Your low Reading Section ACT score is showing my guy. That is not micro-managing.
Mullen article - Grab your coffee and/or go to the toilet
- Thread starter dawgstudent
- Start date
Leadership matters if the organization wants to instill a solid foundation. We squandered any momentum we might have had and were holding on until Leach got here to rebuild things and couldn't even capitalize on being the first #1 ranked team in the new system. I think that the locker room mess that the article indicates and that Swede validates has a lot to do with that, and that is poor leadership. That stuff doesn't stay bottled up.
Whoa now. "Squandered" is a strong word. 2015 was a good year, 2016 was a rebuilding year (where he was checked out), but we got back in 2017 and 2018 due to him. I mean we are always going to be an up and down program at MSU, until we get some big influx of fans/money/support.
But your GENERAL point is good. Mullen needed to take the next step in his 'leadership', whether that was MSU or Florida. But here's a little known secret known by people who pay attention - the 2019 and 2020 crash was coming, even if Mullen had stayed. He'd have probably done better than Sloppy though, for sure.
Well, seeing as that would be a move to a worse program, you aren't comparing equal situations.
Something he and many members of this board have in common. Everyone is a prick in someone's story.
Could you post the same 17ing post
eleventy billion times without addressing a single point that people make? Yes.
You are truly psychotic when it comes to your defense of Dan Mullen.
True, but Mullen shows up in many more than most. For a reason.
Because he's a prick.
Jezzum Petes…I’m only halfway through it…started feeling a tear in the o-ring. Definitely a long poop kind of article.
Culture Shock, Part I: inside the Florida Gators' implosion under Dan Mullen | In All Kinds of Weather
The Florida Gators seemed to be in good hands under Mullen- until they weren't. And the downward spiral was worse than many may have thought.inallkindsofweather.com
Every person I've talked to that knows Hevesy personally says the same thing. He's pretty much an arrogant ********** who is a narcissist , but is pretty much that way because he is really an insecure prick who has little dong syndrome.
I think we've established that. Really no need for you to jump in on this part of the thread. You've got enough fires going.
Does it though? All I heard was Mullen always tinkered and butted in with the defense. This sounds like he should have done it more.
You can demand excellence without being an *******. That pretty much sums it up
For all his flaws, Don Merlin was the best head football coach I’ve seen at MSU in my lifetime. He was his own worst enemy though. He desperately needed someone in the athletic department to hold him accountable in order to improve himself as a head coach/CEO and as a person. Well, that wasn’t ever happening at little old moo U. Dan was far too arrogant to allow any boss to hold him accountable. In the end though, the guy has a helluva stacked bank account and won’t have to ever work another day in his life unless he wants to. We should all be so flawed and lucky.
"Culture shock". I laugh at that title after watching 2 episodes of Swamp Kings last night.
Those 2020-2021 guys would not have made it under Meyer and Siler.
Those 2020-2021 guys would not have made it under Meyer and Siler.
Dak loved these coaches, but I guess that means he was a "favored player" with less talent than his backups.***
I get that coaches can go over the line with tough love and move into demeaning/demoralizing behavior, but these players are supposed to be the toughest of the tough. Also, there are around 100 athletes involved in the program each year. Only 22 or so are going to be happy since they are starters, the rest will be unhappy with their roles. Some more than others. It will often be blamed on the coaches.
And if Greg Knox didn't want to play that RB who had a good run in practice, there was probably a good reason for it.
I get that coaches can go over the line with tough love and move into demeaning/demoralizing behavior, but these players are supposed to be the toughest of the tough. Also, there are around 100 athletes involved in the program each year. Only 22 or so are going to be happy since they are starters, the rest will be unhappy with their roles. Some more than others. It will often be blamed on the coaches.
And if Greg Knox didn't want to play that RB who had a good run in practice, there was probably a good reason for it.
I'm probably projecting from PTSD related to past bad leadership experiences. I've seen the guy who can simultaneously, meddle with things his team is doing while also not holding that team's leadership accountable for being terrible humans. It's a unique ability to, by virtue of your actions, tell your team leader (e.g. DC) that he's not doing a good job, while simultaneously not directly addressing the leaders failings. i.e. his "style" as described by the people who were in his programs resonates with some bad past business leadership experiences. I also tend to put a little more stock in first person experiences relayed via that article and Swede. Apparently, @paindonthurt doesn't think that they know as much about it as the average SPS poster does...
I don’t think you or I know more than any of the people/players. But people don’t always tell the truth. Sometimes bc they are lying, sometimes due to bias. Lot of reasons.
But Dan Mullen was successful AF at msu and you don’t do that for 9 years while being bad at your job. Being a terrible leader would have made him bad at his job.
Being a better would have made him better at his job.
Being good at your job is defined by long term results.
Ons second you say he was a meddling A hole then you chastise him for not doing enough according to this article. Those are very opposing ideas/thoughts.
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"It's a unique ability to, by virtue of your actions, tell your team leader (e.g. DC) that he's not doing a good job (implicit 'by meddling'), while simultaneously not directly addressing the leaders failings.."
I don’t really need to defend useless points when I have 9 years of results.
Im not overly defensive of Dan Mullen. Some of you idiots are overly critical of him.
He was a dick. Who cares?
Sabans a dick. Who cares?
Croom was a nice guy. Charismatic. Players loved him. Who cares? He sucked as a football coach.
I think he's had the luxury of only having seen good leaders "succeed". I have not been afforded that. I've had the exact opposite at times and it is much worse when bad leaders "succeed". Because people like @paindonthurt just say things like, well the business is making money so he must be a good leader and continue to enable the bad leader. No, the business is way underperforming what it would be doing with good leadership. The culture sucks. The ceiling is pretty much set because we will never grow beyond current earnings because we have a bad leader. And soon, it will fall apart for the bad leader, either at here or elsewhere, because you can only go so long before the chickens come home to roost.
And his only defense of his opinion is that all the Florida players and Swede are just lying about poor ole Dan. Odd take. The last I'll chime in on this thread as I'm on repeat now. Some people, you just can't reach; and then, you get what we have right here...
You are full of $h1t and I think most rational and intelligent people see that.
I think the most common Mullen meddling theory was A and B team defense in 14-15. Reading this article, it doesn’t seem like his MO. Now it could be an example of how he was with Hevesy for so many years, he gave him autonomy. It could be that the relationship got to a point where it blurred those employer/employee lines and Hevesy used that to give himself autonomy. With Collins and Diaz not being one of Mullen’s boys maybe he felt he knew better or he was more comfortable telling them what to do. I just think some people will blame Mullen for everything that happened bad in his tenure. I realize he is the CEO but sometimes things happen. Perfect example is Peter Sirmon. On paper he was identical to Arnett. I’m sure he interviewed well also. So do I blame Mullen on the catastrophe of the 2016 defense? Not really. Sirmon didn’t work out and was let go immediately.
Mullen was a good to Great coach for us at MSU. HE beat the teams he was supposed to, and won more consistently than anyone since McKeen.
But he has/had his flaws.
He thought he was way better than he was.
He was constantly looking for the next step up, to the detriment of the end of our season.
He didn't know how to coach the Big Game.
He didn't always play the best players
He hated Recruiting
To me the Irony of him looking around would have taken care of itself if he'd addressed his other weaknesses.
If he doesn't let the team play with so much emotion at Bama in 2016 and vs Ole Miss that year, he's in the playoff and would have had his pick of jobs without looking around.
If he'd been taught the Leach system of being the CEO and letting his Chief of Staff run the things he didn't want to do, he could be a great coach.
Time will tell if his time off from UF will teach him that.
But he has/had his flaws.
He thought he was way better than he was.
He was constantly looking for the next step up, to the detriment of the end of our season.
He didn't know how to coach the Big Game.
He didn't always play the best players
He hated Recruiting
To me the Irony of him looking around would have taken care of itself if he'd addressed his other weaknesses.
If he doesn't let the team play with so much emotion at Bama in 2016 and vs Ole Miss that year, he's in the playoff and would have had his pick of jobs without looking around.
If he'd been taught the Leach system of being the CEO and letting his Chief of Staff run the things he didn't want to do, he could be a great coach.
Time will tell if his time off from UF will teach him that.
You just continually out your own ignorance my guy. I will try to help you one last time. I can't believe we are even having this argument (if you want to call it that) on an MSU message board. Google micromanaging. Then read the article. Mullen wouldn't make Knox or Hevesy play clearly better players, i.e. (that's from the Latin ID EST which means "which means") he wasn't micromanaging them, but quite the opposite. It is embarrassing that anyone with a college degree would need this spelled out for them. Please don't bandy about such ignorance while advertising your connection to MSU.
I just have to say Thank You to those I agree with and disagree with. Damn it feels good arguing college football again!
You have a great record at a place that’s traditionally hard to win at?
We aren’t really sure he has a college degree but trust me I’ve met a bunch of idiots with degrees.
"We". You're looking hard for an ally to latch onto in this thread, and I get that. You're being devastated. But not sure if @POTUS is the one in which you should entrust with that responsibility.
But hey, you two seem to have much in common.
All we have to do is wait for Mullen to cross the Croom Line, and they will come around. The Croom Line is the amount of time after a head coach leaves and all of the sudden people say he wasn’t that bad. Misguided or not. Judging by some of the threads this summer it’s right around 15 years.
The odd thing is that in these threads, NOBODY is claiming Mullen was a bad coach. Most agree he was awesome for us, all things considered. But if you say he wasn’t “teh b3st c04ch evarrr”, **** gets real.
He has some severe character flaws that he can’t seem to get past. And it’s kept him from being the legitimate best coach ever.
Croom is an inept human being who was even worse as a head coach. 15,000 years won’t change that.
I mean I don’t need an ally but I know 70% plus of the board thinks “goat gonna goat”.
So you do you man.
I’ve never said he was the best coach ever.
I’ve said he’s the best coach msu has ever had when you consider tenured success AT MSU.
That’s a fact. Can’t be argued intelligently.
You can’t do what Mullen did at MSU and be bad at your job.
Ehh I’d say McKeen, but i do understand you are talking about after the forward pass was invented.
That's why we got Pete Sirmon. They met at some or other clinic and he hired him because he didn't know any other options. Then Grantham called and told Dan "I'm gonna run your defense next year"
He always seems to struggle to make assistant hires, as many as there were.