I am good for $4.09.
PSU Football: Do you demand excellence or are you satisfied with mediocrity?
- Thread starter BobPSU92
- Start date
Again, it’s being 3rd, not beating on the Delaware blue hens. Why so obtuse?
Being 8th in the national polls is not mediocre?
Being ranked above the following is not mediocre:
Washington
Clemson
LSU.
Utah
Kansas State.
Florida State
Oregon.
Oregon State
UCLA.
Tulane
notre dame.
South Carolina
Texas.
UCF
UTSA.
UNC
Mississippi State.
Troy
NC State.
Cincinnati
Boise State
Purdue
Mississippi
Southern Alabama
Illinois
Pittsburgh
Fresno State.
James Madison
Ohio.
Minnesota
et al
That guy's lost a lot of brain cells and memories of the last 35 years. He still thinks this is 1986. Cut him some slack.
And how does that relate to the current environment of NIL ? The new player attitude - we will go where we are paid (or given some nice perks like CJ Stroud’s car dealership NIL gig. ).
I loved the old college football environment from the 70’s and 80’s also - scholarship players at 85, student athletes, transfer and you sit a year - but unfortunately we are 40 years past this.
The new college football environment- NIL / transfer portal / payme and play me.
There are other fan bases and programs - OSU, USC, Texas - who get this. PSU fans are stuck in the past.
If you want excellence - put up or shut up.
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Was the Big10 version of JoePa even up to this standard? How many Big10 titles did he win?
Can there be something in the middle? In other words, better than mediocre and not quite excellent, but always striving for excellence!
Just looked it up. He won the Big10 three times. ‘94, ‘05, and ‘08. Not sure when you are considering that he got old and had hung on too long, but good chance two of those three occurred after that.
Looking at the poll currently, 54.2% of the votes for Excellence is mediocre.
With regard to the Top 10 finishes, Joe finished in the Top-10 20 times in 45 years. That is a 44% batting average. Assuming CJF carries the team to a top 10 finish this year, he will have taken PSU to the Top-10 4 times in 9 years - also a 44% batting average.
Joe won the Big Ten 3 out of 18 years - a 16.7% rate. CJF has won one time in 9 years - an 11.1 % rate.
Outside of being in the top 10, Joe was in the top 12 only 2 times. CJF has not been in the top 12 when he is not in the top 10.
Granted, it's difficult to compare the two eras equally, but I don't think CJF is all that far off the mark from Joe, after being here for 9 years. Behind in Big Ten Championships and non Top Ten/inside Top 12 finishes. But, in both case, when PSU is good, they are a top 10, an not a 1op 15 program for that year. So, CJF is not quite there, but not too far off the mark.
Edit: CJF had to deal with sanctions, JVP had to deal with Richard Millhouse Nixon.
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I always thought .500 was "mediocre."
My goal was always a "c." It was IMO, the gentlemanly way to behave. Not holding anyone up nor stomping anyone down.
As for those who want PSU football excellence....please reference PSU all time 129 year winning percentage. About 68-69%.
If you want 11-1...10-2 every single year....aren't you rooting for the wrong team?
It's okay to have dreams....but not to be a dreamer.
With regard to the Top 10 finishes, Joe finished in the Top-10 20 times in 45 years. That is a 44% batting average. Assuming CJF carries the team to a top 10 finish this year, he will have taken PSU to the Top-10 4 times in 9 years - also a 44% batting average.
Joe won the Big Ten 3 out of 18 years - a 16.7% rate. CJF has won one time in 9 years - an 11.1 % rate.
Outside of being in the top 10, Joe was in the top 12 only 2 times. CJF has not been in the top 12 when he is not in the top 10.
Granted, it's difficult to compare the two eras equally, but I don't think CJF is all that far off the mark from Joe, after being here for 9 years. Behind in Big Ten Championships and non Top Ten/inside Top 12 finishes. But, in both case, when PSU is good, they are a top 10, an not a 1op 15 program for that year. So, CJF is not quite there, but not too far off the mark.
Edit: CJF had to deal with sanctions, JVP had to deal with Richard Millhouse Nixon.
Under today's format Joe likely plays for at least four more National Championships ('68, '69, '73, '94). Good chance Joe wins a National Championship less than four years after becoming HC.
I am working on my Thoughts from the Couch post for the 2022 season and beyond, and your statement about winning NC within four years is part of the research I am doing. I thought your comment was very intersting and deserved some investigation.
Joe may have won an NC if it was not for Tricky Dick.
I did the research since 2000 - https://www.on3.com/boards/threads/thoughts-from-the-couch….730348/page-4#post-11788550
National Championship Teams since 2000 - and number of years the HC took to win it (first time winners in bold):
2000 - Oklahoma, Bob Stoops - 2
2001 - Miami, FL, Larry Coker - 1
2002 - Ohio State, Jim Tressel - 2
2003 - LSU, Nick Saban - 4, USC, Pete Carroll - 3
2004 - USC, Pete Carroll - 4
2005 - Texas, Mack Brown - 8
2006 - Florida, Urban Meyer - 2
2007 - LSU, Les Miles - 3
2008 - Florida, Urban Meyer - 4
2009 - Alabama, Nick Saban - 3
2010 - Auburn, Gene Chizik - 2
2011 - Alabama, Nick Saban - 5
2012 - Alabama, Nick Saban - 6
2013 - Florida State, Jimbo Fisher - 4
2014 - Ohio State, Urban Meyer - 3
2015 - Alabama, Nick Saban - 9
2016 - Clemson, Dabo Swinney - 8
2017 - Alabama, Nick Saban - 11
2018 - Clemson, Dabo Swinney - 10
2019 - LSU, Ed Orgeron - 3
2020 - Alabama, Nick Saban - 14
2021 - Georgia, Kirby Smart - 6
Average time to win a first National Championship is about 3.6 years. All power five conferences represented. Seems like if you don't win one early, you won't.
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Ok you want to have this discussion now. Your original premise was that if it does not happen within four years of a coaching change, then it won't happen. I said it was a statisitcal outlier relative to all of the coaching changes that happened since 2000.
Edit - And I think you said that was justification to change coaches every four years. Which I disagree with.
I mean, we're both right, but you're changing my thesis which is that if you are going to win a NC, it is likely to happen in the first four years. Your counter is, 'Other teams have changed coaches and not won NCs within four years.' Both true. I am not saying, but which you are implying, is that a coaching change guarantees a National Championship. It doesn't. But, you're not disproving my point - you're simply pointing out that other coaching changes happen, which is true. Also true that winning a NC, by it's nature (since only one team can win a year) is a statistical outlier. I also later qualified that this 'four year window' is limited to about two dozen teams who realistically have a chance at winning a NC. Even then, a coaching change doesn't guarantee a NC.
Additionally, I do think this is part of the reason you see teams willing to fire coaches mid-season and after only a few years. With the portal, NIL, and upcoming playoff changes, I have no idea how this will go. But, Riley and USC could get in the CFP and win it all in one year (thanks to NIL and the portal). So, who knows if past precedent will hold, but my guess is it will. Ryan Day is at that point now....
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1 Big Ten title in JoePa's first 12 years in the conference. Buncha 2-3 loss seasons in there, that would have present day "demanders of excellence" jabbering that those seasons are unworthy of PSU's lofty standards ... and then a buncha actually awful seasons which would have present day "demanders of excellence" grabbing pitchforks.
I think we all define "mediocrity" differently. Is a 10-2 season now mediocre? I think not. Is it excellent? Nope, not that either. A mediocre season for me is around 8-4. Once we hit 10 wins, I think we move into "good" territory, somewhere in between the two.This felt like a legitimate topic. We have some folks here critical of this year‘s performance by PSU because they DEMAND. EXCELLENCE.
And yes, I am satisfied with "good" seasons every year. But I'm not entirely satisfied with paying coaching salaries on par with excellence, when we're only good.
The good news is that with each passing B1G hire, Franklin becomes more of a bargain…
I have a pole for youThis felt like a legitimate topic. We have some folks here critical of this year‘s performance by PSU because they DEMAND. EXCELLENCE.
And just think, they tried to tell you Wal-Mart greeter wasn't a smart career path. You showed them!
If you were excellent, you would have retired at age 45. And been able to speak English. This mediocrity will not be tolerated.
Everyone should be free to "demand" what they wish. The only problem occurs when they think it matters.
A prescription for Viagra would be cheaper. Stop grasping for validation. Now resume whining about a 10-2 season.Test driving this Saturday
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