Agree with all of this except one part - Russia being the second strongest military. The US military believes China is #2 and Russian is #3 and this is based on the inability of Russia to carry out a long, drawn out conflict due to limitations of their economy. Having said that, you're correct that they would wipe up Ukraine. Urkaine would be nothing more than a light snack for them.
WW III. Biden sending troops to Ukraine Border
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Agree with all of this except one part - Russia being the second strongest military. The US military believes China is #2 and Russian is #3 and this is based on the inability of Russia to carry out a long, drawn out conflict due to limitations of their economy. Having said that, you're correct that they would wipe up Ukraine. Urkaine would be nothing more than a light snack for them.
Too late for that, obviously with the misinformation spewed here.
Imagine if p45 was in charge, we would be learning Russian now.
Imagine if p45 was in charge, we would be learning Russian now.
In 1990 Iraq was reported to have one of the largest standing armies in the world. Having numbers is one thing but how well trained, equipped, motivated and organized they are is more important.
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LOL I literally did not know this.Seriously this is all in the " I don't give a ****." File.
Fair point about the economies, but I give Russia an advantage in experience and nuclear capabilities... Not just warheads, but the nuclear subs. Those 17ers can park anywhere off the coast and chill for months if needed vs China's diesel subs that have come up to refuel.
Probably a bias from living on a Navy base in the North Atlantic in the early 80's doing duck and cover drills every week at school. Then in 86' Tom Clancy comes out with Red Storm Rising and my base was the first ones the Russians took. 17ers.**
Probably a bias from living on a Navy base in the North Atlantic in the early 80's doing duck and cover drills every week at school. Then in 86' Tom Clancy comes out with Red Storm Rising and my base was the first ones the Russians took. 17ers.**
So we're all honest here
How about everyone in this fight state what the appropriate responses and outcomes would be so we can be objective later to determine if he 17's it up or not.
I'll go first: I don't know what the best answer is. There are no good ones.
How about everyone in this fight state what the appropriate responses and outcomes would be so we can be objective later to determine if he 17's it up or not.
I'll go first: I don't know what the best answer is. There are no good ones.
death, taxes, dorn simping for some lib despite all the evidence to the contrary
what are things that are inevitable alex?
I can tell you what the best answer isn’t.
You don’t continually give up power or play scared to your opponents/enemies.
You can ***** abt trumps Twitter and words all you want but what he was doing with/to China was good for the entire world and it wasn’t terrible to China.
You don’t continually give up power or play scared to your opponents/enemies.
You can ***** abt trumps Twitter and words all you want but what he was doing with/to China was good for the entire world and it wasn’t terrible to China.
Literally nobody did more to create a stronger china than trump, solely by scuttling TPP.
Are we really going to trust that popularity poll? Someone calls your house in Russia, “Do you like Vladimir Putin?” The only answer is yes, right? Unless some of them misunderstood and thought they were asking “Do you like Vladimir pooting?” And they were sick of their husband Vlad’s vodka farts.
Please let them go full column up a road. It will be disaster. You cannot not do that. As a Scout Observer that would give me a giant Bonner. You have to go on line. You negate your advantage if you don't. Also Russian amour carries their full drums on the back of the tank. Unprotected. One WP grenade will take out two tanks. The road would get blocked really fast and I suspect the Ukraine's are not going to just leave the roads open. Have you ever seen our hwy when there's a accident. Imagine a few 45 ton armor. That's a flawed theory. Never count civilians out when their homes are in danger. When attacking a defense you need at least 2-1 in order to be successful. It will not be a cake walk.
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PirateDawg:"I'm more worried about China taking Taiwan than what is going on with the Ukraine."
Serious quesiton: Why are you worried about that? If it happens I suspect it won't affect my life or the lives of almost all Americans in any significant way. America has more pressing problems that affect my life, the lives of my family and friends and the lives of ordinary American citizens. Let China have have it. Why should I really care about this? I'll still buy stuff made in China, American coporations will still make stuff in China and China will be a still major trading partner because our economic and political elites want it to be one. Taiwan isn't Australia. It's a minor country and conquest of minor countries has happened throughout history. I'm not losing sleep over China taking over Hong Kong. My life goes on and I'll watch Super Bowl and go about my daily affairs regardless. I don't want it to happen but I'm not interested in spending a dime or sacrificing the lives of any friends and family to prevent it.
Serious quesiton: Why are you worried about that? If it happens I suspect it won't affect my life or the lives of almost all Americans in any significant way. America has more pressing problems that affect my life, the lives of my family and friends and the lives of ordinary American citizens. Let China have have it. Why should I really care about this? I'll still buy stuff made in China, American coporations will still make stuff in China and China will be a still major trading partner because our economic and political elites want it to be one. Taiwan isn't Australia. It's a minor country and conquest of minor countries has happened throughout history. I'm not losing sleep over China taking over Hong Kong. My life goes on and I'll watch Super Bowl and go about my daily affairs regardless. I don't want it to happen but I'm not interested in spending a dime or sacrificing the lives of any friends and family to prevent it.
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Or maybe the last time there was a major power working to make conquests in Eastern Europe it’s a legitimate comparison.
How do you figure that?
Can you explain your rationale that supports your statement?
Just a fyi, Ukraine is the #4 corn and #5 wheat exporter in the world, and Russia is the #1 wheat exporter (US #1 corn and #3 wheat). It's not good if the two (possibly 3!) of the biggest food exporters get in a shooting war. Also, the Europeans, especially Germany, have become reliant on Russian natural gas, so I wouldn't be surprised if this ends up like Crimea. Europe has too much to lose over Ukraine.
simplistic nonsense that reduces everything to Hitler. It's always 1938 to some people, please get another example, and especially those who think that knowing 4 things about Nazi Germany qualifies them to call others appeasers for not wanting to confront the latest Hitler-of-the-month.
The price of natural gas in Europe is already about 4 times as high as it is in the US. I think the only limitation would be our current capacity to liquify the gas. It has been ramped up quite a bit over the last decade, but I have no idea how much of European demand we could meet right away.
OR North Korea's where you act like you're going to destroy the world then back off when you get whatever it is you really wanted in the first place in "negotiations" for peace.
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For real. We have had some jurisdictions not far off from what they are doing, but I think when it came to actual camps you'd see an armed rebellion in all but the very bluest of locations in the US, and maybe even there.
Yeah the Democrats don't have any ties to foreign policy snafus, Right Bill and Hillary?
I find it quite amusing that they act like they don't have any ties to the military industrial complex and their minions buy it. News Flash! ALL the politicians in Washington have money ties to the military industry.
Are those numbers on Putin's popularity reliable? I would have thought it was costly to advertise negative views of Putin in Russia and everything might be spun positively.
It doesn't work that way for mass troop movement. You clear the path ahead before moving large groups. The Russians would use crippling airstrikes to gain ground and then file in down the roads once it's safe setting up new forward areas until the next stretch is cleared via air, the same way we did in Iraq in 03. Straight up the poop shoot known as MSR Tampa from Kuwait to Baghdad in a couple of weeks. Air superiority cleared the way.
Even without the mud, terrain is way too difficult in the eastern Europe part of the world not to use roads for 95% of the way. Same as it was in WW2. Mountains, trees, rivers, cities, etc. The mud was a problem for the Germans invading Russia because the roads are unpaved and there were no other options. I have to imagine there are tons of paved roads in the Ukraine these days.
The desert of Southern Iraq doesn't have that problem. You guys were able to spread out as far as the horizon could see and drive straight ahead for days I imagine. If Russia invades the Ukraine, they will have to come right down the roads. And the artillery hanging around waiting on them better be dug in as hell considering the size and capabilities of Russia's Air Force... Infrared capable drones can spot a tick on a dog's *** from 50 miles away.**"
To your point, if there was a Desert Storm or WW2 style battle of armor/mech infantry on line in the fields, the muck would be a problem. I don't foresee that ever happening again though in major combat ops. The amount of change in tactics from when I joined in the late 90's to the mid 00's was massive.
Armor and artillery are still very valuable in the broad scope of combat, but I would imagine an artillery battery has a very short life expectancy trying to take on the Russian Air Force.
I don't disagree with what you're overall idea is. This would be the most significant global conflict Since Vietnam or Korea. But if Russia decides to go all in, it would be a rout in the conventional warfare unless NATO steps in. Similar to Desert Storm. Ukraine vs Russia in 2022 is not much different than Iraq vs US in 1991. Now we start talking about insurgency etc, that's a whole other ballgame. You can't win that **** for decades.
Even without the mud, terrain is way too difficult in the eastern Europe part of the world not to use roads for 95% of the way. Same as it was in WW2. Mountains, trees, rivers, cities, etc. The mud was a problem for the Germans invading Russia because the roads are unpaved and there were no other options. I have to imagine there are tons of paved roads in the Ukraine these days.
The desert of Southern Iraq doesn't have that problem. You guys were able to spread out as far as the horizon could see and drive straight ahead for days I imagine. If Russia invades the Ukraine, they will have to come right down the roads. And the artillery hanging around waiting on them better be dug in as hell considering the size and capabilities of Russia's Air Force... Infrared capable drones can spot a tick on a dog's *** from 50 miles away.**"
To your point, if there was a Desert Storm or WW2 style battle of armor/mech infantry on line in the fields, the muck would be a problem. I don't foresee that ever happening again though in major combat ops. The amount of change in tactics from when I joined in the late 90's to the mid 00's was massive.
Armor and artillery are still very valuable in the broad scope of combat, but I would imagine an artillery battery has a very short life expectancy trying to take on the Russian Air Force.
I don't disagree with what you're overall idea is. This would be the most significant global conflict Since Vietnam or Korea. But if Russia decides to go all in, it would be a rout in the conventional warfare unless NATO steps in. Similar to Desert Storm. Ukraine vs Russia in 2022 is not much different than Iraq vs US in 1991. Now we start talking about insurgency etc, that's a whole other ballgame. You can't win that **** for decades.
Bush Sr was running that show tho. Bush Sr was running the Reagan Presidency for the most part, at least the clandestine part of it. Who was Gov of Arky then, what was happening out of Mena, Ark, and how does that tie back to Bush Sr?
Ultimately, All Roads Lead to Rome and 2 Go Out ... One to London and one to Jerusalem. Ponder on that one.
Is this really significant? The United States has had..
quite a number of troops in eastern Europe since the end of WW2.
quite a number of troops in eastern Europe since the end of WW2.
I dunno honestly, but this paper seems to conclude it's fairly accurate. I don't know how scared the people are of him as unlike other dictators he doesn't poison the masses, just political rivals.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/1060586X.2016.1144334
If he's popular it makes sense for several reasons.
A. He controls the media narrative and always makes himself look good.
B. The standards of living in Russia today are light years better than 25 years ago... when Putin rose to power. We know it's because of western trade and capitalism taking root and growing since the late 80's the same as China, but none the less, life has been much better under Putin than before him.
C. He shows strength. The fall of the Soviet Union was probably devastating to the morale of the people. They were defeated and losing sucks. They were pour and tough for a long time. After the fall of the Soviet Union, they were just pour. Based on points A and B, and with all of his geopolitcal maneuvering, he has them feeling like winners more than they have in 50 years I would guess.
This isn't Jeopardy but we will give you a prize. I can ignore you just like you can ignore me.
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