Better Call Saul: Season 6 Discussion Thread
- Thread starter rudedude
- Start date
So, what do we think of the first two episodes? SPOILER ALERT: turns out the dude in the mirror in the trailer served his purpose. Nacho’s predicament, wow! Good thing he has Mike on his side. Interesting opening scene into the opulent world of Saul Goodman, and finally, Kim is a bad a** and suffers no fools!! Oh, and Betsy Kettelman is still a b***h.
Yeah, I DVR’d it as I need to get going early this morning but watched up until I saw the guy once he’d shaved. That was brilliant.
Good review which I skimmed and am saving for later.
www.rollingstone.com
'Better Call Saul' Season 6 Premiere: Kim Wexler Breaks Bad
Two-episode premiere for final season finds Jimmy still miles from being Saul — but Kim crossing to the dark side. Alan Sepinwall's recap
www.rollingstone.com
SPOILER ALERT: man, Lalo is devious. I could not figure out how the body they found had matching dental records for Lalo. When he went to the house and he asked Mateo’s wife how his dental work came out!! What a plotting s.o.b.!!
Cold-blooded POS, yes. If you want to see the real Lalo, you should check out Episode 4.9, where Lalo gives Hector his bell. Chilling.
MAJOR SPOILERS AHEAD
I have watched 6.1, and will catch 6.2 tonight. Some thoughts.
1) I've read someone suggesting that Nacho will escape with his father. "If Gilligan and Gould had intended to kill off Nacho, he'd be dead by now." What follows are my own ideas: Lalo needs proof and knows that the only way to get it is to find Nacho. Gus knows this too. The best way for Gus to ensure Nacho's silence would have been to have him killed at Lalo's house. So why not kill Nacho right then and there, especially since if Lalo somehow survived the raid he wouldn't think that Nacho was a traitor? My answer: Gus is leaving Nacho alive because if Lalo survives, then Gus will need Nacho's help in fighting Lalo. If Lalo is alive (as Gus's thinking goes) then he'd be going after Nacho (for revenge and for proof of Gus's involvement) and the only way for Nacho to effectively counter this is to kill Lalo. If Lalo is dead, then Gus could kill Nacho later, if he wanted to go that way. Also, Gus being able to throw Mike a bone on the Nacho front, especially after Mike's royal screw-up with Werner Ziegler, is a bonus. Lalo is dead at the end of Better Call Saul, that much is certain. Who is the one best situated to kill Lalo? Nacho.
2) This show gets a lot said with few words. The whole scene that cumulates with Mateo shaving and coming out as Lalo's double was just simply incredible. Just wow. And the scene where the Cousins walk through the crime scene told us loud and clear who runs the show in that neck of the woods. I doubt the Cousins were taken in on the scam. They would have heard that Mateo had disappeared, for one thing. But they're not going to blab it out to anyone; they know that Lalo is the smart one.
3) Kim playing the Howard scheme as a long con is Better Call Saul's way of telling us to buckle up and be patient.
I have watched 6.1, and will catch 6.2 tonight. Some thoughts.
1) I've read someone suggesting that Nacho will escape with his father. "If Gilligan and Gould had intended to kill off Nacho, he'd be dead by now." What follows are my own ideas: Lalo needs proof and knows that the only way to get it is to find Nacho. Gus knows this too. The best way for Gus to ensure Nacho's silence would have been to have him killed at Lalo's house. So why not kill Nacho right then and there, especially since if Lalo somehow survived the raid he wouldn't think that Nacho was a traitor? My answer: Gus is leaving Nacho alive because if Lalo survives, then Gus will need Nacho's help in fighting Lalo. If Lalo is alive (as Gus's thinking goes) then he'd be going after Nacho (for revenge and for proof of Gus's involvement) and the only way for Nacho to effectively counter this is to kill Lalo. If Lalo is dead, then Gus could kill Nacho later, if he wanted to go that way. Also, Gus being able to throw Mike a bone on the Nacho front, especially after Mike's royal screw-up with Werner Ziegler, is a bonus. Lalo is dead at the end of Better Call Saul, that much is certain. Who is the one best situated to kill Lalo? Nacho.
2) This show gets a lot said with few words. The whole scene that cumulates with Mateo shaving and coming out as Lalo's double was just simply incredible. Just wow. And the scene where the Cousins walk through the crime scene told us loud and clear who runs the show in that neck of the woods. I doubt the Cousins were taken in on the scam. They would have heard that Mateo had disappeared, for one thing. But they're not going to blab it out to anyone; they know that Lalo is the smart one.
3) Kim playing the Howard scheme as a long con is Better Call Saul's way of telling us to buckle up and be patient.
Last edited:
The twins were upset when they found the burned body and put their death prayer card on the body. The only one who knows Lalo is alive is Hector and Gus (by his own paranoia). I believe Mike will kill Lalo in rescuing Nacho and his father, only to have one of Gus’ henchman kill Nacho. Remember there is the scene in BB where Saul thinks Walter and Jesse were sent by Lalo and claims it was Ignacio who was the culprit (I assume that he meant that Nacho let the hit men in to kill Lalo). This means Lalo’s death would have been unknown to Saul.
i also loved Kim’s taking down of the Kettlemans. She is as ruthless as Gus and Lalo!!
Last edited:
Spoilers Ahead!!!!
A notable event in 6.2 is Kim dressing differently than she has the entire series. She is wearing a multi-colored blouse, becoming another Saul.
Also, why did Gus plant the location of the hotel so that Bolsa would find it? (This was done before Gus realized that Lalo was alive.) This I don’t get.
A notable event in 6.2 is Kim dressing differently than she has the entire series. She is wearing a multi-colored blouse, becoming another Saul.
Also, why did Gus plant the location of the hotel so that Bolsa would find it? (This was done before Gus realized that Lalo was alive.) This I don’t get.
Last edited:
Gus wanted Nacho dead. He didn’t want the Salamanca clan getting ahold of him and that is what they are trying to do and want to torture him to get who was behind the hit. Lalo told Hector already it was the “chicken man”.
But Gus sent the Salamancas to where Nacho was hiding by planting the information in Nacho’s safe. If Gus didn’t want the Salamancas getting ahold of Nacho so that they’d torture him and get proof that Gus had ordered the hit on Lalo, why did he let the cartel know where Nacho was hiding?
Last edited:
I may not have been clear with what I was intending. Gus’ intention was to let the Salamancas know where Nacho was so they could kill him but the Salamanca’s want him alive so they can get the “proof”, as Lalo was told by Hector, that Gus was behind it all. Gus needs Nacho dead.
That's why they give Nacho the gun, because the real setup is hoping that he's going to be trapped in a firefight with the Cousins, and one way or another Nacho will be killed in the action.
I rewatched the episodes. I have a theory, but first, I love the way they don't show Lalo killing people. It leaves it to your imagination and adds to his mystique.
I think Mike is running a con on Gus. First, when Nacho surprises the watcher, the watcher states you can't even fire a gun in the area without being caught. That makes me think Gus needs the area to cool down before he can extract Nacho. Gus must definitely be regretting leaving Nacho alive at the villa. Isn't Gus former South American paramilitary? It seems like that was completely against his instincts and maybe for Mike's benefit.
The sniper that Mike radios - did Mike have him there to take out Gus if things went badly? He knows Gus is pissed, and Gus is ruthless. Not sure why Gus would have him there as that's a pretty safe area for him.
The safe - Did Gus change that out to throw Juan off, knowing Juan would go to investigate and eventually report back to the Salamancas? Or did Mike do that on his own initiative to force Gus to move on getting Nacho out? Something like that seems a bit beyond Mike's means if doing it on his own.
I think Lalo is heading for Don Eladio. He probably doubts that operation could be carried out in that area without his help and/or approval.
Why didn't the twins chase after Nacho? That had at least one, if not two faster cars and are much better drivers. I found that odd.
I think Mike is running a con on Gus. First, when Nacho surprises the watcher, the watcher states you can't even fire a gun in the area without being caught. That makes me think Gus needs the area to cool down before he can extract Nacho. Gus must definitely be regretting leaving Nacho alive at the villa. Isn't Gus former South American paramilitary? It seems like that was completely against his instincts and maybe for Mike's benefit.
The sniper that Mike radios - did Mike have him there to take out Gus if things went badly? He knows Gus is pissed, and Gus is ruthless. Not sure why Gus would have him there as that's a pretty safe area for him.
The safe - Did Gus change that out to throw Juan off, knowing Juan would go to investigate and eventually report back to the Salamancas? Or did Mike do that on his own initiative to force Gus to move on getting Nacho out? Something like that seems a bit beyond Mike's means if doing it on his own.
I think Lalo is heading for Don Eladio. He probably doubts that operation could be carried out in that area without his help and/or approval.
Why didn't the twins chase after Nacho? That had at least one, if not two faster cars and are much better drivers. I found that odd.
In for a dime, in for a dollar.
I can't remember which happened first, but I am making the assumption that Mike cracked Nacho's safe before Gus realized that Lalo was alive.
First thing we need to remember is that It was Don Eladio (through Juan Bolsa), not Gus, who unleashed the dogs on Nacho. You'll remember that Lalo introduced Nacho to Don Eladio, which is how the cartel knew that Nacho was a traitor when they couldn't find him after the ambush. Gus, knowing that this was a possibility, set up the switching of the safes. (If Mike knew that the information about Nacho's hotel would be planted in the safe, I would expect that Gilligan and Gould would have had him bring up the issue with Gus. On the other hand, it's not like Mike to plant something without knowing what it is. This is a very weak construction, jmo.)
So, we need to assume that Gus would have been okay with Nacho being killed at the hotel. (The phone call with Tyrus confirms this.) Why try to kill Nacho at the hotel after passing up the opportunity to have him killed at the ambush? The hotel information was planted in the safe before Gus knew that Lalo had survived, so the reason for planting the information which set up the shootout at the hotel doesn't rely on the fact that Lalo is alive. The only thing I can think of is that Gus, by allowing Bolsa to discover Nacho's location, is encouraging Bolsa to believe that Gus had nothing to do with the attempted hit on Lalo. Gus has plausible deniability that he has any knowledge of Nacho's existence. I'm just now thinking that Mike has convinced himself (and therefore Gus) that there was zero chance Nacho would allow himself to be taken alive. (This kinda sorta addresses the concerns in the last sentence of my previous paragraph.) Gus gave Nacho a fighter's chance to save himself but making it too easy for Nacho to escape would surely raise suspicions within the cartel. The cartel will now take Bolsa's discovery of the hotel as being evidence that Gus was not involved on the attempted hit on Lalo. Also, Nacho was identified as a traitor because he met with Eladio; it’s plausible that the hotel shootout would not have happened had this meeting not taken place.
I can't remember which happened first, but I am making the assumption that Mike cracked Nacho's safe before Gus realized that Lalo was alive.
First thing we need to remember is that It was Don Eladio (through Juan Bolsa), not Gus, who unleashed the dogs on Nacho. You'll remember that Lalo introduced Nacho to Don Eladio, which is how the cartel knew that Nacho was a traitor when they couldn't find him after the ambush. Gus, knowing that this was a possibility, set up the switching of the safes. (If Mike knew that the information about Nacho's hotel would be planted in the safe, I would expect that Gilligan and Gould would have had him bring up the issue with Gus. On the other hand, it's not like Mike to plant something without knowing what it is. This is a very weak construction, jmo.)
So, we need to assume that Gus would have been okay with Nacho being killed at the hotel. (The phone call with Tyrus confirms this.) Why try to kill Nacho at the hotel after passing up the opportunity to have him killed at the ambush? The hotel information was planted in the safe before Gus knew that Lalo had survived, so the reason for planting the information which set up the shootout at the hotel doesn't rely on the fact that Lalo is alive. The only thing I can think of is that Gus, by allowing Bolsa to discover Nacho's location, is encouraging Bolsa to believe that Gus had nothing to do with the attempted hit on Lalo. Gus has plausible deniability that he has any knowledge of Nacho's existence. I'm just now thinking that Mike has convinced himself (and therefore Gus) that there was zero chance Nacho would allow himself to be taken alive. (This kinda sorta addresses the concerns in the last sentence of my previous paragraph.) Gus gave Nacho a fighter's chance to save himself but making it too easy for Nacho to escape would surely raise suspicions within the cartel. The cartel will now take Bolsa's discovery of the hotel as being evidence that Gus was not involved on the attempted hit on Lalo. Also, Nacho was identified as a traitor because he met with Eladio; it’s plausible that the hotel shootout would not have happened had this meeting not taken place.
Last edited:
(Shielding eyes)...Just got done watching all BCS episodes with the wife, so I'm late in jumping into S6. We will start tonight and hopefully I'll jump into the discussion soon.
On another note, I've also been rewatching BB. In S3, Saul tells WW that he once convinced a girl he was Kevin Costner. I had totally forgotten about that when that scene is actually shown in BCS. Brilliant!
On another note, I've also been rewatching BB. In S3, Saul tells WW that he once convinced a girl he was Kevin Costner. I had totally forgotten about that when that scene is actually shown in BCS. Brilliant!
WARNING LARGE SPOILER ALERT!!!
Rewatched both episodes and some observations:
1. No women’s items taken out of Saul’s place in opening sequence. The only remnant of Kim is the tequila bottle top that falls out of the dresser.
2. Last season Mike argued to save Nacho post the hit and Gus insisted he was in the middle of it but later said to save him they would have to be “unimpeachable”.
3. Mike argues about saving Nacho to Gus in front of Tyus after Bolsa calls Gus to say Lalo is dead, Gus is unresponsive and Tyus leaves as Mike says, unless you already have other plans after Mike offered to get Nacho. Bolsa also told Hector Lalo was dead.
4. Saul accidentally says Lalo’s name to the Guzman investigators
5. Kim appears to be behind the ideas behind the appearance and persona of Saul Goodman suggesting a flashy office and car and “cathedral of justice”.
6. Nacho in hotel and talks to Tyus and is told Eladio has put a price on Nacho’s head.
7. Nacho calls Mike when Mike is with his granddaughter and Mike doesn’t answer phone.
8. Lalo calls Hector before he gets on the mule truck. Hector tells Lalo to get proof so Lalo heads back south. Lalo says he knows where to find the proof Gus was behind it (Nacho?)
9. Mike and Gus’ guys switch out safe, Mike plants envelope with hotel phone number in it
10. Tyus lays out all the photos etc from the Lalo hit and says it all checks out even the dental records. Gus questions it. Gus calls Bolsa and says has another idea on how to keep the peace. Gus really doesn’t believe Lalo is dead.
11. Great line “nose deep in the devil’s dandruff”
12. Gus meets with Bolsa and Hector at the nursing home. Gus talks about sticking together and I believe he realizes Lalo is alive when Hector shakes his hand and smiles at him. He speaks to Tyus on phone and when asked what he learned he says Lalo Salamanca lives. Gus suspected it all along thus setting up the pre-emptive paper with hotel number in Nacho’s new safe.
13. Bolsa finds document with wire transfers from Peru and hotel phone number. Gus definitely knows Lalo is alive now.
14. Nacho finds spy and calls Tyus to say he has to get out. Spy guy’s phone rings and Nacho knows Gus is watching him and he knocks out the spy. The cousins et al come for Nacho and shootout ensues with Nacho escaping.
Gus wanted and needed Nacho dead but his plans are screwed up because the Salamancas want Nacho alive and Nacho escaped.
16. Mike in communication with sniper, truck found Nacho missing. Mike telling Gus Nacho will get caught. Mike wanting to go get Nacho. Gus wants Nacho’s father, Mike defies this. Nacho calls Mike in front of Gus. Tells Nacho it’s not his call and Nacho wants to talk to Gus.
Rewatched both episodes and some observations:
1. No women’s items taken out of Saul’s place in opening sequence. The only remnant of Kim is the tequila bottle top that falls out of the dresser.
2. Last season Mike argued to save Nacho post the hit and Gus insisted he was in the middle of it but later said to save him they would have to be “unimpeachable”.
3. Mike argues about saving Nacho to Gus in front of Tyus after Bolsa calls Gus to say Lalo is dead, Gus is unresponsive and Tyus leaves as Mike says, unless you already have other plans after Mike offered to get Nacho. Bolsa also told Hector Lalo was dead.
4. Saul accidentally says Lalo’s name to the Guzman investigators
5. Kim appears to be behind the ideas behind the appearance and persona of Saul Goodman suggesting a flashy office and car and “cathedral of justice”.
6. Nacho in hotel and talks to Tyus and is told Eladio has put a price on Nacho’s head.
7. Nacho calls Mike when Mike is with his granddaughter and Mike doesn’t answer phone.
8. Lalo calls Hector before he gets on the mule truck. Hector tells Lalo to get proof so Lalo heads back south. Lalo says he knows where to find the proof Gus was behind it (Nacho?)
9. Mike and Gus’ guys switch out safe, Mike plants envelope with hotel phone number in it
10. Tyus lays out all the photos etc from the Lalo hit and says it all checks out even the dental records. Gus questions it. Gus calls Bolsa and says has another idea on how to keep the peace. Gus really doesn’t believe Lalo is dead.
11. Great line “nose deep in the devil’s dandruff”
12. Gus meets with Bolsa and Hector at the nursing home. Gus talks about sticking together and I believe he realizes Lalo is alive when Hector shakes his hand and smiles at him. He speaks to Tyus on phone and when asked what he learned he says Lalo Salamanca lives. Gus suspected it all along thus setting up the pre-emptive paper with hotel number in Nacho’s new safe.
13. Bolsa finds document with wire transfers from Peru and hotel phone number. Gus definitely knows Lalo is alive now.
14. Nacho finds spy and calls Tyus to say he has to get out. Spy guy’s phone rings and Nacho knows Gus is watching him and he knocks out the spy. The cousins et al come for Nacho and shootout ensues with Nacho escaping.
Gus wanted and needed Nacho dead but his plans are screwed up because the Salamancas want Nacho alive and Nacho escaped.
16. Mike in communication with sniper, truck found Nacho missing. Mike telling Gus Nacho will get caught. Mike wanting to go get Nacho. Gus wants Nacho’s father, Mike defies this. Nacho calls Mike in front of Gus. Tells Nacho it’s not his call and Nacho wants to talk to Gus.
Last edited:
Yep. Tied a few things off. No real need to summarize, nothing much to say.Well Episode 3 is over.
SPOILER ALERT:
Nacho had the balls, in the end, to really divert the obvious attention away from Gus with how he went out. The coup de gras was him gleefully telling Hector what he did to him. Hector, of course, was pissed and kept shooting Nacho’s corpse. Nacho was a bad dude but a hero to other bad dudes in the end. Hopefully they leave his father alone, I really doubt it, though. DESCANSE EN PAZ, Nacho.
Opening scene, desert bluebell, rain on glass piece that Nacho used and looks like fresh dirt. Nacho’s burial site. Meaning of a desert bluebell
In the language of flowers, the bluebell is a symbol of humility, constancy, gratitude and everlasting love.
In the language of flowers, the bluebell is a symbol of humility, constancy, gratitude and everlasting love.
Last edited:
I also now think this is how the Lalo scene in BB melds into BCS: the DA knows about Guzman/Lalo and presents the scenario to Kim about Jimmy providing info. I think he will which will lead to Lalo’s arrest/death. This making Saul panic in BB about Lalo and Nacho.
Great call on the burial site.
One thing which doesn’t quite wash for me is that Bolsa will surely wonder how Gus managed to find Nacho when the Salamancas couldn’t. It’s just a little too convenient.
Here’s a good post-mortem.
www.rollingstone.com
One thing which doesn’t quite wash for me is that Bolsa will surely wonder how Gus managed to find Nacho when the Salamancas couldn’t. It’s just a little too convenient.
Here’s a good post-mortem.
'Better Call Saul' Recap: Nacho Libre?
A spotlight episode on Ignacio Varga follows his flight from the Cousins after a shootout. Alan Sepinwall's recap
www.rollingstone.com
Great call on the burial site.
One thing which doesn’t quite wash for me is that Bolsa will surely wonder how Gus managed to find Nacho when the Salamancas couldn’t. It’s just a little too convenient.
Here’s a good post-mortem.
'Better Call Saul' Recap: Nacho Libre?
A spotlight episode on Ignacio Varga follows his flight from the Cousins after a shootout. Alan Sepinwall's recap
Nacho also managed to get something sharp under their watch. I bet Mike buried Nacho, and wouldn't be surprised if he somehow let Nacho's dad know Nacho was dead. Nice touch with the auto repair guy harkening back to a younger Nacho's dad.
Excellent pick-up on the auto repair guy. I myself didn’t make that connection with his father. To wholly appreciate this, you needed to understand Nacho’s state of mind at that time, that he knew he was a dead man.
You have to ask yourself at what exact moment did Nacho realize that he wasn’t going to get out alive. I think it’s pretty clear that this was when he spoke to Tyrus just before the shootout.
Let me ask: was the music in the opening scene funereal in any way, did it make you think that Nacho or someone else was not long for this world? I kept trying to analyze the scene but wasn’t able to come to the realization that it was a gravesite until @rudedude mentioned it. I watched it alone last night and will ask my wife about it when I watch it with her tonight.
Last edited:
If you recall, Gus pledged to work with Bolsa and the Salamancas to find the threat, so I guess he covered it in that way.Great call on the burial site.
One thing which doesn’t quite wash for me is that Bolsa will surely wonder how Gus managed to find Nacho when the Salamancas couldn’t. It’s just a little too convenient.
Here’s a good post-mortem.
'Better Call Saul' Recap: Nacho Libre?
A spotlight episode on Ignacio Varga follows his flight from the Cousins after a shootout. Alan Sepinwall's recap
Last edited:
I didn't conclude it was a grave site. The music was a little somber/foreboding, but I thought the glass was a piece of metal that had come off Nacho's truck, and the scene was going to pick up at that point.
I think Nacho thought he could get away, but when he talked to his dad he was 1) relieved they hadn't gotten to him yet and 2) realized he could never get his dad to run. I think number 2 could have definitely occurred earlier, but Nacho always knew his dad was his Achilles heal. If they had killed his dad right away, I could see Nacho continuing to run, maybe even try for revenge.
I love the way they make BCS. Its crafted so beautifully, and nothing in a scene is wasted. When I watched last night, I was extremely focused on Nacho, but there's a lot going on with Kim and Jimmy right now. I think I'll wait until the weekend to rewatch so I can focus on them.
Yeah, you have to pay close attention to every scene as there are important things in each scene. Re: glass piece, the scene right before they took Nacho to the Salamancas, he had a glass he was drinking from and then looked at his reflection. Probably decided to break the glass for the piece he ultimately used.
The piece of glass was likely from when Gus broke a glass in the preceding episode.
When Nacho said he poisoned Hector, I thought 1) that's a nice way to take additional heat off Gus to help ensure Gus' protection of his dad, but 2) really playing with fire with the Salamancas since Hector originally threatened Nacho's dad and knew how much Nacho loved him. I'm sure it felt good, but also drew unnecessary attention to why Nacho hated the Salamancas.
Yeah, I thought the same about the danger of Nacho provoking the Salamancas. The question now is who is going to kill Lalo. My guess is it will be Mike, perhaps in response to the Salamancas threatening Nacho’s dad. If it’s Mike who does the deed, it will be done in a way that won’t be traced to Gus and Mike.
I had been a recent convert to the “Nacho kills Lalo and makes it to Canada with Papa” possibility. In hindsight, there would be no way for Gus’s storyline to happen with Nacho alive. I now think that’s fairly obvious. This story isn’t about Nacho, it’s about Saul. In Saul’s first appearance in Breaking Bad, he says “It wasn’t me, it was Ignacio. Did Lalo send you?” I still don’t know how this is going to play out.
At some point I have to force myself to watch Breaking Bad. I just never could get into it.
BCS is better, by a wide margin, IMO. Saul is a much more compelling character than Walter, and BB doesn’t have Kim, one of the great characters in the history of television. But, it’s nice to compare, for example, Mike’s relationship with Jesse and his relationship with Nacho.
Get unlimited access today.