important?

By the way, in the 2022 Gator Bowl, 20 Gamecocks (9 starters) elected not to participate. Who knows what the outcome would have been if those starters played?

 

[will110]

Thanks. But all the examples in the article were from over 14 years ago and from small bowls/markets.

I’ve read articles and seen payouts for all recent bowl games where the amounts are staggering. Bowls are big business. Universities and conferences could make changes but greed wins out.

As I said, I’m not happy with paying players, particularly with the current “system,” but it’s here to stay. Why not provide incentive for key players to participate in bowl games if the bowls are so important?

By the way, in the 2022 Gator Bowl, 20 Gamecocks (9 starters) elected not to participate. Who knows what the outcome would have been if those starters played?

We would have beaten Notre Dame if they had played, no question in my mind.

 

[atl-cock]

Really? Can you show profit/loss spreadsheet for us for each bowl game?

Universities are paid millions for bowl games (google it) and you’re telling us that travel expenses eat up all the profits? I seriously doubt it.

For context, the 2022 Gator Bowl (USC vs ND), paid $5,350,000.

I wasn't referring to USC in particular.

It's not just travel/extertainment/food expenses for the team, the band, and school officials. Schools have to guarantee that they'll sell their allotted share of tickets. Depending on the bowl and location, that might not happen. UCONN lost money on the Fiesta Bowl a number of years ago. They went to represent the Big East and for added school publicity.

Jacksonville is also a close drive from SC. It's a three-hour drive from Beaufort. You can actually make a long day of it without spending the night on the road. For the rest of the state, 1-2 nights on the First Coast. Atlanta is similar, especially for upstate SC..

 

[atl-cock]

Thanks. But all the examples in the article were from over 14 years ago and from small bowls/markets.

I’ve read articles and seen payouts for all recent bowl games where the amounts are staggering. Bowls are big business. Universities and conferences could make changes but greed wins out.

As I said, I’m not happy with paying players, particularly with the current “system,” but it’s here to stay. Why not provide incentive for key players to participate in bowl games if the bowls are so important?

By the way, in the 2022 Gator Bowl, 20 Gamecocks (9 starters) elected not to participate. Who knows what the outcome would have been if those starters played?

Regarding greed, if you conduct the playoffs completely separate from bowls, you cut out the middlemen and the schools/conferences take home more $$$.

 

[Piscis]

If the Sun Belt champion can miraculously beat UGA in a first round playoff game in Athens, that champion deserves to move on to the second round. And the Dawgs can then accept a Sugar Bowl invitation, because the playoffs should operate completely outside of the bowl system.

I don't think any team or its fans would have any interest in going to a bowl after being knocked out of the playoff.

 

[VZVZ]

Neither of the playoff plans is better than regular old bowl games. Just because the talking heads are making noise doesn’t mean college ball was any less fun before.

 

[atl-cock]

I don't think any team or its fans would have any interest in going to a bowl after being knocked out of the playoff.

I don't disagree with that, but IMO, that does not lessen the "importance" of a playoff.

 

[KingWard]

We would have beaten Notre Dame if they had played, no question in my mind.

I hated that loss. It ate my insides out like a cancer. I'm now wearing a bag over it.