Plane crash in DC

Status
Not open for further replies.

UpTheMiddlex3Punt

Well-known member
May 28, 2007
17,321
2,655
113
Transcript of ATC:


From the mega thread (not my work)

Update 3: My original audio was from DCA freq. Now added additional dialogue from DCA/KJPN

Update 2: adding dialogue from the UHF tapes.

UPDATE: I'm being informed PAT25 responds on UHF. The tape transcribed is VHF recording

Blue Streak 5342 is the CRJ. Pat 25 is the helo

4 mins prior to crash: "Tower, Blue Streak 5342 on Mount Vernon Visual Runway 1"

"Blue Streak 5342, Washington Tower, winds are 320/17G25 can you take Runway 33?"

30 sec pause

"Yeah we can do Runway 33 for Bluestreak 5342"

"Bluestreak 5342 (unclear) bridge make the turn for 33, cleared to land 33"

"Change to Runway 33, cleared to land 33 bluestreak 5342"

Other traffic being handled to Runway 1.

Approx 2.5 mins to crash:

Pat25: "PAT25 memorial."

Tower: Pat25 rodger.

Approx 1:20 till crash:

Tower: "PAT25 traffic just south of (unclear) bridge is a CRJ at 1,200ft turning for Runway 33"

PAT25: PAT25 has the Traffic in sight, request visual separation

Tower: Visual separation approved.

Tower: "American 1631 winds are (unclear) no delay, traffic on 3 mile final for Runway 33 cleared for immediate takeoff"

"Cleared for takeoff, AA1631"

Approximately 10 seconds prior to collision

Tower: "PAT25 do you have the CRJ in sight?"

Tower: "PAT25 (unclear maybe pass behind) CRJ"

Pat25: Affirm. Pat 25 has traffic in sight request visual separation.

Tower: Separation.

15 seconds later

"Tower, AA472 (unclear)"

"American 472 washington tower" alarms going off "Oooh!" "Oh my god!" *click

15 seconds later

"Tower, did you see that?"

Tower frantically begins commanding go arounds and deconfliction.
A simple "you're heading right for the CRJ, turn the 17 around right now" would have been better than "do you see the plane you're about to hit?"
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
This is a different message than NBC posted earlier. They were saying 4 rescued, but who knows what’s right/wrong. This is tragic.
The report said 4 people were pulled from the water. That normally means alive. Hopefully the earlier report is correct.
 

UpTheMiddlex3Punt

Well-known member
May 28, 2007
17,321
2,655
113
Help me out. What does “request visual separation” mean.
Doesn't sound like it means anything. It's also highly likely they were looking at a different plane and thought "oh yeah, plenty of space". It doesn't look like ATC ever gave them a specific direction to the plane. Just a reference to (unclear) bridge.

It definitely looks like ATC dropped the ball here.
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
18 bodies so far. That video of the crash did not lead to Optimism.
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
Watching something live now, the expert was asked what happened, he said a mistake. That is obvious. He said, WHAT mistake will take time to unwind.
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
The same broadcast said we haven’t had a major crash in the US since 2009. If so that’s amazing, especially to those of us that grew up in the 70s. They also said the DC hospitals report no patients from the crash.
 

UpTheMiddlex3Punt

Well-known member
May 28, 2007
17,321
2,655
113
This seems plausible. The "as a pilot" reply.


Why didn't ATC say "you are getting really close to the CRJ and appear to be headed right for it"? That let's them know what's happening moreso than "do you see it?" The helicopter clearly had poor situational awareness and the tower's question didn't do anything to alleviate it.
 

jethreauxdawg

Well-known member
Dec 20, 2010
8,870
8,729
113
and you'll have a lot of focus on bringing back highly qualified individuals to the profession.
Have they not been focused on hiring highly qualified individuals before? I thought requirements for being an air traffic controller were pretty high.
 

Walkthedawg

Well-known member
Oct 3, 2022
586
1,053
93
Just flipping through the news channels. According to I guess a source the ATC told them to come across following the CRJ and that there were two CRJs back to back and that they may have been looking at the wrong plane. Idk

That seems like a really bad error that I don’t know if I believe
Never been around anyone in ATC, but how in the crap could you let any traffic across the airspace of incoming aircraft? Transponder on or off on the helo, it’s bleeping pretty brightly on radar. And there are no collision warnings on the radar system?
 

DerHntr

Well-known member
Sep 18, 2007
15,296
1,317
113
Several members of the US Figure Skating team and coaches were on the flight, along with some Russian Olympians.


"U.S. Figure Skating can confirm that several members of our skating community were sadly aboard American Airlines Flight 5342, which collided with a helicopter yesterday evening in Washington, D.C.," the organization said. "These athletes, coaches, and family members were returning home from the National Development Camp held in conjunction with the U.S. Figure Skating Championships in Wichita, Kansas.”
 

Xenomorph

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2007
13,913
5,197
113
Several members of the US Figure Skating team and coaches were on the flight, along with some Russian Olympians.


"U.S. Figure Skating can confirm that several members of our skating community were sadly aboard American Airlines Flight 5342, which collided with a helicopter yesterday evening in Washington, D.C.," the organization said. "These athletes, coaches, and family members were returning home from the National Development Camp held in conjunction with the U.S. Figure Skating Championships in Wichita, Kansas.”
Absolutely awful…
 

jethreauxdawg

Well-known member
Dec 20, 2010
8,870
8,729
113
Several members of the US Figure Skating team and coaches were on the flight, along with some Russian Olympians.


"U.S. Figure Skating can confirm that several members of our skating community were sadly aboard American Airlines Flight 5342, which collided with a helicopter yesterday evening in Washington, D.C.," the organization said. "These athletes, coaches, and family members were returning home from the National Development Camp held in conjunction with the U.S. Figure Skating Championships in Wichita, Kansas.”
Tanya Harding working in ATC?
 

Xenomorph

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2007
13,913
5,197
113
Several members of the US Figure Skating team and coaches were on the flight, along with some Russian Olympians.


"U.S. Figure Skating can confirm that several members of our skating community were sadly aboard American Airlines Flight 5342, which collided with a helicopter yesterday evening in Washington, D.C.," the organization said. "These athletes, coaches, and family members were returning home from the National Development Camp held in conjunction with the U.S. Figure Skating Championships in Wichita, Kansas.”
I don’t do Instagram but spencerskates26 is one of the kids on board who was posting prior to takeoff. …..that’s tough, man..
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
Have they not been focused on hiring highly qualified individuals before? I thought requirements for being an air traffic controller were pretty high.
I have seen some articles over the last two years that they were struggling to hire good people, same as everyone else.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IBleedMaroonDawg

dorndawg

Well-known member
Sep 10, 2012
7,567
6,322
113
The same broadcast said we haven’t had a major crash in the US since 2009. If so that’s amazing, especially to those of us that grew up in the 70s. They also said the DC hospitals report no patients from the crash.
We haven’t had a major crash of a USA carrier since 2001 (just after 9/11)
 

OG Goat Holder

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2022
9,301
8,635
113
I have seen some articles over the last two years that they were struggling to hire good people, same as everyone else.
There is a shortage, mainly due to the rigorous training. There's a reason the US has the safest airspace system in the world.

There is also a pilot shortage, and has been for many years.

Remember this when the political talk starts. They don't put just anybody in a tower or a cockpit.
 

GloryDawg

Well-known member
Mar 3, 2005
15,596
7,079
113
I suspect this will end up being the US Army fault. I kind of wonder why the Helo even in the air at night over a major US city so close to airport.
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
There is a shortage, mainly due to the rigorous training. There's a reason the US has the safest airspace system in the world.

There is also a pilot shortage, and has been for many years.

Remember this when the political talk starts. They don't put just anybody in a tower or a cockpit.
You don't say.******
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
Then what the 17 are you babbling about, dimwit.
You were stating the obvious. If you know anyone in the business or even pay a little bit of attention to it you already know that. I'm sure you are on the ground in DC to clear things up since you already knew what caused it last night.
 

Curby

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2012
1,169
816
113
Then what the 17 are you babbling about, dimwit.
I don't think you understand the world we live in.

There are crazy people doing crazy things in this day and time.

There is no way you can say with 100% certainly that this was NOT intentional.
 

WilCoDawg

Well-known member
Sep 6, 2012
5,067
3,403
113
There is a shortage, mainly due to the rigorous training. There's a reason the US has the safest airspace system in the world.

There is also a pilot shortage, and has been for many years.

Remember this when the political talk starts. They don't put just anybody in a tower or a cockpit.
Am I mistaken or were they not letting things get a little lax several years ago? I seem to recall a focus on hiring diversity pilots and many pilots I know were up-at-arms about airlines taking in pilots that should not have been in a cockpit of a simulator much less an actual plane. Then the vaccine requirements happened and we lost even more quality pilots.
 

mike tice

Active member
Sep 30, 2022
216
384
63
So you are an expert on air traffic, and air crashes now too. So you already know what caused this! And you wonder why I laugh at you so much. 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
He’s a 17 ing moron. Basically 17s up every thread.
 

ckDOG

Well-known member
Dec 11, 2007
8,711
3,342
113
Am I mistaken or were they not letting things get a little lax several years ago? I seem to recall a focus on hiring diversity pilots and many pilots I know were up-at-arms about airlines taking in pilots that should not have been in a cockpit of a simulator much less an actual plane. Then the vaccine requirements happened and we lost even more quality pilots.
DEI. Drink!
 

DesotoCountyDawg

Well-known member
Nov 16, 2005
23,933
12,903
113
Am I mistaken or were they not letting things get a little lax several years ago? I seem to recall a focus on hiring diversity pilots and many pilots I know were up-at-arms about airlines taking in pilots that should not have been in a cockpit of a simulator much less an actual plane. Then the vaccine requirements happened and we lost even more quality pilots.
It wasn’t DEI for ATC. They literally couldn’t find enough people interested. They’ve advertised ATC school quite a bit and tried to make a big deal about how much money you can make. Still have shortages.
 

OopsICroomedmypants

Well-known member
Sep 29, 2022
1,265
1,723
113
ATC radar of the event.


This looks really bad for ATC. It's almost like they walked away for a coffee break. I have never worked with radar, but it was pretty obvious with the red lights and flight paths that there was a huge chance for a collision.
 

L4Dawg

Well-known member
Oct 27, 2016
7,571
4,658
113
It wasn’t DEI for ATC. They literally couldn’t find enough people interested. They’ve advertised ATC school quite a bit and tried to make a big deal about how much money you can make. Still have shortages.
Yep. I've got a relative that does ATC in the Navy. He likes it in the Navy. He wants no part of it when he gets out.
 

OG Goat Holder

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2022
9,301
8,635
113
Am I mistaken or were they not letting things get a little lax several years ago? I seem to recall a focus on hiring diversity pilots and many pilots I know were up-at-arms about airlines taking in pilots that should not have been in a cockpit of a simulator much less an actual plane. Then the vaccine requirements happened and we lost even more quality pilots.
Don't believe all the bullshlt.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.