Thunder & Lightning: What Happens If Mississippi State Retains Coleman Hutzler?

[bulldoghair]

Yea well everyone serious enough to buy really good players has money, so they get to decide between a guy who doesn't know what he's doing at a school that has money or a guy that does know what he's doing that has money.

So you’re saying we are, and can offer, to pay our defensive players and recruited players the same amount of money as everyone else in the SEC?

 

[campshelbydog1116]

So you’re saying we are, and can offer, to pay our defensive players and recruited players the same amount of money as everyone else in the SEC?

I would seriously doubt it. You're the one insinuating we can buy our way out of this hole, which is what my post was about in the first place. Even if we have the same money the kids aren't coming here to play for a bad DC when they can get the same money (or more) elsewhere. Hutzer has absolutely zero % chance of turning this around. ZERO.

 

[Ludus24]

It was 4th down, locking up man was fine there. Squirl was in the wide slot, and Nico made the right read there and squirl made a play. Our big time safety who had 20 tackles did not make the play. Not to mention the guy coming across the middle was wide open for the first down as well. So what wouod you have done there, move smith out of the middle and leave thst lane wide open to run through? The fact is that Tennessee has great players all over the field. Sometimes you have to take chances and hope that your big time guys will make the play. You do realize that don’t you?

I'm fine with the formation but it was the personnel running it that was the problem. I actually looked up the game film just to see exactly who we had out there and it looks like a nickel package with 4 freaking safeties (3 of which lined up on WRs in man!) and 1 cornerback and 1 lb to help underneath (on the weak side!) with another lb rushing the passer. That lineup itself is a fireable offense.

 

[bulldoghair]

I would seriously doubt it. You're the one insinuating we can buy our way out of this hole, which is what my post was about in the first place. Even if we have the same money the kids aren't coming here to play for a bad DC when they can get the same money (or more) elsewhere. Hutzer has absolutely zero % chance of turning this around. ZERO.

Well I disagree. We may agree to disagree on this. Money now changes everything. If we had equal money to spend as Alabama, then yes of course I’d say we would most definitely have better players on defense. That’s a fact. And when you have better players who can make plays all over the field on defense, then you’re just going to have a much better defense. For me it’s not rocket science, and neither is the game of football. Calling a defense, especially with great talent all over the field is not rocket science.

 

[campshelbydog1116]

Well I disagree. We may agree to disagree on this. Money now changes everything. If we had equal money to spend as Alabama, then yes of course I’d say we would most definitely have better players on defense. That’s a fact. And when you have better players who can make plays all over the field on defense, then you’re just going to have a much better defense. For me it’s not rocket science, and neither is the game of football. Calling a defense, especially with great talent all over the field is not rocket science.

We had money to spend last year and could not spend it because people did not want to play for Coleman Hutzler due to his lack of resume. That's a fact. The guy that runs our collective said it on his podcast. Fielding the 125th ranked defense in the country did nothing to make that change. The proof is in this year's high school class and it will again be shown in this year's portal class if he is retained. I wish I was wrong, but unfortunately I'm not and you are not living in reality.

 

[patdog]

We had money to spend last year and could not spend it because people did not want to play for Coleman Hutzler due to his lack of resume. That's a fact. The guy that runs our collective said it on his podcast. Fielding the 125th ranked defense in the country did nothing to make that change. The proof is in this year's high school class and it will again be shown in this year's portal class if he is retained. I wish I was wrong, but unfortunately I'm not and you are not living in reality.

Then Hutzler and Lebby should both be fired immediately.

 

[bulldoghair]

I'm fine with the formation but it was the personnel running it that was the problem. I actually looked up the game film just to see exactly who we had out there and it looks like a nickel package with 4 freaking safeties (3 of which lined up on WRs in man!) and 1 cornerback and 1 lb to help underneath (on the weak side!) with another lb rushing the passer. That lineup itself is a fireable offense.

Lol no we didn’t. Your analysis and description is not correct at all. Very simply, we had a five man rush, got no pressure btw, and ran 0 coverage. Everyone had a man. Nico made the read, the squirl made a play. Nothing wrong with the line up. So if you disagree, based on our roster, who all specifically would you have not had in there, and who would you have substituted?

 

[bulldoghair]

We had money to spend last year and could not spend it because people did not want to play for Coleman Hutzler due to his lack of resume. That's a fact. The guy that runs our collective said it on his podcast. Fielding the 125th ranked defense in the country did nothing to make that change. The proof is in this year's high school class and it will again be shown in this year's portal class if he is retained. I wish I was wrong, but unfortunately I'm not and you are not living in reality.

Send a link and specific time moment where this guy that runs the collective said this.

 

[bulldoghair]

Then Hutzler and Lebby should both be fired immediately.

This sounds retarded. We got money to spend and can’t even find anyone to spend it on ha. All because Hutzler bad. Reminds me of the Trump bad crowd. No matter what the problem is, the answer is is just trump bad. If this were true, then absolutely no questions asked Lebby would be fired. But he’s not. Showtime is still alive, with millions just sitting there in the NIL collective. Can’t even give it away

 

[Ludus24]

Lol no we didn’t. Your analysis and description is not correct at all. Very simply, we had a five man rush, got no pressure btw, and ran 0 coverage. Everyone had a man. Nico made the read, the squirl made a play. Nothing wrong with the line up. So if you disagree, based on our roster, who all specifically would you have not had in there, and who would you have substituted?

It is entirely correct. Look at this picture. We have Lanier #3 (a safety) at the bottom, then Ellington #10 (a safety) next to him, then Mitchel #40 ( a linebacker) covering the underneath next to him, 4 down lineman with a LB standing, then Smith #2 (a safety) in the slot, the free safty on the right hash and then finally Pollack #14 ( cornerback) at the top. We would have been beaten multiple different ways in this lineup. I would have subsituded #2, and #10 with actual cornerbacks that can handle speed better, doesn't really matter who, and then move Mitchel closer to the right hash to cover the underneath for the RB with Lanier on #0 since that is a TE. Instead we where completely mismatched in every single way except for Pollack at the top. This is why Hutzler should not be employed as a DC.

 

[maroonmania]

There was a 30 second segment where Robbie talked about how he wasn’t convinced that Hutzler would never be a good DC, and I’m sure it wasn’t intentional, but the whole thing was depressing.

His point was that he thinks Hutzler can learn some things along the way and find ways to get better, but I guess I still just can’t believe that Lebby thought that hiring a ST coach would be best for the program. A drooling toddler might be president one day, but that kid isn’t going to be able to help you around the house today, and we needed a DC that was ready to hit the ground running from day 1

Yep, this is 100% on Lebby. This season was wrecked the day Hutzler was hired as DC. I didn't understand it then and understand it even less today. There are all manner of G5 DCs with experience that would love to have had our job but apparently Lebby just went with a guy he had a friendship with. No, with our personnel, we were never going to win a lot of SEC games but had our team been more prepared and better coached there was no reason we couldn't have won the ASU or Troy games. And had we started off 3-0 then the Florida game is totally different. We got almost nothing out of the portal on defense because no players have a clue about Hutzler. I mean we are trying to get guys to come play for a Special Teams coach from Bama while OM can say they have the actual Bama DC they stole away from Saban. We are bringing a knife to a gun fight trying to recruit SEC caliber defensive players with Hutzler running things. And all I needed to see was Arizona State run over our 3 man front for 3 straight quarters with no adjustments to realize Hutzler was in over his head. I mean we already have a guy in his first year of being a HC, let's just make the situation worse by letting our DC try to learn on the job as well. I mean that's always a recipe for success in the SEC right?

 

[bulldoghair]

It is entirely correct. Look at this picture. We have Lanier #3 (a safety) at the bottom, then Ellington #10 (a safety) next to him, then Mitchel #40 ( a linebacker) covering the underneath next to him, 4 down lineman with a LB standing, then Smith #2 (a safety) in the slot, the free safty on the right hash and then finally Pollack #14 ( cornerback) at the top. We would have been beaten multiple different ways in this lineup. I would have subsituded #2, and #10 with actual cornerbacks that can handle speed better, doesn't really matter who, and then move Mitchel closer to the right hash to cover the underneath for the RB with Lanier on #0 since that is a TE. Instead we where completely mismatched in every single way except for Pollack at the top. This is why Hutzler should not be employed as a DC.

That is good specific analysis. But I would disagree. I personally would most definitely not take out my senior in Ellington on 4th down for some random back up cornerback. And to me it would end even more asinine to take out your best player on 4th down who’s had a great game in Smith, for yet again some random back up cornerback.

 

[Ludus24]

That is good specific analysis. But I would disagree. I personally would most definitely not take out my senior in Ellington on 4th down for some random back up cornerback. And to me it would end even more asinine to take out your best player on 4th down who’s had a great game in Smith, for yet again some random back up cornerback.

I fully agree that Smith is one of our best player on defense but its about making favorable matchups. Smiths strength is not coverage, its tackling. IF we wanted to keep Smith in he HAS to go on #0 the TE and I'm keeping Lanier in because he played CB before and we regularly use him as a CB due to injury/depth. Pollack would stay and then get Brumfield or Rhaydarious Jones in to cover the third guy. Lanier likely still gets beat by Squirrel White but at least they would be properly positioned.

 

[Rezdog]

We don’t have many sec level players and Hutzler is 100 % not fine and is not going to be able to recruit out of the talent issue because players know he doesn’t have a clue as to what he’s doing.

If we keep Hutz, just bulldoze DW and build pickle ball courts.

 

[campshelbydog1116]

Send a link and specific time moment where this guy that runs the collective said this.

No, im Not going back and listening to 100 episodes of the out of left field podcast to prove to you what I heard Charlie Winfield say on his podcast regarding our defensive staff not being able to close on prospects and it not being about money. I know he said it. Heard it with my own 2 ears. You can choose to live in whatever reality floats your boat.

 

[aTotal360]

 

[thekimmer]

If Hutzler comes back then Lebby should be on the hot seat because he is the HEAD coach. Lebby is responsible for the performance of the entire team not just the offense so failure in any part of the program reflects on him. Outside of a mass casualty disaster like a plane crash or something, there is no excuse whatsoever for a defense this historically bad at an SEC program . For that reason, it is incumbent on Jeff Lebby as head coach to intervene and fix it. If he fails to do so then his neck has to be on the chopping block.