Tennessee punches back

18IsTheMan

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This is all just necessary. The NCAA had to try doing something...anything...to try controlling NIL. And that necessitates the schools pushing back to officially remove all restraints entirely, which is where all of this inevitably heading. It's only a matter of when it happens. Might as well do it like taking off a bandaid and get it over with.
 

KingWard

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This is all just necessary. The NCAA had to try doing something...anything...to try controlling NIL. And that necessitates the schools pushing back to officially remove all restraints entirely, which is where all of this inevitably heading. It's only a matter of when it happens. Might as well do it like taking off a bandaid and get it over with.
I see no good outcome that does not involve a national solution. Even that will not necessarily be good, but at least it will be definitive.
 
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18IsTheMan

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I see no good outcome that does not involve a national solution. Even that will not necessarily be good, but at least it will be definitive.

Right. I'm not a fan of where it is heading, but if it must be done. do it quickly.
 

Prestonyte

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This is all just necessary. The NCAA had to try doing something...anything...to try controlling NIL. And that necessitates the schools pushing back to officially remove all restraints entirely, which is where all of this inevitably heading. It's only a matter of when it happens. Might as well do it like taking off a bandaid and get it over with.
The sooner they do the trans surgery, the sooner they can attempt the reversal surgery is my medical analogy.
 

Harvard Gamecock

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NCAA abdicated their responsibility and the opportunity to lead. All of this is downstream due to their childish entitlement while in power and their naked cowardice once they lost control.
 

Atlanta_Cock

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NCAA abdicated their responsibility and the opportunity to lead. All of this is downstream due to their childish entitlement while in power and their naked cowardice once they lost control.
Disagree. This is all inevitable. Starting with Curt Flood. I'm certainly no NCAA apologist, but they've been outmanned for as long as I've been around. They were destined to fail.

If you want to cast blame - ESPN.
 

Harvard Gamecock

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Disagree. This is all inevitable. Starting with Curt Flood. I'm certainly no NCAA apologist, but they've been outmanned for as long as I've been around. They were destined to fail.

If you want to cast blame - ESPN.
Apples to Oranges. Curt Flood was a one professional athlete, who challenged an existing reserve clause rule which led to free agency.
The NCAA is a governing board that is a membership organization which is supposed to govern its existing members. It's lack of leadership on this issue and on the portal is denied by no one, from fans to D1 coaches.
 
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Deleted11512

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Disagree. This is all inevitable. Starting with Curt Flood. I'm certainly no NCAA apologist, but they've been outmanned for as long as I've been around. They were destined to fail.

If you want to cast blame - ESPN.
Why does anyone have to be to blame. If you REALLY want to blame anything blame capitalism. ESPN saw a market they can make money in. The schools saw an opportunity to make money. Now the players are taking an opportunity to make money. Free market capitalism started all of this. Which I’m 100% ok with. The chaotic nature of it lays at the feet of the NCAA/member institutions.
 
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Atlanta_Cock

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Apples to Oranges. Curt Flood was a one professional athlete, who challenged an existing reserve clause rule which led to free agency.
The NCAA is a governing board that is a membership organization which is supposed to govern its existing members. It's lack of leadership on this issue and on the portal is denied by no one, from fans to D1 coaches.
I understand the difference. But it was inevitable the process would filter its way down to "amateur" sports.
 
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18IsTheMan

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The issue I've had all along with this stuff from the very outset is this: participation in college football is not compulsory. Every player in college football volunteered to play. Nobody is forced to play. Sure, if they want to make it to the NFL, they have to play college football, but that's their choice. Nobody was ever conned into playing college football.
 
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Prestonyte

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The issue I've had all along with this stuff from the very outset is this: participation in college football is not compulsory. Every player in college football volunteered to play. Nobody is forced to play. Sure, if they want to make it to the NFL, they have to play college football, but that's their choice. Nobody was ever conned into playing college football.
And the carrot used to be a free education. lol
 

Deleted11512

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The issue I've had all along with this stuff from the very outset is this: participation in college football is not compulsory. Every player in college football volunteered to play. Nobody is forced to play. Sure, if they want to make it to the NFL, they have to play college football, but that's their choice. Nobody was ever conned into playing college football.
What does that have to do with anything? TV changed the game. You want to go back to no games televised, no NCAA video games, no athletic advertisement of any kind? Fine. That will end it.
 
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18IsTheMan

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What does that have to do with anything? TV changed the game. You want to go back to no games televised, no NCAA video games, no athletic advertisement of any kind? Fine. That will end it.

It has everything to do with everything.

Players voluntarily chose to participate in college football. Then the b*tching and moaning started because they didn't like the rules. Well, if you don't like the rules, do something else with your life. Nobody was forcing anyone to go out there and play college football.

100% opposed to situations where people voluntarily choose to participate in something and then want the rules changed to suit them.
 

Prestonyte

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And that was a mighty big carrot. The opportunity to go to college and graduate 100% debt free. What a fantastic start in life.
Totally agree. But greed crept in and the opportunity to job hunt with a free education after football was not enough.
Now they want to start off wealthy.
 
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18IsTheMan

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Totally agree. But greed crept in and the opportunity to job hunt with a free education after football was not enough.
Now they want to start off wealthy.
Certainly many factors involved. The flood of money into the game obviously triggered most of the problems. Nevertheless, I come back to "if you think the system is unfair, then choose not to participate." It's an extracurricular activity. Not mandatory and not necessary.
 
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Deleted11512

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It has everything to do with everything.

Players voluntarily chose to participate in college football. Then the b*tching and moaning started because they didn't like the rules. Well, if you don't like the rules, do something else with your life. Nobody was forcing anyone to go out there and play college football.

100% opposed to situations where people voluntarily choose to participate in something and then want the rules changed to suit them.
That's laughable, and not based on reality.
 

Deleted11512

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Totally agree. But greed crept in and the opportunity to job hunt with a free education after football was not enough.
Now they want to start off wealthy.
Just so we're all on the same page...EVERYONE in the whole supply chain of CFB should get to profit off of it EXCEPT the ones actually producing the results? Spare me the college degree nonsense. These are not real students. Made up majors just to satisfy a requirement, lowered admission standards than the rest of the student population, tremendous access to academic resources nobody else has access to. It's a farce. I know a guy that used to be the HC of a D1 program. I was talking to him before a game and one of his players walks in and they start talking about school work. Guy walks out and my buddy says "your 10 year old daughter can read and write better than him". I laughed, he said "I'm not kidding. The fact that he's even here is a joke."

Those guys are there for a reason...make money for the university.
 

Deleted11512

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Alright, then, So if you're exercising your free will to participate, knowing full well the parameters of the system, then shut your mouth and play ball.
Did anyone force the universities to have football programs? Anyone putting a gun to the heads of those presidents? Who forced the presidents of those universities to monetize their football programs? Nobody did. They should have just shut their mouths and kept athletics amateur. THEY changed the game, not the players.
 

18IsTheMan

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Did anyone force the universities to have football programs? Anyone putting a gun to the heads of those presidents? Who forced the presidents of those universities to monetize their football programs? Nobody did. They should have just shut their mouths and kept athletics amateur. THEY changed the game, not the players.

That's irrelevant. It is offered as a voluntary activity. So long as participation was 100% voluntary, the participants have zero right to complain.

It would be like someone putting together a book-mobile, at their cost, to come to your neighborhood and drive around let kids buy books, or not buy books, depending on their preference. Then kids complaining that this free thing that has been offered to them doesn't have the books they want and demanding change.
 

18IsTheMan

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Did anyone force the universities to have football programs? Anyone putting a gun to the heads of those presidents? Who forced the presidents of those universities to monetize their football programs? Nobody did. They should have just shut their mouths and kept athletics amateur. THEY changed the game, not the players.

Do you believe if players deserve their "fair share" of the pie, whatever that is, then they also deserve to shoulder their fair share of the financial risk?
 

Deleted11512

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Do you believe if players deserve their "fair share" of the pie, whatever that is, then they also deserve to shoulder their fair share of the financial risk?
Sure. And that will be figured out by either the individual institutions or some governing body. The players aren’t just going to get 100% of the revenue.
 

18IsTheMan

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Sure. And that will be figured out by either the individual institutions or some governing body. The players aren’t just going to get 100% of the revenue.

Interesting. I have yet to see anyone proposing that players also incur financial risk.
 

Deleted11512

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Interesting. I have yet to see anyone proposing that players also incur financial risk.
You've also not seen anyone suggesting that 100% of the money coming in should be given to athletes. But like any other pay structure, they will be set such that the company (Ie, athletic department) can still have enough left over to pay operating expenses and risk mitigation.
 

18IsTheMan

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You've also not seen anyone suggesting that 100% of the money coming in should be given to athletes. But like any other pay structure, they will be set such that the company (Ie, athletic department) can still have enough left over to pay operating expenses and risk mitigation.

That's not what I'm referring to. That's not risk.
 

Lurker123

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Risk aside, how many athletic departments operate with enough black ink to pay players a significant amount?

Meaning, I think we'd see cuts in other areas to make up for diverting money to players. Whether it's the right choice or not.
 

Deleted11512

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Risk aside, how many athletic departments operate with enough black ink to pay players a significant amount?

Meaning, I think we'd see cuts in other areas to make up for diverting money to players. Whether it's the right choice or not.
They spend whatever is available to spend. If they had $1 billion, they'd spend $1 billion. My guess is the nonsensical facility builds would go away. You'd stop seeing coordinators making $2M/yr. You wouldn't see anybody paying a coach $75M to walk away. Sorry Dawn, but coaches of non revenue generating sports would drop dramatically. That's where it's going to get interesting. A lot of coaches have been pro NIL. Lets see what they think when they have to take cuts to fund it.
 
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USC2USC

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It has everything to do with everything.

Players voluntarily chose to participate in college football. Then the b*tching and moaning started because they didn't like the rules. Well, if you don't like the rules, do something else with your life. Nobody was forcing anyone to go out there and play college football.

100% opposed to situations where people voluntarily choose to participate in something and then want the rules changed to suit them.
So based on your post, if an athlete ends up in a scenario where he/she is totally being exploited for others to make hundreds of millions of dollars and keep it all for themselves, he/she should just shut up because they can grab their lunch in the dining hall for free.
 

Prestonyte

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So based on your post, if an athlete ends up in a scenario where he/she is totally being exploited for others to make hundreds of millions of dollars and keep it all for themselves, he/she should just shut up because they can grab their lunch in the dining hall for free.
They've always gotten a lot more than a ''free lunch''. A $30,000 - $100,000 college degree, room and board, medical care and the audition for the pros used to be enough. Now, getting an education has no value.
 

USC2USC

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They've always gotten a lot more than a ''free lunch''. A $30,000 - $100,000 college degree, room and board, medical care and the audition for the pros used to be enough. Now, getting an education has no value.
1. Athletes arent the only students on college campuses on scholarship......even full scholarship.
2. The NCAA produces well over $1 billion (yes with a B) in revenue each year. Conferences get lots, schools get lots, coaches get lots, athletes get zero.
 

Deleted11512

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They've always gotten a lot more than a ''free lunch''. A $30,000 - $100,000 college degree, room and board, medical care and the audition for the pros used to be enough. Now, getting an education has no value.
If we wanted them to be amateurs the presidents of the universities should have told the networks to pound sand when they wanted to televise them. There's nothing about this current setup that is amateur....except what the NCAA keeps saying so their members can keep pocketing all the money. But just bc they say it doesn't make it true. You got coaches making $10M/yr, with some even having housing taken care of, an expense account, car, etc...We built an indoor training facility bc everyone else is doing it. Football only ops building with necessities such as a barber shop and recording studio. It's ridiculous how much money these athletic departments are just lighting on fire. Marty Byrde would have a field day in that setup!!
 

Deleted11512

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1. Athletes arent the only students on college campuses on scholarship......even full scholarship.
2. The NCAA produces well over $1 billion (yes with a B) in revenue each year. Conferences get lots, schools get lots, coaches get lots, athletes get zero.
The crazy part is the majority of that $1B comes from television rights for March Madness. I believe they bring in $900M annually for that. And it's disbursed to the member universities. What other 2 week long amateur event draws a price tag of $900M to televise?
 

Prestonyte

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1. Athletes arent the only students on college campuses on scholarship......even full scholarship.
2. The NCAA produces well over $1 billion (yes with a B) in revenue each year. Conferences get lots, schools get lots, coaches get lots, athletes get zero.
1. That's why there are athletic scholarships and academic scholarships
2. A $30,000 - $100,000 college degree, room and board, medical care, etc. is not zero
 

Deleted11512

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1. That's why there are athletic scholarships and academic scholarships
2. A $30,000 - $100,000 college degree, room and board, medical care, etc. is not zero
But it's been that way forever. What hasn't been this way forever is the ridiculous increase in money flowing through these ADs. HBC got a raise and extension to $4M in 2014. At that time, it made him one of the top 10 paid coaches in the country. Saban was making $5.4M. Fast forward 10 years, and Saban was making $11.4M and to get into the top 10 club you have to make at least $9M. If you want to be even more baffled go back to 2005 when HBC was hired making $1.25M/yr.

In 2005 the USC AD brought in $46M. In 2022 it brought in $142M. So everyone else involved gets HUGE raises and shiny new toys. The players get what they've always gotten....education, meals, and a dorm.
 
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