On a Scale of 1-10 What Is Your Outlook of Our Football Program Under Leach

[Go Budaw]

6.5 or 7. We have a 7 win average coach which is pretty much all Mullen ever was. We tend to always play hard even if we don’t always play well….same as Mullen. There is minimal off-field drama like we had with Moorhead, Croom, and the later Sherrill years. The talent profile is also similar overall to Mullen although it is distributed differently (better WR’s / more accurate QB’s, worse athleticism at QB and OL).

If we made a change, the chances of upgrading from a 7 win average coach to a 7.5 win average coach is about 1%. The chances of upgrading to an 8+ average win coach are 0%. The chances of downgrading or a lateral trade to a 3 to 7 win average coach are about 99%. Those are the hard facts of bring a have-not program in the SEC.

 

[ronpolk]

If we go 5-7 with another loss to UM which is now looking very possible, I say cut our losses and move on.
I don’t see next year being much better but the schedule may be a bit easier to get us to 7 wins - maybe?
With that being said, Leach is about a 4 on your scale as of right now.

I don’t understand how 5-7 is looking very possible? Raise your hand if after we barely squeezed out a win vs LA Tech you knew we’d turn around and handle NC State very easily? And then after a loss to Memphis, we’d travel to A&M and beat them, then beat Kentucky and win at auburn? The only thing for sure after Saturday is that we are gonna at a minimum have 3 losses.

 

[Faustdog]

10

Makes about as much sense as your 1.

 

[Xenomorph]

3.6 Roentgen

 

[Dawg1976]

5. And that’s being generous.

 

[ckDOG]

10 on getting us to mediocre bowls. 3 on seasons to be proud of.

Very confident he wins 6-7 per year + Liberty or similar. He gets a 10.

I don't see him ever having us be a real threat to a consistent 8+ win team and occasional NYD bowl or possible threat to win the West though. He gets a 3.

 

[bulldoghair]

5

We are currently 13-14 under leach now. He looks like he’ll be batting .500 for a long while here.

 

[Go Budaw]

I’d say 6. Maybe my expectations are too low but he have a good season last year in year 2. Id like to see this season play out before I’m ready to tar and feather him.

I think some of you are overreacting to the LSU loss. I agree it’s a game we should have won but it’s not an embarrassing loss by any means. Most teams (not named Alabama and Georgia) are going to struggle to win in Baton Rouge, just historically a hard place to win.

I also think we need to stop talking about how much he’s paid. No matter if his tenure is considered a success or failure here, his pay his market for an SEC job. We are gonna have to pay his replacement that much too.

Amen to this. It’s really not even market, its on the lower rung of salaries in this league. Without looking, I’d bet that only the coaches at Vandy, Mizzou, and USC are making less, and none of those guys have anything close to Leach’s resume.

If how much he’s paid dictates how much success we expect, then the $5 million coach losing to the $10 million coach should be the exact result that was expected last Saturday night, and nobody has any room to be upset.

 

[Go Budaw]

Leach isn't the problem and he's not the solution either. We can't afford to live in the SEC. Money produces results and we don't have enough to compete. Nick Saban couldn't win a national championship with the budget State is required to work with. We will never be able to compete regularly in the SEC and we can't afford to get out so we're destined to be exactly what we are. A coach isn't going to fix that. To answer your question, I'd give Leach a 7.

The statement above is the most simple, yet accurate statement about our current predicament. Well said.

 

[BoDawg.sixpack]

6 - I like the overall effort we play with.

And our recruiting has been adequate. We have a tough schedule and I don't hold that against CML.

 

[boatsandhoes]

4.5 to 5

I’ll try to keep it short.

They’re playing scared or in fear of making mistakes on offense. until we start to play handcuffs off, full blast attacking we’re not going to win much. I thought we hired leach to do the latter. Freewheeling balls to the walls chunking it, up tempo making the other team dodge bullets.

If we’re a boxer, we only jab jab jab and try not to get hit. I’m ready to throw uppercuts,
and overhand rights. If we get knocked out, so what. We’re gonna land some, and be hell
to fight.

 

[PhredPhantom]

C'mon....be real. "13" isn't between "1" and "10"

I'll say "10"***

10 isn’t between 1 and 10 either. **

Just sayin’

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

We'll have a season with leach better than winning the SECW? Better than being ranked #1 in the playoff poll? That is simply magical thinking.

We will win 10 games under him. That is better than any season we’ve ever had.

 

[FloodDawg]

5, maybe 6 - I always liked watching his teams at other places, but never wanted his system at State. He has a low ceiling here, especially in an NIL world

 

[Mr. Cook]

10 isn’t between 1 and 10 either. **

Just sayin’

Well played...well played....

 

[Junction John]

If he goes .500 we will have to add a third statue between Sherrill and Merlinz.

 

[tribaldawg]

Since you are going to argue with responses to your question why don’t you let us know the expected responses next time so we can respond accordingly.

 

[Ralph Cramden]

I would say around 7. I'm a little impatient but I still think we will rise to the level of 3rd best in the west which is probly all you can hope for. If he maintains a 500 record he will be one of the best since McKeen.

 

[was21]

Next time make it where he gets ranked from 1 thru 14 for obvious reasons

 

[fedxdog]

What did the baseball announcer say about us in 2021…something about our fans having false expectations.
So we look for a big time coach. Maybe Jimbo Fisher will be available! I don’t give big to the Bulldog Club anymore and don’t expect to influence decisions.

 

[8dog]

Who said that?

 

[MaxwellSmart]

5

 

[mstateglfr]

6



I dont forsee us competing for a national championship and I dont forsee us winning only 3 games each year.
A 1, to me, would be even worse than Croom.

 

[archdog]

Uh the Liberty Bowl last year would like a word.

Well, forgive me that I like to think about what was going on at the time. We basically were missing half the team for Covid. WE had our best players sitting out for the combine (Whatever that Means) due to bowl games not meaning jack ****, why risk it.
Remind me how many scholarship athletes we had that day, 45 versus 85?

Circumstances matter.

 

[Smoked Toag]

6



I dont forsee us competing for a national championship and I dont forsee us winning only 3 games each year.
A 1, to me, would be even worse than Croom.

I don't know how long you've been a fan, but you literally can't get much worse than Croom, as far as fan outlook. Maybe you weren't around back then. Moorhead was about the same, he just had the benefit of inherited talent for one year. It still sucked going through 2018 knowing the team was underachieving by a large margin.

 

[PirateDawg]

WE HAVE A WINNER!!! This is the issue so we all better get used to it. Saban couldn't win here and would never come here because he knows that. In fact, any coach that wants to win a national championship has to wait their turn to take one of the 10 jobs in America that would purchase the talent to do so.

 

[PirateDawg]

I'm with you. Leach all the way to retirement!

 

[PirateDawg]

This thread summary: "I want a Ferrari but I only have enough money for a Chevy Malibu!"

Dream on folks!

 

[missouridawg]

Spare me the “he’s won everywhere”, that’s the same BS we heard about Ben Howland. Neither won here. I’m currently at a 1, we’re seeing a coach not wanting to adjust his system like Howland and just seems to be collecting a 5.5 million dollar check. That’s essentially 1.2 million per win, that’s a damn shame.

We, as an athletic department, knew he didn't have a desire to adjust his system when we hired. He ain't going to change it, no matter how much data is put in front of him about what QBs who can run a little bit do to defenses (the only reason LSU scored on us is because their QB had running ability).

My outlook for Leach is probably 6-7 wins a season and it's almost always going to contain a game or two each year in which we lose to teams that we should beat (Memphis, LSU, Arkansas-2021, LSU-2022 so far) but also probably contain us winning a game or two that we shouldn't (aTm, Auburn - 2021).

 

[pmack3641]

I say 5, and disagree with your statement that he shouldn’t be held accountable because our schedule is difficult. A good portion of posters have stated his third year at a program is very good. A difficult schedule shouldn’t be used as a crutch if he’s recruited the right players and has coached them up to meet the challenge of that schedule.

 

[Smoked Toag]

This thread summary: "I want a Ferrari but I only have enough money for a Chevy Malibu!"

Dream on folks!

Which is why we must innovate and have a very clear plan. Whether it's the Air Raid, Triple Option, Malzahn, transfer portal, recruiting strategy, whatever.

Then people throw out stuff like "Mullen's/Riley's/Kiffin's offense"....those guys don't have an 'offense'. They aren't system coaches. They have offensive backgrounds and are good at organizing. And they all have recruiting strategies. So dropping Lincoln Riley at MSU won't suddenly make our offense awesome. Competent, sure, as Mullen did this coming off the Croom years. But we have to find a way to get players. It seems to me that recruiting to a system, from a base camp of MS underdeveloped players, would be the best way to do this. Because it won't be NIL.

I personally think we should spend our limited NIL monies on defensive linemen (and defense in general) because that's what we're known for and that's where MS produces the most high-level players. The rest has to be innovated.

 

[Hypnodawg]

I'm about a 5.

If we can't beat that LSU team in year 3, the future isn't bright. On the other hand, for 3 quarters we held our own against a team we have only beat 3 times in 20 something years.

A slightly more mobile QB would change this offense drastically.

Bowl games are a complete joke now. So many sitting out, I don't even watch them anymore. I put no weight on the coach for a bowl game performance outside of the playoffs.

 

[QuaoarsKing]

I say 5, and disagree with your statement that he shouldn’t be held accountable because our schedule is difficult. A good portion of posters have stated his third year at a program is very good. A difficult schedule shouldn’t be used as a crutch if he’s recruited the right players and has coached them up to meet the challenge of that schedule.

I'm pretty sure this notion was made up by anti-Leach people who wanted to set up a lofty goal, hoping he would fail to reach it. Leach was 3-9 in year 3 at Washington State and didn't really get it going for a couple years after that (though to be fair he took over the literal worst P5 program of the 21st century). Year 3 at Texas Tech was 8-5 with a bowl win, a nice year but not a huge step forward from Year 2.

 

[BossDawg78]

Middle of the road, so 4 or 5. I don't think he's gonna take us anywhere beyond that either, not even one year where everything bounces our way and we pull off 10 wins. Everything feels so "meh," as if the team is going through the motions. I just don't feel like we're on an upward trajectory with him at the helm. Does Leach have any fire left? I don't think so.

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

The fact this thread is still going means there is still a large contingent that will hammer you for any grade over 5 that means you see any future with CML. Three games in and we are doomed and need to replace the AD with a national championship and a coach that just started his second season with a full roster.

Now let me join the mob and say we need something done for special teams. We need to sign a new kicker.... Wait we just did, well we need another AD, Coach, and kicker.

We need another QB that can withstand Top Ten rated DLs running right pass Tackles (we don't have Top Ten OLs) and smashing him so hard he can't make a perfect throw every time or. just tuck the ball run over those DLs.

We need to go ahead and make reservations in Birmingham and Memphis for bowl season.

Before the season ever started I tried to temper everybody's expectations by telling you that we may have a good team this year but we have one hell of a hard schedule. We had a chance to beat LSU OK. I hope you have a chance to meet everybody at their level of talent this season. I know we have a large group that said we were going to win the SEC before we start the season possibly even having a 10 win season. In contrast, I said we win six to eight in the regular season so you'll have to forgive me if I'm not ranting raving and covering myself in ashes because we do not have talent at our offensive line positions. We have a really good defense (except for our secondary, it needs experience) that's gonna keep us in a lot of games but you have to remember that we are not playing Missouri & Vanderbilt for our Eastern conference games we are getting Kentucky and Georgia.

I know we can fix our problems with our transfer portal but we're all really getting used to seeing how this damn thing works so I've gotta give anyone at least one or two of those of seasons to see how he does.

If you want a real answer I would give Leech 6 maybe 6 1/2. He's got to show he can continue recruiting guys that will fit his offense and unfortunately as of now he really does not have of all those guys still. Sorry.

 

[BossDawg78]

And the system IS up and running. Our offense is fine.

Uhhh....nope. Uh uh. Negatory.

 

[harrybollocks]

Bingo. Reality sets in unless the rules change.

Leach isn't the problem and he's not the solution either. We can't afford to live in the SEC. Money produces results and we don't have enough to compete. Nick Saban couldn't win a national championship with the budget State is required to work with. We will never be able to compete regularly in the SEC and we can't afford to get out so we're destined to be exactly what we are. A coach isn't going to fix that. To answer your question, I'd give Leach a 7.

 

[IPMdawg]

1. Is it not obvious to everyone else that excitement around the program is trending down? As we continue to lose fan support, Leach’s recruiting of non-QBs is going to significantly get worse. He then will quit making bowl games around the time the conference expands. We have lost a lot of financial support in recruiting that we had during the Mullen and Moorhead eras. The widening of the talent gap is going to get blamed on NIL, but much of it can be blamed on Leach’s frustrating offense and how the athletic dept is treating some of our top boosters. We aren’t going to sign another Fletcher Cox, Jeff Simmons, or Charles Cross until we get some of our instrumental boosters bought back into the program. I’m hoping the return of Rhett Hobart can help turn some of our AD issues around.

 

[Go Budaw]

1. Is it not obvious to everyone else that excitement around the program is trending down? As we continue to lose fan support, Leach’s recruiting of non-QBs is going to significantly get worse. He then will quit making bowl games around the time the conference expands. We have lost a lot of financial support in recruiting that we had during the Mullen and Moorhead eras. The widening of the talent gap is going to get blamed on NIL, but much of it can be blamed on Leach’s frustrating offense and how the athletic dept is treating some of our top boosters. We aren’t going to sign another Fletcher Cox, Jeff Simmons, or Charles Cross until we get some of our instrumental boosters bought back into the program. I’m hoping the return of Rhett Hobart can help turn some of our AD issues around.

First off, I’m calling complete ******** on this. Our boosters are doing what they always do.

Secondly, even if what you are saying is true….we’d be screwed regardless. There’s no chance of us having any long term success with boosters that are too fickle / cheap to not support the recruiting effort 100% to the best of their ability….regardless of their thoughts on the staff. That would be an infinitely bigger problem than a single, underachieving coach, and one that no SEC program can afford to have - ever.

 

[mstateglfr]

I don't know how long you've been a fan, but you literally can't get much worse than Croom, as far as fan outlook. Maybe you weren't around back then. Moorhead was about the same, he just had the benefit of inherited talent for one year. It still sucked going through 2018 knowing the team was underachieving by a large margin.

It certainly feels like you can't get much worse than Croom from a fan outlook perspective, I agree. Those were dark times for fans.
But the product on the field could have been worse, and if it had been worse then the outlook would have been even worse. Even more would be negative, even more would be actively frustrated instead of passivley frustrated, etc.
Crazy, but it could have been worse.


I was around back then. My last couple years in school were during Croom's era. I stood in the Hump and listened to him declare maroon is all that matters.