BTN discussion of PSU - says PSU is completely different team with Clifford at 100%

Steve B

Active member
Nov 1, 2021
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Missing on Fields hurt. Agree to disagree that Clifford isn't a qb you can get into the playoff with. He was one game short in 19 (and probably completes the comeback vs Minnesota if that blatant PI is called on our final drive) in his first year as a starter and had the team up to #4 this year with two ranked wins in the first 4 weeks this year before sustaining an injury that should have knocked him out for multiple weeks if there was a viable second option. I don't think McNamara is any more special a QB than Clifford and he's going to get Michigan there. The difference in line play. Clifford has been sacked 29 times this year. McNamara 6. CV was sacked once and Roberson sacked twice. Michigans backups were sacked 4x.

Our line gave up 32 sacks this season. Most in the big ten.

Michigan- 10
OSU-17
Rutgers- 18
Maryland- 26
Indiana- 29
Nebraksa- 29
Purdue- 27
MSU- 18
Ill- 23
NW- 29
Min- 20
Iowa-30
Wisconsin-15

If we trade O-Lines with Michigan our season looks a hell of a lot more different than it does if we keep O-Lines and swap Cliff for Mac.
Agree 100% …. a more effective OL changes the outcome of most if not all the games lost.
 

fastlax16

Member
Aug 24, 2017
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Yep, McNamara just another guy. He’s an example of everything around him going right and having a really good line/backs. Helped to play in a weak conference as well. Something Clifford could be too, 100%. I would just prefer to have the leeway to not have to have everything else perfect like that to work.
The 5 biggest holes on the team are along the OL. I can’t believe how bad they were/really have been. People think it’s a new phenomenon, not running the ball, but look up what Barkley and all backs since have done against Ohio State, and really most other big games on the ground. It’s not pretty.

Bright side is Michigan likely reverts to their mean next year (even better if Iowa upsets them) and Stroud hasn't necessarily shown he's a dude like Fields was so I'm not sure you just pencil them in like you could the last several years (if Day takes the Bears job even better). The portal is literally overflowing with kids and the recruiting classes at Oklahoma and Notre Dame are suddenly fair game. The line and running game also cannot possibly be worse unless we literally put 5 turnstiles out there. The schedule is easier.
 
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Steve B

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Nov 1, 2021
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How about Alex Bowman (from Texas Tech) who ended up @ UM? He had been a starter @ TT. He ended up 3rd thing there. I believe he could have gotten PSU through Iowa and Illinois, giving SC time to completely heal.
How good could Bowman really have been to be 3rd string at Michigan? The real problem was our OL. The inability to get any push in the run game and giving up sacks & pressures means Tom Brady wouldn’t have won the Iowa game after Sean went down. Illinois we should have won with anyone at QB. We had multiple chances to win that game if several folks had made a play when they had a chance.
 

fastlax16

Member
Aug 24, 2017
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How about Alex Bowman (from Texas Tech) who ended up @ UM? He had been a starter @ TT. He ended up 3rd thing there. I believe he could have gotten PSU through Iowa and Illinois, giving SC time to completely heal.

McNamara only started two games last season and wasn't named the starter until the last week of August. Harbaugh had made it fairly clear it was an open competition between him, bowman and mccarthy. He also was a business management major at Tech so assuming he's taking graduate classes at Ross that's another thing going for Michigan. Ross > Smeal. And I'm a smeal grad.
 
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donaldfair71

Member
Nov 8, 2021
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Bright side is Michigan likely reverts to their mean next year (even better if Iowa upsets them) and Stroud hasn't necessarily shown he's a dude like Fields was so I'm not sure you just pencil them in like you could the last several years (if Day takes the Bears job even better). The portal is literally overflowing with kids and the recruiting classes at Oklahoma and Notre Dame are suddenly fair game. The line and running game also cannot possibly be worse unless we literally put 5 turnstiles out there. The schedule is easier.
Michigan prime example of the difference between getting to a playoff and being an elite program. They’ve had a nice year and probably get there, certainly favored. But it’s not a repeatable formula, as they’ve not really shown to be competent enough to have the QB year in and out (and don’t this year either really- that’s why they won’t win it all). They had a lot go right, one thing among many being staying in the game at all in SC as PSU did all it could to keep Michigan in the game.
But let’s look at next year for PSU. Have beaten OSU once in a decade and once again will bring in a better QB and head coach. Then to Michigan, I don’t need to remind how the last two “normal” situations went there. Didn’t score a meaningful TD with better offensive personnel both times.
So already you kind of have two hurdles to jump and until I see us beat a good Michigan team there or beat OSU at all, I’ll look at it like it’s probably another 10-2 is a good year season.
Oh then there’s vastly improved Sparty that’s 3-2 the last 5 on us.
We’re not as close in my opinion as most other fans think we are because it’s not like we have nice seasons but lose to different teams at different seasons. There are programs in our own division that own us pretty bad overall, others in their house. I see no big hope until there’s like BIG portal news to see that changing next year. Even then, I’ll have doubts.
 

MaconNitt

Well-known member
Oct 12, 2021
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The 5 biggest holes on the team are along the OL. I can’t believe how bad they were/really have been. People think it’s a new phenomenon, not running the ball, but look up what Barkley and all backs since have done against Ohio State, and really most other big games on the ground. It’s not pretty.


I know it is not popular on here to say this but the reality is we have been like a dog chasing its tail since BO'B took over. The sanctions cut the number of scholarships he could offer. He went heavy on the skill position players not on lineman. It is amazing the players he was able to attract with how toxic the program was back then. The Oline depth was so bad that we had to convert 2 and 3 star kids from the Dline to Oline. We have been playing catch up since.

Consider this, after the sanctions were lifted we got back to 25 +/- scholarships to offer each year. You need to spread that among QB, RB, WR, TE, OL, DL, LB, DB, K and P. Take out QB, K and P and you are left with 22 +/- spots, Divide that by 7 positions you get an average of 3 spots per position. Don't forget you have holes all over your roster not just Oline.

Oline is one of the positions where they generally need some time to develop, whether it is technique or just bulking up physically to make the transition from HS to major CFB. So you get a few busts who don't pan out, some injuries that slow development (Scruggs comes to mind), the medical retirement of Nana, Players leaving early for the draft or portal. It is going to take time. We are living in a world where kids want to play now not work hard and improve their spot on the depth chart. The only time success come before work is in the dictionary.

These are not excuses. These are facts. Some fans clearly do not get it. Look at the difficulty USC had after the Reggie Bush/Pete Carroll debacle. They lost like 10 scholarships for 3 years and have struggled, winning only 1 conference championship and no playoff appearances since, in a hotbed area for talent.

We all want the same thing. Losing sucks. Coaches and players make mistakes. Kids change their minds. Criticism is one thing, but the some of the things spewed on here toward coaches, players, recruits and fellow posters crosses the line.

Sorry for the long post. Rant over. Gets off soap box.

WE ARE!!!
 
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