It also leaves out the entire process of extracting, transporting, storing, refining, again transporting, and again storing oil/gas.
Man forced to ditch Ford EV truck during family road trip to Chicago: ‘biggest scam of modern times’
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We live in a country with 330million people.
It's pretty safe to say you can find folks that want most anything you can think of.
Just because you can find some people that want something doesn't mean it's realistic or even possible.
Solid state batteries. Sodium and Sulfur ion batteries. 10 minute charge times and 900 mile ranges. The breakthroughs are amazing, and will be in cars within 3 years. I'm not sure we would have these breakthroughs without government commitment to zero emission cars.
I don't currently own an EV because they don't fit my lifestyle. But they are fun as hell to drive. And for the guy above revving his 429 at the traffic light, most of those EVs can leave your car in the dust.
I don't currently own an EV because they don't fit my lifestyle. But they are fun as hell to drive. And for the guy above revving his 429 at the traffic light, most of those EVs can leave your car in the dust.
You have all those issues with the fuel for power plants too.
The bottom line is EVs aren’t good for much besides quick jaunts to work or around town. I’d like to get one for just those reasons but they would have to be cheaper than a similar sized gas vehicle and still look good. Unfortunately that is a nearly non-existent combination.
I dont know where they are getting their numbers, but in my i4, I drove from Saltillo to Columbus, then to Vance Alabama ok my way to Birmingham. I've never spent more than 30 minutes charging ever. As a matter of fact, when I started charging at Buccees in Leeds, I started with 57% and went inside. Didn't even go to the bathroom. Just got a drink and a couple of bags of gummie bears and I looked on my app and I was at 77%. Wanted to get a few more things but didn't have time. My total charge time there was 13 minutes. I get free charging with Electrify Amerkca, but if I didn't it would have cost $8.55. No way I'm driving that far on less than. 3 gallons of gas.
And no, I didn't get it because of "environmental responsibility" or some crap like that. I got it because I drive a lot and it's cheaper to drive a mile in an EV than it is with an ICE car. My electric bill was right at $40 more because of my EV, but that's only 1 fillup for me and I would have to fill up every other day.
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Which EV do you own? I have not found that to be the case with my Model 3 after 5 years.
Curious as to why you’d only examine one side of that same argument, because it also leaves out the efficiency of drilling for crude oil, converting it to gasoline, applying additives like ethanol to basically dilute it and make it even less efficient, etc. That’s a horribly inefficient process as well, and one that uses that same power plant inefficiency to run the manufacturing processes at the refineries.
(ETA: saw that this was already addressed to some extent above. Sorry for the redundant commentary)
The only inefficiency argument that can be made in regards to EV’s regarding any environmental factors are that the same amount of battery raw materials used for one EV could be spread across 3 or 4 plug-in hybrids, or 6-7 conventional hybrids. In each progressive case those vehicles become cheaper, and the overall carbon footprint is greatly reduced more by spreading those materials through to more vehicles. To be clear, the single EV is still going to be the most efficient compared to those others. But that use of the limted precious metals forces you into building more ICE models to compensate.
Ultimately, it’s all about the most effective conversion of non-renewable resources into both reduced emissions and efficient power transfer at the wheels for the entire fleet of vehicles for each automaker. BEV’s are a big part of the answer and becoming a bigger part every day, but they aren’t the only answer.
So they aren’t good for much except for 90% - 95% of the driving that an overwhelming majority of Americans do on a daily basis. Got it. What a scam****
Yes.
I was just pointing out that you complained something wasn't included in the electric part of the graphic when it also wasn't included in the gas part of the graphic. Since you didn't mention it. I did.
Yeah, you’re right. It leaves out a lot of stuff such as oil refinery operating costs, delivery of crude to the refineries, delivery of gas and diesel to the distributors and local service stations and stuff like that.
You have the one car that makes my statement “nearly non-existent” rather than “non-existent”. Your post on the first page describes exactly why I wouldn’t buy any EV in the current lineup over similarly appointed gasoline cars. I wouldn’t want to be waiting around thirty minutes minimum to power up during each leg of a trip every time I decide to leave the state. An EV would be hella convenient for me as a grocery-getter but 45K is a lot for me to spend on something like that.
That is not how it works for long range fast charging cars. I can recharge mine in 15-20 minutes and drive 220-300 miles. After 3 hours I stop anyway. It does add a few minutes but not hours. But I save so much $$ on that it’s worth it “TO ME”. It may not be for you. Thing is, get informed on what they are really about and don’t believe crap like that.
We have 3 vehicles. We never drive one of the gas ones unless we have to and that’s rare except for my wife’s commute to work.
I have owned this EV since Dec last year and charge at home except for trips which I do plan, but I enjoy the process because it costs so much less to operate.
As battery tech improves or they make hydrogen powered cars viable you may switch from ICE vehicles too.
Govt subsidizes oil industry way more than EVs to make sure we have enough domestic oil. Maybe one day neither will require subsidies. I can dream.
It’s a conspiracy theory.
“The government is trying to force everyone into Urban areas!”
Do you mean the same government that incentivizes rural development by offering USDA loans?
Here is s pretty good guide. If a group of people are saying something is the case without any truly tangible evidence it could be a conspiracy theory.
If a group of people are saying something is the case and the only tangible evidence is the exact opposite is happening. It’s definitely a conspiracy theory.
Oh, I wanted the Ford lightening myself but I was not convinced it could tow stuff as far I needed. I kept my old F150 around but rarely drive it.
EVs tech is in the infant stages and yet I found one that works for me very well.
I can see how a school bus route would save tons of money in fuel and maintenance costs. I am still not sure I would recommend it yet for a school district as I would not want to be the first one to risk it not working.
EVs tech is in the infant stages and yet I found one that works for me very well.
I can see how a school bus route would save tons of money in fuel and maintenance costs. I am still not sure I would recommend it yet for a school district as I would not want to be the first one to risk it not working.
I think you are correct. Public transport is way cheaper and more efficient and works very well in Europe. Problem:
This country has way too much rural countryside. Public transport out were I live will never be a thing and I have no plans to move. I do use it when I travel and it’s very convenient.
They can wish for public transport all they want but it will never dominate the rural communities. Not a viable option.
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Correct, we are too spread out as a country, but man it’s nice when I’m in Boston or NY and can just hop on a train or bus to get around.
I've never heard anyone say public transportation will dominate Rural communities. I rarely heard even plans for service to rural communities.
High speed rail connecting the major US cities would be an AWESOME alternative to air travel.
Faster boarding (Multiple entry point to board and leave the train, no TSA) and real high speed, trips as far as 1,000 miles would be as fast or faster than air or driving.
This does rely on Public transit at the destination or not leaving the destination area. But that's not really different from air travel.
But for a trip to Disney? Or a Bowl game in Texas or Florida game? Weekend in New Orleans?
Be able to get on a train in Jackson and be there are fast or faster than air travel?
Yeah, those are having their own issues though. Just saw this this morning. It's not great news.
World’s Biggest Wind Power Projects Are in Crisis Just When World Needs Them Most (yahoo.com)
"Faster boarding (Multiple entry point to board and leave the train, no TSA) and real high speed, trips as far as 1,000 miles would be as fast or faster than air or driving."
You had me up to "no TSA" . If you want to ride a 200mph train full of random people who didn't have to go through a security check point in the times we're in have at it....I'll pass.
You had me up to "no TSA" . If you want to ride a 200mph train full of random people who didn't have to go through a security check point in the times we're in have at it....I'll pass.
Jackson County bought 6 electric busses last summer with grant money. They're projecting $150,000 fuel and maintenance savings over the life of each bus. I'm guessing that's a very optimistic at best projection, but assuming reliability is good, they should save a lot of money. This is a place where EVs make tons of sense.
SHOULDA BOUGHT A NISSAN TITAN. AT LEAST ITS MIS'IPPI BILT
Man forced to ditch Ford EV truck during family road trip to Chicago: ‘biggest scam of modern times’
A Canadian man is sharing his frustrating experience – and the expenses incurred – after he purchased a Ford F-150 Lightning electric pickup truck earlier this year.finance.yahoo.com
To have a fun Saturday night out, I took Mrs. Devil to Shapley’s last night. We pulled up and saw a white lightning. It looked very nice from the outside. While we waited to be seated, I headed to the bar where I met the older gentleman that owned it and got to talking. He had nothing but good things to say. Given he was retired and did not drive more than 50 miles a day. I do not know if this means they are worth buying or not, but he seemed to really enjoy it.
I knew a foreign exchange student from Belgium. Before coming to America, he thought Americans were lazy for driving everywhere.
After living here, he understood why
I had a Ford Fusion Energi for 4 years. I could charge it at night and drive 27 miles on battery power. After that it was a hybrid. I averaged 55 MPG and only had to fill up about once a month. I really enjoyed the car but it was 7 years old and the electric warranty was for 8 years. The full electric batteries made the trunk small. I don't have any issues with moving to EV other than waiting to see the charging infrastructure put in place and the safety issues with charging. The current electric grid is woefully inadequate (according to power engineering professors at MSU). I'm glad we have early adopters like you and enjoyed reading about your experience. Mine was also positive. Our friends in CA said there are long lines at the charging stations. I can't imagine sitting with the car off in line to charge my vehicle while gas vehicles are zooming around. I have a type A personality when I get on the road for a long trip. That would really set me off.
Amtrak basically does this now. Just wander in with your luggage, stow it in the back of the car and they come around and check your tickets later. I don’t recall having my bags checked at all.
My Prius is coming up on 200,000 miles and has needed very minimal maintenance. I’m not sure if that is true for all hybrids, but this one has worked well.
Why is there this mentality that you can only go 50 miles in a day? If all I do is drive to work and back, I will be driving 140 miles. Sometimes I go to lunch so that adds to it. Other days, I drive my daughter to her after school activities. Usually I put around 160 miles on it per day.
Should've stopped at Buc-ee'sMan forced to ditch Ford EV truck during family road trip to Chicago: ‘biggest scam of modern times’
A Canadian man is sharing his frustrating experience – and the expenses incurred – after he purchased a Ford F-150 Lightning electric pickup truck earlier this year.
All of that is true. It takes 10 minutes to plan a trip with an EV. 10 minutes. Dude is dumb as hell.
Show me anyone in this conversation that has a mentality of 'I can only drive 50mi in a day'. If you genuinely think that is a common way of thinking, you are completely missing what is actually happening in the conversation.
The average miles driven per day in the US is 37. So 50 miles per day is almost 40% ABOVE the US average.
The point of saying 50 miles is that it helps show most US drivers dont even average that, so there should be little to no concern of running out of power in a day and with most, someone could go multiple days without charging.
As with use cases for everything, there are exceptions and outliers. You are clearly an outlier since you average 58,000 miles per year, compared the the US average of 13,500. Your situation is so far removed from what is typical/average that there is no point in comparing it. You drive more than 4x the average.
Are you concerned they will hijack the train? and take it where? to where it was going anyway?
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