House Bill 1020 creating new courts in Jackson CCID.......
- Thread starter OG Goat Holder
- Start date
Same Ole goat. Can't provide evidence for something "well documented", then instead of admitting his error he attacks.
The problem here is the only evidence you have is people who agree with you agreeing with you. That's it. And you mistook that for proof.
Again, the jails are full. Your own links say so. That's the only evidence I need. If the jails are full, how is the problem criminals being released? What else can be done when the jails are full and a new inmate comes along? So, again, how does a new district address the actual problem? Why not build more jails? Why would the cops/DAs/judges puller from existing areas for this new district not just keep doing what they are doing now, pleaing out everything they can, chasing drug arrests, ignoring petty crimes? Sounds like it's just more pandering to conservative idiots.
This won't save anything, it will make a small portion of the Capitol City a little safer. The majority of Jxn will continue under mob rule, a few hipsters and politicians (who were already in the safest areas of Jxn) will be a little safer. Do you want the state taking over the whole city? That's what it would take.
The state govt treats Jackson like the old Starkville govt treated students.
It happens elsewhere but mostly in places that are less important to the state as a whole.
Also, to the extent any areas on the Coast are as unsafe as the bad parts of Jackson (I question whether that's true), at least from Waveland through Ocean Springs, none of the nice areas have to deal with crime the way Fondren and Belhaven do, and probably not even the way eastover has to.
I don't know if that's true or not for Gautier, Moss Point, and Pascagoula, but to the extent it's not, then that is a big problem. Pascagoula at least has important infrastructure and industry and the State does need it to be liveable.
It's not about making it a little safer. It's about making it where people don't feel like they're making a big sacrifice in quality of life to live in Jackson. Even petty crime sucks to deal with. You start having the nice parts of Jackson be like the nice parts of other parts of the state, and then ideally you get a school voucher program (which I think is probably coming; other states have made huge progress and I think it would be a big political winner in Mississippi also), and suddenly Jackson will be more appealing than Madison for a lot of people that work in Jackson.
That's your cop out, not mine. Show me where this happens "everywhere".
And yeah, I'd say the jails are too small. Hopefully the continued decriminalization of weed to help that.
How so? What did the city of Jackson ask for that got shot down, provided they were willing to have oversight.
This is exactly what I want. Save a small portion of the city, and make it safe/cool/viable, etc. I have no delusion about saving all of Jackson. That can't happen.
What I propose, CAN happen.
Moss Point and to a lesser extent Pascagoula or more like Meridian than the rest of the Coast. Crime is a big problem in poor areas.
Again, the problem appears to be bad incentives. That Jackson bears the brunt of the effect doesn't change the cause. And how does a new judicial district solve that problem?
We can agree Jackson judges are putting criminals away faster than the jails can hold them, right? Is there a problem with who they are putting away and who they are not? If so, I would expect it to do with drug crimes.
These areas aren't totally lawless and overrun with woke idiots like Jackson.
Dude, no. Literally nobody agrees with you. The jail's capacity is not a part of what we're discussing.
It's been happening for along time. Jackson wanting an extra sales tax to fund things, for one example though I think that finally happened at some point after long blocks from the state. I'll try to look for examples if I have time.
All cities are subsets of the state and are created/run under the authority and with the regulation of the state. The state can change anything in statute about cities whenever it cares to as long as it's constitutional. Without the state there are no cities. Of course, whether this is a good idea is completely debatable for me. I'm not sure. The articles seem to throw a lot of words around without much evidence to back up claims on either side.
No, your cop out is that this was well documented.....but you can't provide any of that documentation. Your words bud. But go on, keep digging that hole, it's really helping your argument.**
Parts of MP sure as hell are just as bad as anywhere in Jackson. Same for many large towns in MS. Those areas just aren't nearly as large as they are in Jackson. I got lost in Greenville once and it was worse than anywhere I'd ever been in Jackson, thought I was gonna die until I finally figured out my way back over the river. Ditto for Birmingham, with interstate access subbed for the river.
ETA: and what does woke have to do with it? Is Hunters laptop part of the cause too, Q nut?
Maybe Jackson just does it better !
Analysis: For second straight year, Jackson’s homicide rate ranks highest in U.S. among major cities
Despite a drop in killings last year, the Capital City’s homicide rate still managed to surpass every other major city in the U.S., according to a 3 On Your Side analysis of dozens of municipalities across the country.
www.wlbt.com
Crime is bad in most poor areas. What makes Jackson different is that you can't get away from the crime. I've had friends in Fondren and Belhaven say as long as they don't leave anything visible in their car or outside, they're fine. That's what is called a ****** neighborhood in most places.
And if Moss Point is as bad or worse than jackson, which I can completely believe, that's not good, but it doesn't impact the rest of the state the way Jackson does. Meridian is the same, although I guess with it being surrounded by a pretty decent geographic area with nothing, it's maybe a bigger concern than Moss Point, which has good municipalities within easy commuting distance. Pascagoula seems like a big deal to the state with the port and engels, but I think it's a much bigger haul to justify trying to carve out areas to protect.
The new judicial district solves the problem of bad incentives. Yes, lots of crime is poorly thought out and opportunistic, and it's going to occur regardless. But lots of crime is not, and if they know they get a serious sentence in Madison or the capital district and potentially not even get bail, or will be let out in the rest of Hinds county and not even have a trial for over a year, that's pretty big differences in incentives.
Not sure on that. I don't think counties are responsible for paying for convicted felons. I think that falls on DOC. I think the counties have to pay for preconviction residents in County correctional facilities. And I think Hinds county judges make it harder on themselves because they had some judges not carrying a fair workload. But DOC also has residents at county correctional facilities, so I'm not sure who is responsible for that or who has the responsibility for managing overcrowding. And I wouldn't bet money on that regardless. You have judicial districts that cover multiple counties, so also not sure how that is handled with county sheriffs and correctional facilities.
That said, violent criminals need to be in jail. If we don't have enough room for violent criminals, we need to build more jails. I suspect we could probably do better by doing more house arrest (paid for by inmates add their families) for non-violent criminals, earlier release for some crimes, drug courts, and just generally better prison options for prisoners that seem likely candidates for reform, but if we need to build more prisons, then we need to build more prisons. And if we need to make tradeoffs until we build more prisons, we need to make that tradeoff tilt towards releasing people to house arrest at the end of their sentences, not giving them short sentences to begin with.
Agree with a lot of that, but i don't see how a new judicial district creates new incentives. I guess you are just saying they'll bring in judges that will give different sentences (without addressing where to put them), but how much affect does this have when DAs plead out 97% of cases, and when cops don't even pursue most crimes?
You're seriously going to contend that nowhere else has a handful of anecdotes of repeat criminals on the streets? Seriously? You need proof of that?
ETA: besides, I didn't say it was well documented. It's my belief based on experience (including personal experience of POS that keep getting released). Without having claimed it was well documented, I have no burden to show the documentation. Maybe it exists, maybe it's hard to find, doesn't matter because I made no such claim. You are the one who claimed it was well documented, and can't handle being wrong about that. No wonder you never learn.
The problem here is it's easy to give tough sentences in areas without much crime, and difficult as hell in places with a lot of crime. Because the resources needed to secure and pay for those sentences scales up with the crime. A new district doesn't address that. It's just pandering.
Well, they also blocked that for Hattiesburg, at least for a while. Haven't given much thought to whether protection against higher taxes or subsidiarity is a better policy, so not sure if that was good or bad, but it doesn't seem like it was Jackson specific.
ETA: I think the hattiesburg one was killed in committee possibly by a delegate whose district included areas outside of Hattiesburg. Not sure about Jacksons. They may have both been a reflection of who was on committee or it may have been an attitude by the legislature in general. I think those local sales tax increases may come through private and local, and at one time I think the committee chair said they wouldn't move any tax increases unless they had unanimous consent from the local delegation? Take all that with a grain of salt (the local and private chair may have said they wouldn't move anything at all without unanimous consent? and it may be that the sales tax issues don't even go before local and private). All that to say the tax increases may be more or less decided by local delegations and/or committee membership makeup rather than reflect any general attitude of the legislature.
So anyways, plowing on.....
I'm assuming this has NOT been done anywhere else, or at least nobody here knows if it has.
I'm assuming this has NOT been done anywhere else, or at least nobody here knows if it has.
The state needs certain entities with state-run interests to function. The Capitol, UMC, JSU, a few tangential groups like the license department, etc. That’s about it. Taking drastic legislative measures to protect residents that are probably 90% private sector employees that don’t work in those offices is major overkill. And if protecting the tax base is important, then it should extend to all residential areas within the city limits.
Disagree. Its no more or less costly for the state as a whole. The added costs are being assumed by individuals who voluntarily choose to make that commute and work for the government. They are free and clear to move to Jackson if they wish. This is an issue overall, but its not the state’s issue.
That ship sailed over 30 years ago. That’s all there is to it. That “snapping of the fingers” is not happening, and this bill isn’t going to come anywhere close to making it happen.
My opinion is that the bill as a whole would stand a much higher chance of withstanding federal court scrutiny if it didn’t extend the jurisdictions into residential areas. Beyond that, I don’t have a strong opinion on if its a good idea or not. But its not going to save the city or any part of it. It may stop some of the bleeding and graft, but that’s about it.
You are correct: local and private bills wil die in committee if the local delegation does not unanimously support them. That has killed a lot of bills for east MS in my adult lifetime because we lacked that unanimous voice.
Didn’t read any of them but I bet it’s a bunch of lefties whining about racismworth reading.
Over accusations of racism, Mississippi House passes bill to create unelected court system
Over calls of racism and recollections of the state's dark past, the Mississippi House passed a bill to create an unelected court within Jackson.www.clarionledger.com
So you can’t answer his question about how Jackson was neglected and other cities weren’t?
man why does this always happen to democrat ran cities? Seems like a theme.
They need o
They need it more bc they are incompetent. Great idea! Let’s give the incompetent SOBs more money!
You want to know the truth of the problem from someone who has worked in the Hinds county criminal Justice system as an attorney? Me.
Here it is. The judges are incompetent. All of them. Tomie Green, Kidd, and Wooten all should have been disbarred and removed from office by judicial performance. Wooten is by far the worst. She is mentally unstable and hated by everyone (both sides of attys and law enforcement). She has tricked her constituents through race baiting. Everyone in the legislature (both sides) despises her. Peterson is by far the best judge, but she is in bed with law enforcement because her dad was a cop. The district attorney’s office was an absolute crooked joke under RSS. It’s better under J Owens, but not much. The jail…previous sheriffs should be in prison. I’ve probably visited 50 plus jails/prisons in my career. It’s the worst, and nothing compares. Same for the sheriffs and police department. It’s the worst I’ve ever seen in the U.S., and nothing compares.
But even, having said all of that, the single biggest problem is the State crime lab. People don’t go to trial for 5+ years on serious, maybe or maybe not complicated crimes because the lab cannot examine the evidence in a timely manner. Completely overwhelmed and no funding. That particular issue is the State’s fault. That’s white leader’s fault.
To be clear though, none of this has anything to do with the color of anyone’s skin. The citizens of Hinds and Jackson have elected idiots, it’s that simple. You go to the MS delta and the criminal Justice system is light years better. Light years. Those are majority black districts.
I don't know all the details but Washington D.C. is basically under the same system.
It's the residential areas that actually provide more taxes than they consume in services that they have to protect.
While I get the appeal of assuming everybody that works in government is a moron, those workers can generally add and subtract, so they don't just take a lower quality of life for nothing. It costs the state both in needing to pay more and probably more importantly, in missing out on candidates that would otherwise consider those jobs.
It will go a long way. Again, a lot of crime is about proximity, but criminals do know to stay out of Madison County. This won't turn that area into Madison County, but if they start handing out stiff sentences and prosecute cases quickly, it will move the needle.
Purely anecdotal here, but I have a buddy who worked as a cop in Jackson 15-16 years ago. His biggest complaint was that they'd arrest someone for violent crime or drugs and they'd be out on the street with penny ante sentences within 3 months because the judges were exceedingly soft on crime.
His exact quote - "We can't really do our jobs because we get no support from the judges. It's pointless - these guys will be back on the streets within a year no matter what they do."
Oh I see- I typed '**** show' originally. But 'shitshow' does get thru. Funny.