Some proper perspective Franklin haters....
- Thread starter saturdaysarebetter
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Given PSU's budget, both could be "elite" ... as in making and competing in the CFB playoffs. Both would also put a better football product on the field....you know, demanding that your defensive players actually hit the offensive opponent and not arm tackle.
It's usually the small details that separate "elite" teams for "above average"
Small details.....like pay the best players and get as many 5 star recruits as you can. We know the recipe for "CONSISTENT" success at the very top and it helps when you load the roster up like UGa, tOSU, Bama, LSU.....etc. That is the main ingredient for long term success, recruit the best players. The same teams that are consistently in the top 5 in recruiting tend to do better over the long haul. I'm surprised you didn't put Golden down either.
LSU wanted Kelly, they went out and got him.
Bama wanted Saban, they went out and got him.
tOSU went after Meyer, they went out and got him.
USC wanted Riley, took him from OU.
PSU, let's hope for a Joe legacy coach or some late riser, but then complain about not being elite or winning the big games. PSU doesn't even have an opening, nor a HC on the host seat, and the best we can do is Rhule????? Way to aim high and reach for the stars in a completely hypothetical coaching search because this is pure fantasy by disgruntled fans.
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The total buyouts, both sides, in all of those cases was less than Franklin's. Minor detail..Small details.....like pay the best players and get as many 5 star recruits as you can. We know the recipe for "CONSISTENT" success at the very top and it helps when you load the roster up like UGa, tOSU, Bama, LSU.....etc. That is the main ingredient for long term success, recruit the best players. The same teams that are consistently in the top 5 in recruiting tend to do better over the long haul. I'm surprised you didn't put Golden down either.
LSU wanted Kelly, they went out and got him.
Bama wanted Saban, they went out and got him.
tOSU went after Meyer, they went out and got him.
USC wanted Riley, took him from OU.
PSU, let's hope for a Joe legacy coach or some late riser, but then complain about not being elite or winning the big games. PSU doesn't even have an opening, nor a HC on the host seat, and the best we can do is Rhule????? Way to aim high and reach for the stars in a completely hypothetical coaching search because this is pure fantasy by disgruntled fans.
Penn State will retain Franklin as long as the stadium continues to be sold out.
PSU isn’t actually looking for a coach which is a minor detail as well. Since this is pure fiction currently the bar could be a bit higher than Rhule? I mean why not go big in fantasy land coaching search?
If you're happy with 8-5, 9-4, 10-3, or even 11-2.....knock yourself out embracing "less than elite". My records reflect Franklins generally dismal bowl record and a prediction of more.fans.
The B1G gave PSU a ****** schedule in 2024 so I've already lowered my expectations that Franklin won't be in a field of 16 teams in November.
You’re not happy because of something else and you made that clear a long time ago. Some of us remember.
Rhule is less than elite. There is no opening so go bigger. Maybe call for Joe’s resurrection? Clearly my bar is higher than yours in this fantasy coaching search.
Stadium sells out, no coaching search.
The Franklin Fanatics always fall back on the same thing. Your predictable schtick is getting old.
Nobody is a fanboy fanatic of JF. Some of us just don’t live in fantasy land where coaches coming off of back to back 10 win seasons and NYD6 bowl games are fired. Ranked in the top 12 6 of the last 8 years too. The reality is he needs to take another step but his job isn’t in jeopardy. If he starts only winning 7-8 a year, the stadium will show it and you can rejoice. I’m kind of hoping they have a great year, but you do you.
I don’t root against coaches or teams I like just to be “right” about an opinion. The next thread you see me start proclaiming him the best coach will be the first. I don’t and never have idolized coaches, but some folks do. That’s fine.
No one here has ever said that CJF is the greatest coach- not that I've read anyway. But we have a few here who never miss an opportunity to trash him about anything that can be perceived as negative regarding PSU. Several of them will also insist that they aren't "haters" when they so clearly can't ever give him credit for anything.
It's that hypocrisy that is annoying, not their opinions. since none of our opinions weigh much anyway.
Yeah the absolute hypocrisy is the worst. You can only talk about the losses or 2 games a year. You cannot talk about the bowl wins, just the losses. You can only talk about the plays that failed or how great some other team/coach is. How dare anyone bring up his whole resume?
I could understand it if PSU were Bama, tOSU, or a school that was competing for MNC's in the last 30 years, but.....newsflash that isn't where PSU has been. If he wins 10+ again this year you can go back and look to see how often PSU has done that 3 years in a row. I get the frustration as some of us have seen PSU at the top, but look in the mirror....times have changed. Anyone that really saw the last MNC and remembers it is pushing 50 at the bare minimum.
I've grown tired of the topic because NOBODY is starting Hooray JF threads and a one poster in particular did JF is poopoo over and over and over again the last few months and now wants to pretend anyone calling him out on it is the bad guy, GTFOH with that and then will cry like he is some victim. They want to keep starting this stupid trash debate and I'll keep responding. Nobody here is protecting JF or keeping him hired. Just like none of these repetitive threads are getting him fired. I just want PSU to win and he is the HC who has been doing a decent job....crazy opinion on for a few to hear I know. It's outlandish and over the top.
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I encourage you to use the search function freely available on this board and type in my moniker in the "user name" space and "Franklin" in the "search" space. Go through all 10 pages of posts and find something that even comes close to your intimated accusations. You will be sadly disappointed.
It takes a rather pathetic and fundamentally unhappy person to keep casting false accusations against others. As the Wal-Mart greeter at our local store used to exclaim .... "Have a Blessed Day".
On "ignore" you go.
Put up or shut up Franklin Fan Boy. It's that simple.
I encourage you to use the search function freely available on this board and type in my moniker in the "user name" space and "Franklin" in the "search" space. Go through all 10 pages of posts and find something that even comes close to your intimated accusations. You will be sadly disappointed.
It takes a rather pathetic and fundamentally unhappy person to keep casting false accusations against others. As the Wal-Mart greeter at our local store used to exclaim .... "Have a Blessed Day".
On "ignore" you go.
Franklin is excellent at many things. Better than most in many. Game day coaching is not one of them. If I didn’t care about winning I’d name him coach for life.
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Way to aim high and reach for the stars in a completely hypothetical coaching search because this is pure fantasy by disgruntled fans and I’m cool with 8-4.
Many PSU posters will never admit PSU isn't a top 5 job but that's reality. I think that's part of why so many whine about Franklin, thinking we can just go out and hire whoever we want and will somehow get the best coach in the country.
If I'm the best coach in the land and am objectively looking for places where I have the proper things in place to win titles, it's not PSU at the top. If I'm subjectively looking at places I want to live, it's also not PSU at the top. PSU isn't for everyone and never will be as there are things working against us that are not controllable or changeable.
We can control supporting those that to their job well, seem to love what PSU has to offer, and seem to want to stick around and improve the elements of the program that they can control to maximize what PSU is capable of achieving. Franklin checks those boxes. PSU will be better off long term for what Franklin has done, and is doing in State College, regardless of who coaches in the future.
A lot of truth to what you typed but some want to pretend there is some other alternate reality of where PSU has been for 3 decades. You see if you take the entire coaching field and say ANY coach is a better game day coach as a matter of fact, it sounds great but it's pretty hollow since you don't really know that or prove it. There aren't a lot of middle of the road teams tearing it up against Bama, UGa, tOSU etc....aka the real top 5 teams every year.
You can also hide behind the straw man of wanting to "win more" than other people. It's an anthill podium to stand on but some love being on it. Folks that tend to be on the message boards are watching every game in person or on TV, haven't missed one in years, and all pretty much like winning more than losing...I think that is a safe bet...........but if you say fire coach it clearly means you want to win more, it just does and they'll tell you over and over again. I don't think anyone here is happy with the record versus the top 5, but some of us look around and say what is the norm against the top 5....clearly there must be some vast majority tearing it up against the top 5.......only to find out that isn't true. So it's basically back to people just being frustrated they cannot thump their chests really.
Man if only JF and KW matched up recently head to head, clearly we could see which one is the better HC? That other group of coaches is like basically saying anyone but JF because NONE are top 10 head coaches nor have they been anywhere, never mind elite which I thought was the end game here. I honestly don't think any coach 12am listed would recruit well enough to compete where PSU is at currently.
Anyone who thinks James plays 9 meaningless games a year against cupcakes ought to go look at the schedule we played when we were independent and Joe Paterno was the coach. I don't think they are going to find a meat grinder schedule most years when Joe was racking up wins.
This is absolutely true but how many undefeated seasons did Joe have? Bowl wins? Wins against ranked teams? Joes first 10-20 years were incredible.
So I assume you were screaming for Joe to be let go for close to 25 years, since he coached for 46 and Penn State has done a lot better the last 7 years than they did the last 10 years with Paterno. That's not even debatable.
Franklin didn't inherit what the program was in 1995. He got the 2014 version, and it was a pretty big mess.
So, were you screaming for Paterno to be fired in the 2000s or are you a hypocrite?
Yes. I was. Noting he did win two B1G championships in his last 10 years as HC, so where this last seven years Franklin being better than Joe’s last 10 nonsense is coming from I have no idea. Paterno certainly makes a 4 team playoff in 2005 too.
Have to remember expectations his last decade were seriously low. He didn’t set foot on the recruiting trail, had classes ranked in the 20’s - 30’s, was super loyal to his staff, and was pushing academics hard. And still, he would outperform expectations. Franklin has elevated our recruiting but can’t get over the hump.
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Perspective. Joe was great for a lot of years, but we tend to have selective memories and delusions of grandeur about him at times. Joe was 13-33 vs Top 5 opponents over 46 years.
Penn State Football: a look back at the Nittany Lions’ struggles against top 5 opponents over the years
After the loss at Michigan, we took a look back at Penn State Football's (mostly) unsuccessful history against top five competition.
victorybellrings.com
Perspective. Joe was great for a lot of years, but we tend to have selective memories and delusions of grandeur about him at times. Joe was 13-33 vs Top 5 opponents over 46 years.
Penn State Football: a look back at the Nittany Lions’ struggles against top 5 opponents over the years
After the loss at Michigan, we took a look back at Penn State Football's (mostly) unsuccessful history against top five competition.
Not really delusions when you win two National Championships in a span of five years. Sure - never quite captured the magic again but definitely robbed in ‘94 and pick any of the other undefeated seasons to make a case for other shots at a NC.
As for record against top five teams, Paterno’s win percentage is about 26%. Franklin’s is about 11%. If he was at or near 25% we probably make two playoff appearances the past decade.
You conveniently cherry pick things. Read the whole article and take it all in. What was Paterno’s record vs Top 5 teams in his first 10 years? 1-9. He didn’t get a second win against a Top 5 team until his 13th season. Joe was fantastic, but the numbers don’t lie. Again, we get it. You hate Franklin. You yell it from the mountain top on a daily basis. Point taken.
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His vast reservoir of football knowledge has led him to deduce that PSU'S inability to dominate college football is due to arm tackling.
I like Matt Rhule. Good coach. Good guy. But has anyone made more money with less success?
I don’t hate Franklin. He’s just not a good coach and comparing him - as you and others try/fail to do - to Paterno is pointless (and a disservice to Franklin). Joe did less with more his last ten years than Franklin has done with top class after top class his first ten. Franklin lost bowl games to Kentucky, Arkansas, Ole Miss, and USC (with his best team ever). Franklin’s best bowl win is what - Utah? Without their QB? Maybe Washington? Ok, fine.
Stop commenting if you don’t like the responses. What was Paterno’s record vs Top 25 teams his first ten years?
“Joe did less with more his last ten years” ??? You might want to rewrite that to fit your narrative better.
Maybe YOU should stop commenting if you don’t like the responses.
Run the average recruiting class rankings for
Joe and Franklin for Joe’s last 10 years; it’s not close (I’ve run them - will find and share for you later). Also check Joe’s OC (checks notes - his kid) versus the wunderkinds Franklin overpaid and blamed for his in game shortcomings. Again, two B1G Championships and he would have had a four team playoff birth in 2005 in Paterno’s dismal final years at Penn State.
From @leinbacker :
From 1966-1986, in every 4 years, Paterno's teams either went undefeated or played for the MNC.
Perhaps you should offer your services to Franklin as the volunteer small details coach. LOL
Please note. Every game PSU wins with HC Franklin is a meaningless game. The game is only meaningful when PSU and Franklin coached team loses. Not only are those games meaningful, but Franklin is solely responsible because of his "game day" coaching. It's a simple formula developed by simple fanboys.