Nothing is guaranteed. People are thinking the same thing after 2016. Elite never came.
Official PSU - Rutgers 2022 game thread
- Thread starter Tom McAndrew
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Nothing is guaranteed. People are thinking the same thing after 2016. Elite never came.
"elite" indeed never came- we may have been close from the late 60s until the mid 80s and most posters here never saw that, so I'm not sure where these expectations come from
I believe that CJF is our best bet- and that changing is as likely to be a disaster as it is to be a success
It came from Franklin. He said it. He’s not wrong either - Penn State can get there; just not likely with him as coach. Joe won two B1G championships his last decade at the school. Georgia wasn’t elite and then went and did it. Clemson too. High risk, high reward. Or, you be Georgia and Mark Richt.
By your own metrics, Joe would have never won those two B1G Championships in his last decade because you would have fired him before he was able to do it based on the performance of the team in the first few years of that decade.
Nah - the two NCs and ridiculous number of bowl wins and undefeated seasons buys you a really long leash. And the landscape has changed dramatically since the 90s even - talent is more consolidated and it’s a lot harder to win in the Big Ten. I wouldn’t have extended Franklin until the final season of his contract. He swindled PSU (rather, his agent did). We got got.
Georgia also has the luxury of being in the SEC East….not sure he would have had the same success in the West. Had we been in the Big West, we’d be having a totally different discussion right now. Clemson also has the luxury of being in the ACC.
Ah. Moving the goal posts. The last NC was 14 years before the 2000’s and the team was highly ranked and faltered at the end of the 97 and 99 seasons. But for the sake of argument you are ignoring some putrid seasons prior to 05 and 08.
If Joe were hired in 2000 I would have fired him by 2004. Joe never had a 10 year contract either. But, because of the nature of the sport, Joe didn’t win a NC in ‘68 or ‘69 - two years after being hired - and certainly could have.
Totally right. Like I said, 12 Team Playoff will change things again.
It also doesn’t account for the anti-PSU bias among poll voters. He had three undefeated teams (including back to back) WAY before then.
I don’t disagree with you. I also think the landscape of college football has changed dramatically. However, I think a large contingent of the PSU fan base has a bit of a double standard when evaluating Franklin. He has many of the same attributes that Joe had. He works tirelessly at recruiting, he’s a great ambassador for the school, he holds the players to a high standard off the field to be the best students and young men they can be, and he is loyal to them. Not every coach checks all those boxes. Full disclosure also. I probably would have let him go after Illinois last year, not give him an extension, but that’s what the school decided and we can’t change that. With that said, I think the staff has somewhat redeemed themselves with (hopefully) a 10-2 season and a good bowl game. The roster is full of young, promising talent. It should be fun. I personally get frustrated with some trying to constantly tear him down rather than support the program.
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At the time, not sure that Clemson believed that hiring Dabo was the key to becoming elite.
Effing BTN. I didn't get to see the whole game yesterday.
I set the DVR to record the replay at 2am.
Do I get the whole game? No, I get a 1/2 hour of the studio show and an abbreviated game.
I get that things were running behind, probably because of the volleyball match. But the freakin studio show runs like 10 times between Saturday night and Sunday morning. Could we not honestly cut one short of those studio shows and show the whole replay?
Guess I'm waiting for the BTN in 60 version to see all the plays
I set the DVR to record the replay at 2am.
Do I get the whole game? No, I get a 1/2 hour of the studio show and an abbreviated game.
I get that things were running behind, probably because of the volleyball match. But the freakin studio show runs like 10 times between Saturday night and Sunday morning. Could we not honestly cut one short of those studio shows and show the whole replay?
Guess I'm waiting for the BTN in 60 version to see all the plays
The key is ‘ACC’….
. Put Dabo at say South Carolina and I bet he still doesn’t have a NC.
Effing BTN. I didn't get to see the whole game yesterday.
I set the DVR to record the replay at 2am.
Do I get the whole game? No, I get a 1/2 hour of the studio show and an abbreviated game.
I get that things were running behind, probably because of the volleyball match. But the freakin studio show runs like 10 times between Saturday night and Sunday morning. Could we not honestly cut one short of those studio shows and show the whole replay?
Guess I'm waiting for the BTN in 60 version to see all the plays
Just watch this….
But the facts you provide are actually statistical outliers relative to the number of coaching changes that have occurred since 2000 . Using you premise of a four year window more programs dud not win a NC changing coaches than those that did.
There s good question. I think a lot of it has to do with program and athletic dept.
The best football team in big ten is Ohio State over the last 20 years. They probably have the best program and the best athletic dept.
If you're talking about athletic departments, our wresting dominance > Ohio State football. You have to throw in Women's volleyball and soccer as well if you're going back 20 years.
I personally get frustrated with some trying to constantly tear him down rather than support the program.
you know no wins or losses are cause we post, right?
you know no wins or losses are cause we post, right?
Couple things - I said if you’re gonna win one, it will likely be within four years. I did not say you *will* win one within four years. Only one team a year can win. And - coaches with subsequent wins still exist (Saban, Dabo) and they can still win too. The true outliers are coaches who won a NC and took longer than four years to do it.
Yep. But the wear on a program from a faction the fan base and alumni trying to tear down the coach is real. Especially when the team is winning and people still find reasons to criticize. Seems foolish.
It just comes down to beating Rutgers or competing for the 10. I’m a compete for the 10 guy. Ya know what, I bet you a c note so is james
So, you think this coaching staff is satisfied and isn’t trying to get better? I don’t get your sarcastic point?
I think he’s saying that certain fans are satisfied and don’t care about getting better.
My point is so many here don’t share your champion’s goals and criticize us who do.
james wants a 10
i want a 10
bw wants a 10
most want to beat Rutgers and are cool with goose eggs with the big boys
The Rick class of 86
But his previous point was that nothing we say matters. So does it matter or not? All that really matters, I suppose, is that the coaching staff cares about getting better, no? Has the team gotten better over the course of the season? Has the team improved over last year? Has the OL and DL looked better? Has the run game improved? Have the freshmen looked promising for future success? Again, it bothers me that despite all of this, people (after blowout wins no less) find reasons to ***** and moan. It isn’t about being satisfied. It’s about supporting the possibility of getting further ahead through hard work and perseverance. How many times did Joe say we are only 1 player away or 1 play away from being really good? We all took him at his word. But if Franklin said this, many would say he is making excuses. He just can’t win with some. To my previous point, this is a double standard for Franklin. Under the same circumstances, were the same folks trying to tear Joepa down? I’ll answer it for you…no they were not. Everyone bit their lip and sat on their hands.
With respect, you need to move on from joe, he hung in 15 years too long and imo put us in this chronic 3rd in the east
Completely agree. That what is baffling from my perspective. Fair warning, you will get flak for saying that. I have in the past. Joe should have retired, at the very latest, after ‘08, but probably much sooner.
No one is helping the future of STATE football by referencing joes career.
Tell that to the old timers who can’t move on and are constantly comparing Franklin to him. I do it to play devil’s advocate. Not because I’m looking in the rear view mirror and longing for the good ole days. I’m all for moving forward. If that means at some point, they have to move on from Franklin, then so be it. However, barring something unforeseeable happening, he’s here for awhile, so some better get used to it and look at some positives instead of all negatives.
Joe had proven success to fans - should have had probably three more NCs than he did. Also should have hung it up around 2000. People think Franklin is full of it, mostly because he’s shown he has the players to compete with OSU and Michigan yet finds ways to lose. People happy with 10-2 love Franklin. Those who think we can do better don’t. Ultimately, it doesn’t matter what we say. Franklin is locked in and no matter what he does will get every penny of his ridiculous contract.
Not being a Franklin fan but supporting the team/program are not mutually exclusive thoughts. I’d certainly rather win than lose, but also care about beating the teams that matter when it matters. We have a less successful Mark Richt. Is what it is.
Agree he hung on too long, but Franklin has had ample time to change program trajectory. His recruiting classes are much, much better on average than Joe’s ever were. He’s just done nothing with them. Pete Carroll led USC to two NCs in his first four years.
And once again, no one wants to lose to Michigan and Ohio State consistently, but complaining about 10-2 doesn’t accomplish much. Especially when it appears that PSU has some stud freshman at key positions and may be pretty good in the next several years. As others have said, only Dabo, Day, Saban, Smart, and perhaps Riley are considered elite coaches. Everyone else is chasing them.
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